Refugee crisis

[stuart_75]

BBC showing them getting off a train in Frankfurt and the Germans waiting at the station were clapping and cheering like they were rock stars.

I choked on my cornflakes in disbelief.

[foreveryoung]

BBC showing them getting off a train in Frankfurt and the Germans waiting at the station were clapping and cheering like they were rock stars.

I choked on my cornflakes in disbelief.

This is down to media brainwashing. The goverment still seem to think they owe the world because of what happened 70 years ago??

[StefanAVFC]

BBC showing them getting off a train in Frankfurt and the Germans waiting at the station were clapping and cheering like they were rock stars.

I choked on my cornflakes in disbelief.

This is down to media brainwashing. The goverment still seem to think they owe the world because of what happened 70 years ago??

What?

[Dr_Pangloss]

The Germans of course, have consistently demonstrated an impulse to 'unilaterally' overrule the rest of Europe, and it appears they are doing just that right now viz, asylum law.

Edited September 6, 2015 by Dr_Pangloss

[HanoiVillan]

BBC showing them getting off a train in Frankfurt and the Germans waiting at the station were clapping and cheering like they were rock stars.

I choked on my cornflakes in disbelief.

This is down to media brainwashing. The goverment still seem to think they owe the world because of what happened 70 years ago??

Hold on, a minute ago you were complaining, saying Britain is full, and you don't want to accept any migrants. Here's another country, accepting tons of migrants and basically taking the problem largely off our plate, at least in the short term, and here you are, moaning about that as well! Make your mind up. 

[foreveryoung]

BBC showing them getting off a train in Frankfurt and the Germans waiting at the station were clapping and cheering like they were rock stars.

I choked on my cornflakes in disbelief.

This is down to media brainwashing. The goverment still seem to think they owe the world because of what happened 70 years ago??

Hold on, a minute ago you were complaining, saying Britain is full, and you don't want to accept any migrants. Here's another country, accepting tons of migrants and basically taking the problem largely off our plate, at least in the short term, and here you are, moaning about that as well! Make your mind up. 

Where am I complaining?? They can take as many as they want, but that will only draw in more, an cause more problems for the whole of the EU.

I was just stating Germany's motive.

Edited September 6, 2015 by foreveryoung

[El Zen]

BBC showing them getting off a train in Frankfurt and the Germans waiting at the station were clapping and cheering like they were rock stars.

I choked on my cornflakes in disbelief.

This is down to media brainwashing. The goverment still seem to think they owe the world because of what happened 70 years ago??

Or maybe, just maaaaybe, they think it's the right thing to do? Of all the things to be upset about and to criticise, we have a go at ze Germans for being too nice? 

There's some messed up cynicism going on in this thread. Are we really so protective of our own relative luxury? Is there not enough f***ing wealth in our corner of the world to spare just a little bit? 

Edited September 6, 2015 by Michelsen
Typo

[HanoiVillan]

BBC showing them getting off a train in Frankfurt and the Germans waiting at the station were clapping and cheering like they were rock stars.

I choked on my cornflakes in disbelief.

This is down to media brainwashing. The goverment still seem to think they owe the world because of what happened 70 years ago??

Hold on, a minute ago you were complaining, saying Britain is full, and you don't want to accept any migrants. Here's another country, accepting tons of migrants and basically taking the problem largely off our plate, at least in the short term, and here you are, moaning about that as well! Make your mind up. 

Where am I complaining?? They can take as many as they want, but that will only draw in more, an cause more problems for the whole of the EU.

I was just stating Germany's motive.

Well, it read like a complaint, I apologise for misinterpreting if you weren't actually moaning. 

 

'that will only draw in more, and cause more problems for the whole of the EU'

 

Possibly when you opened your bottle of Heineken last night a genie popped out, I don't know, but assuming it didn't then simply wishing these people didn't exist, or wishing they had never travelled to Europe, isn't actually a practical policy solution. You need to make your peace with the fact that 'Europe' isn't simply going to deport tens of thousands of people overnight. They need somewhere to stay, at least in the short term while their asylum applications are processed. More migrants are going to be coming anyway, and pretty much any reaction we have short of bayoneting them on arrival isn't going to change that dynamic. 

