Eastie Posted June 3, 2018 Share Posted June 3, 2018 4 minutes ago, TRO said: **** me I have had my concerns and listed them, but if you are asking me to condemn him for everything that he has done.....that's ridiculous in my book. Fair comment , there is no doubt he improved the club in some ways and turned us around to a degree - ultimately he failed to achieve what he was recruited to do and as such needs to go . 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eastie Posted June 3, 2018 Share Posted June 3, 2018 (edited) 6 minutes ago, VillanousOne said: We probably only remember and obsess over the games where we didn't win, where our tactics harmed our performance, but ultimately I don't think even the biggest Bruce fans would agree we naturally play fast flowing attacking football by default. As probably covered on here many times, most don't expect us to be Barcelona, attacking football doesn't always guarantee you points. But I can't remember a conversation coming up where someone said 'if only we hadn't played that extra striker' or 'if only we hadn't dropped our holding midfielder' i've never seen a discussion on this board that people have got angry for us being too attacking. Which tells me that for the players/squad we have and the times we failed to beat teams like Bolton, the majority of frustrations are probably justified. But it's been a fine line. Indeed. The line between success and failure is a very fine one . ‘I would love to have seen Bruce succeed last week and walk to the fans with that trophy - sadly it wasn’t to be and that one game could define our future for many years . ‘However it’s not like we can say we got so close so let’s add a couple and keep the squad together - this season was the big chance and that team will be torn apart this summer , 4 have gone already and no doubt more will follow . ‘A rethink is needed and a new manager at the helm with new ideas . Edited June 3, 2018 by Eastie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted June 3, 2018 Share Posted June 3, 2018 4 hours ago, Eastie said: Both good players but I doubt they are gettable for us now . a great pity Bruce used a large chunk of available cash on hogan who in no way seemed to fit in with his game plan or playing style , Hindsight is great. Brian Little bought sasa curcic... and I felt it necessary to defend him at the Villa Leisure centre one night, the night before he resigned, if I remember right. They all booed....I got up in my usual, emphatic manner and said ......Tell me the man that wouldn't have signed him.....Not one fan got up.....and to my surprise, I got a bit of applause. That was not what, I was looking for....I was looking for ,Fair play. We are all ****ing pissed off....but we will be back.....and the only thing that will get us back is good decisions. Other teams have made them and players not as good as ours on paper, but we will learn and the day will come.....names on paper, will never get us to where we want to go......and they didn't in 1982 either, but my god , they could impose themselves....many teams since, have left me , er unsure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eastie Posted June 3, 2018 Share Posted June 3, 2018 1 minute ago, TRO said: Hindsight is great. Brian Little bought sasa curcic... and I felt it necessary to defend him at the Villa Leisure centre one night, the night before he resigned, if I remember right. They all booed....I got up in my usual, emphatic manner and said ......Tell me the man that wouldn't have signed him.....Not one fan got up.....and to my surprise, I got a bit of applause. That was not what, I was looking for....I was looking for ,Fair play. We are all ****ing pissed off....but we will be back.....and the only thing that will get us back is good decisions. Other teams have made them and players not as good as ours on paper, but we will learn and the day will come.....names on paper, will never get us to where we want to go......and they didn't in 1982 either, but my god , they could impose themselves....many teams since, have left me , er unsure. Whatever your opinions on Bruce you come across as a bloody decent man of passion and pride in your club - it’s a shame some of our players lack that passion and heart Tro . i raise my glass to you sir ! 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted June 3, 2018 Share Posted June 3, 2018 6 minutes ago, Eastie said: Fair comment , there is no doubt he improved the club in some ways and turned us around to a degree - ultimately he failed to achieve what he was recruited to do and as such needs to go . But Eastie, does he need to go? I am not certain he does. In my view, things in the shape of the team , was wrong.....all the coaching, I think is Bollox......That is not saying they were bad players. Is that Steve Brucess fault?.....I would have to say, yes....but I am tempering that, with all what he did right...sometimes jobs are not always completed in their timescale, he too may be having second thoughts. If i was the owner, I would have to hear his take on it.....before I made my final conclusion. The discussion between Steve Bruce and Tony Xia will conclude where we go, next season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tomaszk Posted June 3, 2018 Share Posted June 3, 2018 8 minutes ago, TRO said: We are all ****ing pissed off....but we will be back... Not under Steve Bruce we won't. Football has changed. The same few clubs will 95% of every competition for the next 20 years. Maybe we've got a chance of a cup in that time. This is why I want to enjoy watching us. I want to appreciate sitting there and watching us play football. That will not happen under Bruce. