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Refugee crisis


StefanAVFC

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In any case, the US and the UK and a few others (notably Australia) bear blame for the refugee crisis, but the US holds the lion's share, and my only point is that we (in the US) need to "step up to the plate" (gotta have a baseball reference) and take in the refugees from Syria. 

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As a dual-national US-UK, I think all the Syrian refugees should be offered resettlement in the USA. When Bush and Bliar destroyed Saddam's regime without thinking through the long-term consequences, we "bought" Iraq -- and what's driving people out of Syria now is mostly fear of ISIS, a monster created, in large part, by American foreign policy in Iraq.

I also think Russia should be stepping forward, 'cause Putin has played no small part in narrowing the options available to Syrians, but if I were Syrian, there's no **** way I would go to racist Russia (and it's worse than the US, believe me!) if offered a chance to settle in the US.

The USA has some interesting Syrian communities, too, and they are healthy and vibrant. I buy spinach pies and hummus all the time from a Syrian grocer.

they were right to destroy Saddam (imo) ...  but it should have been done first time around 

had Blair not done it on the basis of a lie he wouldn't be so reviled but America wanted it's revenge for 11/9 so badly they attacked the wrong country and Blair (and Bush) should have to pay the consequences for that

Saddam was a CIA puppet who got too big for his boots.

Yeah, but that's going WAY back ... to the early 1960s, right? Control was gone by the late 80s. And in that earlier era, MI6's hands in the mideast were pretty filthy, too -- Operation Boot, anyone?

I didn't say we didn'i. 

By the way. anyone wanting to know what the hell is going on in the middle east search 'Bitter Lake' on youtube. 

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they were right to destroy Saddam (imo) ...  but it should have been done first time around 

had Blair not done it on the basis of a lie he wouldn't be so reviled but America wanted it's revenge for 11/9 so badly they attacked the wrong country and Blair (and Bush) should have to pay the consequences for that

Saddam was a CIA puppet who got too big for his boots.

Yeah, but that's going WAY back ... to the early 1960s, right? Control was gone by the late 80s. And in that earlier era, MI6's hands in the mideast were pretty filthy, too -- Operation Boot, anyone?

I didn't say we didn'i. 

By the way. anyone wanting to know what the hell is going on in the middle east search 'Bitter Lake' on youtube. 

Noted! Sorry, I rarely seem to miss chances to put words in others' mouths. :blush:

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So all i keep hearing in the media recently is that the reason these people are fleeing is because there is a war in their country?

Last time i looked Hungary Serbia Macedonia Austria e.t.c all the other countries between us and the likes of Germany and France are not at war but i guess these countries are not economically vibrant enough for them.

I do hear the odd news report suggesting the reason for them moving is economic migration they want a better life and are using the war as an excuse but all these stories appear to be sweeped under the rug or chastised whenever mentioned.

I know we will need to take in a quota of them but the media can sod off with all the sob story propaganda it just doesn't wash with me

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As a dual-national US-UK, I think all the Syrian refugees should be offered resettlement in the USA. When Bush and Bliar destroyed Saddam's regime without thinking through the long-term consequences, we "bought" Iraq -- and what's driving people out of Syria now is mostly fear of ISIS, a monster created, in large part, by American foreign policy in Iraq.

I also think Russia should be stepping forward, 'cause Putin has played no small part in narrowing the options available to Syrians, but if I were Syrian, there's no **** way I would go to racist Russia (and it's worse than the US, believe me!) if offered a chance to settle in the US.

The USA has some interesting Syrian communities, too, and they are healthy and vibrant. I buy spinach pies and hummus all the time from a Syrian grocer.

they were right to destroy Saddam (imo) ...  but it should have been done first time around 

had Blair not done it on the basis of a lie he wouldn't be so reviled but America wanted it's revenge for 11/9 so badly they attacked the wrong country and Blair (and Bush) should have to pay the consequences for that

 

Blair needs a trial and a date with the hangman for what he did. 

Sorry, I don't agree with death penalty. What you're describing is a kangaroo court. There's been enough death. And I don't agree with the Blair is war criminal brigade because I think it let's the British people off the hook. They knew what the **** they were doing. And the same goes for us in the USA. I am so sick of ordinary British and American people pretending they were gullibly deceived by their leaders.

I actually protested in the streets in 2003 right before the bombs started in Iraq, in NYC. It wasn't hard to get the real facts.  But there weren't many people helping out with the protests. I was mostly with grannies from Connecticut and old hippies. The young weren't there. I still feel really really angry about how relatively alone we were.

I went on a couple of marches around here over the summer related to the BLM protests and it the crowd was pretty devoid of youth, except those with obvious stereotype hippy leanings. Marching through town, the typical reaction was people taking selfies with the protest in the background :( and then ignoring it. 

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Just out of interest, what is rubbish about it?

The claim that the people leaving Syria are on their way to various (specific) parts of northern europe for 'benefits'.

I also wonder whether it's a bit of a straw man to have 'These are refugees who simply want to get to safety' under the picture. Who has been claiming that?

Edited by snowychap
Calamitous error!
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COP4QnPWwAEdR98.jpg

What rubbish.

 

I haven't actually read enough about the situation to have formed an opinion as of yet but came across this on twitter and thought it echoed a few opinions on here.

Just out of interest, what is rubbish about it?

Kinda has that whole Daily Mail editorial vibe to it.

I mean what would English people do if a whole host of nations decided to play risk with your little Island and bombed/armed the hell out of it? Oh, of course, you are special and would fight yada yada yada. It's them there damn furrernerss!!!

 

Edited by villakram
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I should add that research by the Refugee Council suggests that more than 2/3 of asylum seekers didn't even specifically choose to come to the UK themselves (largely, their doing so was the result of a decision by the agent they paid money to in their country of origin) and around 3/4 had 'no knowledge of welfare benefits or support before coming to the UK'. Many didn't know they were coming to the UK before they arrived, and some weren't even aware that 'Europe' wasn't all one country. Almost none of those questioned had any pre-existing knowledge of UK government policy towards asylum seekers, and generally the discovery that they are forbidden from working comes as a huge psychological blow. See the executive summary from p4 onwards:

http://www.refugeecouncil.org.uk/assets/0001/5702/rcchance.pdf

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