[snowychap]

We cannot continue to bow down to media bullshit and EU bureaucratic nonsence, i,e the Human Rights Law

Erm...what?

[villakram]

We reap what we sow. The standard of living in Syria was quiet high with a good healthcare and education system and a fully functioning economy. Now the country is destroyed.

How did that happen?

Answer: Opportunistic empire building scumbags in the French/English/American governments saw the initial democratic demonstrations and forceful response of the Syrian government as an opportunity for regime change (that this would also help with the building of a gas/oil pipelines from Qatar/Saudi to Europe is surely only a coincidence). Last I read, all of these countries claim to be democracies, therefore the populations that enabled/enable this behavior will now have to bear the costs associated with an outcome that was completely and in no way possible to predict /sarc I mean what could possible happen by dumping enormous quantities of arms into a country all in the name of democracy? The same democracy that we are so happy to support in Egypt now... sigh

[maqroll]

Africans totally overlooked again. Migrants from Africa have been dying by the thousands trying to make it to Europe with nothing being done about it, but Syrians (who must surely qualify as "white enough") get an open embrace.

Edited September 7, 2015 by maqroll
misspell

[Awol]

Africans totally overlooked again. Migrants from Africa have been dying by the thousands trying to make it to Europe with nothing being done about it, but Syrians (who must surely qualify as "white enough") get an open embrace.

Royal Navy ships patrolling the Libyan Coast were issued with Dulux colour charts and the sailors told to operate a 'catch and return' policy with anyone darker than Egytian Cotton. Consequently our ships have only rescued 6700 people, to date.

Seriously, if you're going to play the racism card at least do some level of fricking research first, EU Navies are pulling people out of the Southern Med' by the 100's every day. 

[Mantis]

Africans totally overlooked again. Migrants from Africa have been dying by the thousands trying to make it to Europe with nothing being done about it, but Syrians (who must surely qualify as "white enough") get an open embrace.

I don't think skin color's got anything to do with it - more the fact that the Syrian Civil is now by far more well-known than other less-known conflicts in Africa.

[MakemineVanilla]

What I find funny is how the media are trying to manipulate the national conscience by telling us we are not as nice as the Germans.

It seems that as a nation we can accept our failure to be as good as the Germans at most things but only as long as we can console ourselves that we are much nicer than they are.

But the real issue is that Germany's decision to unilaterally flout EU law does not mean that we should automatically follow, because our national situation is different.

And of course, once the Germans have handed out full citizen rights to all and sundry, the refugees and economic migrants alike, will be able to move anywhere in the EU they choose, and demand housing, education, free medical care and benefits.

But it has to be remembered that whatever resources are diverted to these new arrivals, will be taken from the poor and homeless who are already here.

Robbing Peter to pay Paul might look like a solution but in reality it is just dividing the poor into the deserving and the undeserving.

 

 

[HanoiVillan]

What I find funny is how the media are trying to manipulate the national conscience by telling us we are not as nice as the Germans.

It seems that as a nation we can accept our failure to be as good as the Germans at most things but only as long as we can console ourselves that we are much nicer than they are.

But the real issue is that Germany's decision to unilaterally flout EU law does not mean that we should automatically follow, because our national situation is different.

And of course, once the Germans have handed out full citizen rights to all and sundry, the refugees and economic migrants alike, will be able to move anywhere in the EU they choose, and demand housing, education, free medical care and benefits.

But it has to be remembered that whatever resources are diverted to these new arrivals, will be taken from the poor and homeless who are already here.

Robbing Peter to pay Paul might look like a solution but in reality it is just dividing the poor into the deserving and the undeserving.

 

 

Can you show me an example of this in the media? I haven't seen that at all (I'm not saying it hasn't happened, I'm saying I haven't seen it). 

[chrisp65]

I'm sure the Greeks are mightily impressed with the recent show of German generosity.

 

[MakemineVanilla]

What I find funny is how the media are trying to manipulate the national conscience by telling us we are not as nice as the Germans.

It seems that as a nation we can accept our failure to be as good as the Germans at most things but only as long as we can console ourselves that we are much nicer than they are.