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eastie Posted June 3, 2018 Share Posted June 3, 2018 1 minute ago, TRO said: But Eastie, does he need to go? I am not certain he does. In my view, things in the shape of the team , was wrong.....all the coaching, I think is Bollox......That is not saying they were bad players. Is that Steve Brucess fault?.....I would have to say, yes....but I am tempering that, with all what he did right...sometimes jobs are not always completed in their timescale, he too may be having second thoughts. If i was the owner, I would have to hear his take on it.....before I made my final conclusion. The discussion between Steve Bruce and Tony Xia will conclude where we go, next season. Were we not in this financial position and if he could keep the squad together and add a couple than I’d agree with you , but we need to see major changes as xia has said and the team at Wembley will be ripped apart , 4 have gone already , therefore we need to look at a new policy where youth will play a big part and that is not of Bruce’s strengths . i think it is best for all concerned that a change takes place now as if Bruce stays I can see it ending in tears pretty early in the new season . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted June 3, 2018 Share Posted June 3, 2018 8 minutes ago, Eastie said: Whatever your opinions on Bruce you come across as a bloody decent man of passion and pride in your club - it’s a shame some of our players lack that passion and heart Tro . i raise my glass to you sir ! I don't think our players lack passion.....I think some of our players lack the ability to be physical. I was very,very close to Andy Gray, in my youth.....I know what passionate play is all about.....Dion Dublin, Peter withe, Keith Leonard.....do I need to go on. We have some very good forward players, for me.....inside forwards. very good goalscorers on the floor, poor leaders of the line and not very good in the air. Someone just said to me in the pub....you should tell, steve Bruce.....I said are you having a laugh, on the money, they are on. We can't tell them what to do....but by christ, they frigthen me at times. Warnock, makes me laugh......I think on the whole, he gets what its all about....even though he doesn't play expansive football. Read his books guys, he is not what you think he is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Talldarkandransome Posted June 3, 2018 Share Posted June 3, 2018 Prior to last week, why would Bruce think he needed to change his ways when they have worked over and over again, especially to get out of this league. Maybe his first failure using this approach will be seen by him as a need to evolve a little. I'm happy for him to stay, mainly for the way he has changed Villa from a total and complete shambles to a half decent team (whatever will be left of it). People forget very quickly how shocking we were, for years. That shambles can't change overnight, it takes time and patience to succeed and without the ability to pump millions into it because of FFP it adds more time to that. Apart from the style of football I think he has been ok, some great games and some cracking atmospheres that I hadn't seen since MON. Anyone who watches Man U at the moment will realise it ain't just Villa who play negative "don't lose" football. Take this disappointment on the chin and get on with it. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eastie Posted June 3, 2018 Share Posted June 3, 2018 (edited) 6 minutes ago, TRO said: I don't think our players lack passion.....I think some of our players lack the ability to be physical. I was very,very close to Andy Gray, in my youth.....I know what passionate play is all about.....Dion Dublin, Peter withe, Keith Leonard.....do I need to go on. We have some very good forward players, for me.....inside forwards. very good goalscorers on the floor, poor leaders of the line and not very good in the air. Someone just said to me in the pub....you should tell, steve Bruce.....I said are you having a laugh, on the money, they are on. We can't tell them what to do....but by christ, they frigthen me at times. Warnock, makes me laugh......I think on the whole, he gets what its all about....even though he doesn't play expansive football. Read his books guys, he is not what you think he is. It was me who told you about his book you old rascal the passion comment was aimed more at the likes of Ross and Micah . Edited June 3, 2018 by Eastie 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted June 3, 2018 Share Posted June 3, 2018 11 minutes ago, Tomaszk said: Not under Steve Bruce we won't. Football has changed. The same few clubs will 95% of every competition for the next 20 years. Maybe we've got a chance of a cup in that time. This is why I want to enjoy watching us. I want to appreciate sitting there and watching us play football. That will not happen under Bruce. Football has changed since 1910. The reference, means naff all. Football has changed every decade and still we are doing the some of the same things that we did, A 100 years ago. So cut the generalisations... and say what you mean. The grass, is still the same colour, The pitch, within parameters is still the same size despite the speed of the game, The goals is still the same size. say what you really mean. Oh and by the way....................The teams with not the very best players have to find a way of competing. That happened 100 years ago too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eastie Posted June 3, 2018 Share Posted June 3, 2018 8 minutes ago, Talldarkandransome said: Prior to last week, why would Bruce think he needed to change his ways when they have worked over and over again, especially to get out of this league. Maybe his first failure using this approach will be seen by him as a need to evolve a little. I'm happy for him to stay, mainly for the way he has changed Villa from a total and complete shambles to a half decent team (whatever will be left of it). People forget very quickly how shocking we were, for years. That shambles can't change overnight, it takes time and patience to succeed and without the ability to pump millions into it because of FFP it adds more time to that. Apart from the style of football I think he has been ok, some great games and some cracking atmospheres that I hadn't seen since MON. Anyone who watches Man U at the moment will realise it ain't just Villa who play negative "don't lose" football. Take this disappointment on the chin and get on with it. If we were keeping that team together then maybe I’d agree with giving him another chance but it will be a different team with several changes and I think he’s blown his chance. