Refugee crisis

[Shomin Geki]

I didn't join this forum to make enemies, but I do strongly question the clear difference between the posts of, for example, HanoiVillain (outstanding posts) and Omariqy with their consideration, empathy, research and political literacy, against the petulance and ignorance of other contributors.  That map, for example, with the big arrow, kinda fails to mention the two million or so Syrians who have abandoned this veritable stairway to milk and honey and jumped of in sunny neighbouring Turkey.

I have very strong feelings regarding humanitarian assistance, self-interested media chauvinism, global inequality and obfuscated historical legacies.  I also care a great deal about fairness, justice, good governance and economic coherency.  The Syrian Crisis doesn't present a ledger of neat ticks on my to-do-list.  It's complex.  It's tough.  So, despite my strong feelings and reasonable knowledge, I've kept out so far.  Because I need to think about this more.  And research it more.  I would hope others would offer the same service in honour of plainly horrendous circumstances.  That people  practically endow themselves with the license to 'say what they feel' is disturbing in itself.

There may be no easy answers.  But there are smarter questions.  And quite frankly, smarter smartness.  Please contribute constructively.  I will try when I know enough.

[maqroll]

Cool yer heels there governor, we're on a football forum not in a lecture hall taking notes

[Marka Ragnos]

I didn't join this forum to make enemies, but I do strongly question the clear difference between the posts of, for example, HanoiVillain (outstanding posts) and Omariqy with their consideration, empathy, research and political literacy, against the petulance and ignorance of other contributors. 

...  Please contribute constructively.  I will try when I know enough.

So HanoiVillain and Omariqy are great and the rest of us suck, and you're so delicately sensitive and wise, you're waiting until you "know enough" to grace this sacred forum with a Post of Depth.

Does this mean I can't joke post about farts? 

[NurembergVillan]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NJQ1a0Cmsk4

Safe in germany but still not very happy, i wonder why, no halal food?

Given that Turkish is the largest ethnic minority in Germany I'd suggest it's unlikely there's a lack of halal meat.

Ill-informed racial stereotyping FTL

Edited September 8, 2015 by NurembergVillan

[sexbelowsound]

To be honest all that map does to me is show where they would like to end up in an ideal situation.

I mean if you are looking to start a better, safer life, Why not go to the places where you think you are likely to get the best chance possible.

[Shaw_nuff]

The real shit will hit the fan when Europe's money finally runs out (not long now). No one will want to come here then anyway.

It smells a bit like the last days of Rome where sportsmen were paid astronomical fees and chefs became celebs as all the Goths, Vandals etc. descended - just to keep the plebs entertained.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gaius_Appuleius_Diocles

[chrisp65]

The real shit will hit the fan when Europe's money finally runs out (not long now). No one will want to come here then anyway.

It smells a bit like the last days of Rome where sportsmen were paid astronomical fees and chefs became celebs as all the Goths, Vandals etc. descended - just to keep the plebs entertained.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gaius_Appuleius_Diocles

 

 

2008 phoned, it wants it's doomsday scenario back.

Population of EU currently stands at approx 510 million, europe as a whole at 750 million. Frankly, if 1 million, 2 million, 3 million refugees and migrants on foot can take that down, they deserve it.

Edited September 8, 2015 by chrisp65
not sure where choffer and omariqy quotes came from! it's all going wrong!

[Shaw_nuff]

The real shit will hit the fan when Europe's money finally runs out (not long now). No one will want to come here then anyway.

It smells a bit like the last days of Rome where sportsmen were paid astronomical fees and chefs became celebs as all the Goths, Vandals etc. descended - just to keep the plebs entertained.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gaius_Appuleius_Diocles

 

 

2008 phoned, it wants it's doomsday scenario back.

Population of EU currently stands at approx 510 million, europe as a whole at 750 million. Frankly, if 1 million, 2 million, 3 million refugees and migrants on foot can take that down, they deserve it.

What has that got to do with my post?