But the real issue is that Germany's decision to unilaterally flout EU law does not mean that we should automatically follow, because our national situation is different.

And of course, once the Germans have handed out full citizen rights to all and sundry, the refugees and economic migrants alike, will be able to move anywhere in the EU they choose, and demand housing, education, free medical care and benefits.

But it has to be remembered that whatever resources are diverted to these new arrivals, will be taken from the poor and homeless who are already here.

Robbing Peter to pay Paul might look like a solution but in reality it is just dividing the poor into the deserving and the undeserving.

 

 

Can you show me an example of this in the media? I haven't seen that at all (I'm not saying it hasn't happened, I'm saying I haven't seen it). 

Comments on the news about how good the Germans are; Pictures in the papers of signs in English, saying 'Welcome To Frankfurt'; pictures of German football fans displaying signs saying 'Refugees Are Welcome' (in English). Saturday's Times with stories of Germans handing out food and offering accommodation in Berlin. Today's front page of Metro showing two children saying 'Thank You' to Germany (in English), with the headline, Germany Leads The Way...With a Welcome. 

No mention of what France are doing or many of the rest of the 28 EU states.

Manipulation; plain and simple.

Edited September 7, 2015 by MakemineVanilla

[omariqy]

Who the **** cares about whether Germany are being made to look better or not? I couldn't give a **** as long as we are trying to make people's lives better as a whole and not just for our little household. I wrote a long post about thinking about the bigger picture to get to the root of the problem and why people are willing to risk their lives and leave their home for the chance of a basic existence in Europe. Housing a Syrian family for a week certainly won't fix the situation. The dichotomy in the way people live in this world has to change. People need a better quality of life everywhere and the gap between the powerful, rich and the masses needs to change. However, that is being too idealistic for people.  In reality it's too much hard work and effort for most. We will carry on the same way we always do - war, power, oil, regime change, religious conflict.  Take the Sun's poll today - 52% say let's bomb Syria, next to a picture that says 'For Aylan'.

[StefanAVFC]

I don't like the metro but this is pretty spot on.

http://metro.co.uk/2015/09/03/this-isnt-a-migrant-crisis-its-a-refugee-crisis-heres-the-difference-5373730/

This isn’t a migrant crisis, it’s a refugee crisis. Here’s the difference…

 

Nicole Morley for Metro.co.ukThursday 3 Sep 2015 10:23 am

721

An overcrowded ship full of Libyan refugees awaits rescue (Picture: Guardia Costiera/AFP/Getty)

Thousands of people are risking their lives, crossing seas or stowing away in cramped conditions in a desperate attempts to reach the safer corners of Europe.

As you’ve probably already seen from the tragic pictures of lifeless young bodies washing up on beaches, these gambles to reach a better life don’t always pay off.

MORE: Smiling and happy: The two dead brothers before they were forced to flee war-torn Syria

MORE: The way we describe migrants mirrors treatment of Jews during WWII, says Green Party MP

With props to Save The Children, here’s a few facts about the people reaching out for help:

1. They’re fleeing persecution and terror in their homelands.

A Syrian refugee holds a baby on the platform of Kobanya-Kispest station, Budapest (Picture: AFP/Getty)

Like most people, these are parents/wives/husbands/siblings. They’re putting the lives of their loved ones in the hands of human traffickers because they feel it’s safer than staying in their homeland.

Save The Children spokesperson Valentina Bollenback told Metro.co.uk : ‘Anyone that is fleeing war or persecution, has the right to international protection and the right to claim asylum. Mothers, Fathers, children and babies fleeing war zones like Syria and some of the deadliest countries on the planet are refugees, not economic migrants. They are fleeing bullets and bombs not economics.

‘In the main, the families Save the Children meets, those risking their lives to reach Europe, are not choosing to leave their country for a better job. They have no choice. They are fleeing countries where there is no food, no medicine, little chance of survival and no chance of life.’

2. There isn’t a safer alternative.

Body bags line the beach after a refugee boat sank off the coastal town of Zuwara, west of Tripoli (Picture: Reuters)

Before refugees can claim asylum in Europe, they have to actually get here first.