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted June 3, 2018 Share Posted June 3, 2018 4 minutes ago, Eastie said: It was me who told you about his book you old rascal the passion comment was aimed more at the likes of Ross and Micah . Eastie...I can't remember and I am sorry for that. The books were brilliant and do I get sucked in to everything people write , no of course I don;t. But this guy, Is very misunderstood in my book.....and more importantly a bloody good manager. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eastie Posted June 3, 2018 Share Posted June 3, 2018 2 minutes ago, TRO said: Eastie...I can't remember and I am sorry for that. The books were brilliant and do I get sucked in to everything people write , no of course I don;t. But this guy, Is very misunderstood in my book.....and more importantly a bloody good manager. In your book or his book ? Where can I get your book Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Keyblade Posted June 3, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted June 3, 2018 31 minutes ago, Jareth said: It’s quite difficult to argue with isn’t it? Not really. Just because we scored 72 goals doesn't mean we weren't defensively minded. One glance at the playoff final would tell you who was the offensive-minded team and who was the defensive-minded one, despite scoring a similar amount of goals. The spending figures are misleading because it doesn't take into account the wages we were offering, which blows other teams in this division out of the water. It's a selective stat that makes it seem like we were on a shoestring budget when in reality we had the type of backing that enticed the likes of John Terry and Robert Snodgrass despite the nominal initial outlay on them. Also, I hate to break it to Alex...but a playoff final loss in 18 months is a failure. A vast improvement yes (which is what he is describing), but not an overall success unfortunately. 10 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Talldarkandransome Posted June 3, 2018 Share Posted June 3, 2018 9 minutes ago, Eastie said: If we were keeping that team together then maybe I’d agree with giving him another chance but it will be a different team with several changes and I think he’s blown his chance. We still need stability, regardless of people saying they want him out etc etc. As soon as a new one comes in they will be under huge pressure from the start and one bad result at the start of the season will bring the hatchets out again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted June 3, 2018 Share Posted June 3, 2018 4 minutes ago, Eastie said: In your book or his book ? Where can I get your book you cheeky monkey. Look, I am emphatic in my thoughts and am Sure of what I write.....but I am also aware that there are some bloomin good writers on this site, who have alternative views Some of them.......yeah sensible posts and we all know who they are, are well worth considering. In my view, what went wrong was only just.....but we have to sensibly analyse that.....Newcastle and Brighton went up the season before with Huddersfield in the play offs..Fulham were left behind.....They signed Mitrovic and in my view, perfect type..and bingo. Its not about getting good players.......its about getting the RIGHT players. A winning team is about balance. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eastie Posted June 3, 2018 Share Posted June 3, 2018 2 minutes ago, Keyblade said: Not really. Just because we scored 72 goals doesn't mean we weren't defensively minded. One glance at the playoff final would tell you who was the offensive-minded team and who was the defensive-minded one, despite scoring a similar amount of goals. The spending figures are misleading because it doesn't take into account the wages we were offering, which blows other teams in this division out of the water. It's a selective stat that makes it seem like we were on a shoestring budget when in reality we had the type of backing that enticed the likes of John Terry and Robert Snodgrass despite the nominal initial outlay on them. Also, I hate to break it to Alex...but a playoff final loss in 18 months is a failure. A vast improvement yes (which is what he is describing), but not an overall success unfortunately. Also we spent heavily in the previous january window when we brought in 8 players and were told the club were doing a lot of business at that time to get players settled in and we wouldn’t be doing too much business in the summer so Bruce spent a lot of his budget that january knowing that was the case . ‘He May say he spent £2.5m in the summer but he did have the best part of £20m in that previous January window 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eastie Posted June 3, 2018 Share Posted June 3, 2018 3 minutes ago, Talldarkandransome said: We still need stability, regardless of people saying they want him out etc etc. As soon as a new one comes in they will be under huge pressure from the start and one bad result at the start of the season will bring the hatchets out again. Stability only works if you have the right man - if you don’t have the right man then you don’t keep him for stability. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Talldarkandransome Posted June 3, 2018 Share Posted June 3, 2018 2 minutes ago, Eastie said: Stability only works if you have the right man - if you don’t have the right man then you don’t keep him for stability. Fair point, I just don't know who can replace him. Derby have taken a massive risk which I personally think will end in failure so I would avoid that route and what experienced manager will be attracted to us. I don't know why we should stick with Bruce but I don't want to start again..... Again... I would take Eddie Howe in a heartbeat but the last time he left Bournemouth he went back to Bournemouth 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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