 

Edited September 8, 2015 by Shaw_nuff

[Shaw_nuff]

Oh, and please inform me what was fixed in 2008 that didn't involve printing extortionate amounts of money out of thin air.. I'm all ears

[chrisp65]

aye, not sure what happened with those other two quotes - and now I can't get rid of them

it was more a comment on your prophecy of the end of europe

oh, and nothing was 'fixed' in 2008, what was established was the current understanding of money and debt was even more abstract than we'd imagined. The banks had no money, but it didn't really matter, turned out they'd never really had any, so we pretended to get some more to help them out, now we have to pretend to pay that back - with new loans

but again, it was really just a comment on excitable doomsday stuff 

[sharkyvilla]

Anyway I think taking refugees directly from Syria whilst increasing aid to provide better conditions in the camps around Syria is probably the best policy we could have chosen.  Preferably we would be sending troops over there to at least provide and protect safe areas for people to try and rebuild their lives.  How we deal with Assad though, **** knows.

[Shaw_nuff]

aye, not sure what happened with those other two quotes - and now I can't get rid of them

it was more a comment on your prophecy of the end of europe

oh, and nothing was 'fixed' in 2008, what was established was the current understanding of money and debt was even more abstract than we'd imagined. The banks had no money, but it didn't really matter, turned out they'd never really had any, so we pretended to get some more to help them out, now we have to pretend to pay that back - with new loans

but again, it was really just a comment on excitable doomsday stuff 

So you don't think Europe is a basket case then?

There's nothing abstract about it - debt is money. The more people debt slaves you have, the more money you can borrow into existence. There's a debt limit and it's around the corner. Greece was just a warning.

I don't know if it is strictly a doomsday scenario anyway - the banking system as it stands will collapse, it's inevitable - that could be a good thing to reset the whole system and start again, or it could go all Mad Max. But things will have to change.

Anyway, my original point was that got buried is that immigration is a symptom, not the cause.

[snowychap]

To be honest all that map does to me is show where they would like to end up in an ideal situation.

In which case why have 'benefits' plastered all over certain parts of northern europe? (Don't France and Spain have welfare systems, too?)

It wasn't just to 'show where they would like to end up'.

I mean if you are looking to start a better, safer life, Why not go to the places where you think you are likely to get the best chance possible.

That I agree with - that's probably why the vast majority are looking to get to Germany where they believe they are going to be more welcomed and have a better chance (because of the public pronouncements of their politicians for the main).

Prior to the recent few months, though, the UNCHR's figures for asylum applications for Syrians from April 2011 to July 2015 have Germany, Syria and then Serbia (and Kosovo) receiving about 213 thousand of the 348 thousand.

 

[MakemineVanilla]

[StefanAVFC]

https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/106477

My head hurts. Over 100,000 people.

[lapal_fan]

https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/106477

My head hurts. Over 100,000 people.

Worryingly retarded isn't it?

I guarantee most of those people read the mail.

[Eames]

I hate people

[StefanAVFC]

ALL IMMIGRATION

WE WILL BE A MUSLIM COUNTRY

FOREIGNERS ARE TAKING OUR BENEFITS

Buzzwords.

[sexbelowsound]

**** me. What is going on in the world where you can actually find that many people to sign something like that.

[sexbelowsound]

To be honest all that map does to me is show where they would like to end up in an ideal situation.

In which case why have 'benefits' plastered all over certain parts of northern europe? (Don't France and Spain have welfare systems, too?)

It wasn't just to 'show where they would like to end up'.

I mean if you are looking to start a better, safer life, Why not go to the places where you think you are likely to get the best chance possible.

That I agree with - that's probably why the vast majority are looking to get to Germany where they believe they are going to be more welcomed and have a better chance (because of the public pronouncements of their politicians for the main).

Prior to the recent few months, though, the UNCHR's figures for asylum applications for Syrians from April 2011 to July 2015 have Germany, Syria and then Serbia (and Kosovo) receiving about 213 thousand of the 348 thousand.

 

Sorry, I didn't mean the aim of that map. I meant what that maps actually means to me. Obviously plastering the word benefits over certain countries is not meant to show immigration in a positive light. What I meant was that if those countries are offering you benefits then why wouldn't you head towards those. If you're going to completely uproot and move from your homeland why not go all out and try and get to the place you think is the best possible for your future.