To travel to most European countries lawfully, a visa is required. But no visas are available to those seeking asylum. Hence the often perilous journeys.

3. The UK isn’t ‘swarming’ with Syrian migrants.

Thousands of migrants desperate to cross the Channel are living in slum-like conditions. in Calais Picture: AFP/ PHILIPPE HUGUEN/AFP/Getty)

Amnesty International reveal that since January last year, just 216 Syrian refugees have resettled into Britain. 216 people.

The Save The Children rep added: ‘We are experiencing the largest refugee crisis since World War II. The UK has a proud history of helping families in their time of need and should continue to show compassion to refugees.  European countries, including Britain, must do more to settle desperate people here in the UK.

‘Some countries have already stepped up and Germany in particular should be applauded. But we should also recognise that the numbers facing Europe are as nothing compared to the tragedy that has befallen Syria.’

4.Europe (including the UK) isn’t disproportionately affected by the intake of migrants.

A young girl poses for the camera as her family sleep in the transit zone of Keleti station in central Budapest (Picture: Matt Cardy/Getty)

In fact, not a single European country appeared in the top ten countries who host the most refugees last year.

The countries with the most welcoming borders included Kenya, Uganda and Ethiopia.

5. We’re not ‘soft on migrants’.

A Syrian refugee gives his wife water moments after arriving at Kos Picture: Reuters)

Britain’s welfare system offers an adult asylum seeker £36.95 per week. This is the same as most European countries, but lower than France who offer £58.50.

An asylum seeker is not granted permission to work in the UK unless 12 months have passed and their claim remains undecided, making it near impossible to support themselves.

Amnesty International explain their research shows that refugees often select countries because of language connections rather than the welfare or benefits available.

Just in case there’s still any confusion:

Here’s the definition of a migrant…

And here’s what refugee means…

Read more: http://metro.co.uk/2015/09/03/this-isnt-a-migrant-crisis-its-a-refugee-crisis-heres-the-difference-5373730/#ixzz3l328n1XX

Especially to those who are saying 'They aren't refugees, they have nice phones!!11!!1!1'

[HanoiVillan]

Great post Omar. 

What I find funny is how the media are trying to manipulate the national conscience by telling us we are not as nice as the Germans.

It seems that as a nation we can accept our failure to be as good as the Germans at most things but only as long as we can console ourselves that we are much nicer than they are.

But the real issue is that Germany's decision to unilaterally flout EU law does not mean that we should automatically follow, because our national situation is different.

And of course, once the Germans have handed out full citizen rights to all and sundry, the refugees and economic migrants alike, will be able to move anywhere in the EU they choose, and demand housing, education, free medical care and benefits.

But it has to be remembered that whatever resources are diverted to these new arrivals, will be taken from the poor and homeless who are already here.

Robbing Peter to pay Paul might look like a solution but in reality it is just dividing the poor into the deserving and the undeserving.

 

 

Can you show me an example of this in the media? I haven't seen that at all (I'm not saying it hasn't happened, I'm saying I haven't seen it). 

Comments on the news about how good the Germans are; Pictures in the papers of signs in English, saying 'Welcome To Frankfurt'; pictures of German football fans displaying signs saying 'Refugees Are Welcome' (in English). Saturday's Times with stories of Germans handing out food and offering accommodation in Berlin. Today's front page of Metro showing two children saying 'Thank You' to Germany (in English), with the headline, Germany Leads The Way...With a Welcome. 

No mention of what France are doing or many of the rest of the 28 EU states.

Manipulation; plain and simple.

With respect, some of this seems like more evidence of a guilty conscience on your part than 'media manipulation'. I mean, on a deep level, everything ever that is in the media is manipulating people's thoughts. But the tone of your post makes it sound like a conscious conspiracy. I've highlighted the things which you've complained about which are in the news because they're news. It's pointless complaining about newspapers covering the news. France and most of the other EU states aren't currently doing anything newsworthy re. migrants, so they're not in the news. Germany is doing something newsworthy, hence it's in the news. Germany would equally be in the news if they were mistreating or expelling migrants.