LakotaDakota Posted July 15, 2019 Share Posted July 15, 2019 4 minutes ago, TheStagMan said: OK, who is going to pay £5m for Hogan? £12m for Hourihane? Much as I like the guy, No. What about the others he signed during his time? 1 year contracts by definition no sell on fee. 10 loans!!!! You don't think anyone would pay 12 million for a 28 year old attacking midfielder that gets a goal or assist pretty much every 200 minutes and can score free-kicks for fun? Guess we should have just let his contract expire rather than giving him a new deal Who else? Samba? 1 year contract as a free agent doesn't exactly command a huge transfer fee, Terry here for a year and is now part of the management team(there is absolutely no chance he would be here with smith if he hadn't played for us before) Hutton new deal for 1 year, popular player already here offering experienced cover for at least 2 defensive positions for 10 grand a week seems like a pretty good deal to me & why keep mentioning loans, Of course they are not going to have a sell on fee, they are loans.... Without the loans over the past 2 seasons we would not have been in any play-off finals and would not be in the premier league now. Who could we possibly have purchased that offered more than some of the loans for less than the cost of their wages (remember they would also need paying) They served their purpose exactly as they should have, So much so that we have actually bought some of them this summer 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheStagMan Posted July 15, 2019 Share Posted July 15, 2019 6 minutes ago, kurtsimonw said: 13 of those 22 players are 26 or under, so this idea that he only signs 30+ players is a myth, in my opinion. Of the 3 players signed who were over 30, Whelan played a big part towards the end of the season and I don't believe we'd have gone up without Terry on the coaching team, I also believe he wouldn't be here in the first place if it wasn't for Bruce. In terms of the playoff final squad, of course a number of those won't be there because the Championship is a loan heavy market, it's what you have to do to fill a squad out. So yes, no Grabban - but he's replaced with Tammy. Yes, no Snoddy - but he's replaced with AEG. I don't think not being able to retain players should be used against him. Tuanzebe and Tammy are £25m+ players in this market, surely it's a positive thing that he was able to bring in these young and talented players? Players were always going to move on upon promotion, that's just the nature of football. I think there's far too much of an emphasis on the negative that things get blown out of proportion. Whether I like, rate or think positively of Bruce is irrelevant. Because I don't in any way. When I was putting that together I was surprised by the ages of some, I thought they were older. I had previously looked at the average ages of players, and the likes of Terry, Samba and Whelan would have skewed that upwards. Some of the loan signings were good, agreed. I'm not sure only Bruce could have attracted them, but will accept that he played a large part in that, but Tuansebe for example he played out of position, Onomah was a disaster, as was Wasterman(C), Grabban wasn't used as much as Tammy. Be interesting to compare how many loans we had versus other teams last season. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Albrighton Posted July 15, 2019 VT Supporter Share Posted July 15, 2019 @bobzy I pretty much agree with your good/decent/poor assessment of each signing. I would add Bedeau as an additional “poor” signing. Nothing against the lad (I literally have no idea if he’s any good), but we spent the best part of a million on him and he never played. But yeah, I think the “good” signings are over 50% - just about. Hit & miss. @LakotaDakota I don’t think those valuations are likely. But what I think most would agree on, is that the only way we could get back what we paid for someone like Lansbury or Nyland is because we’re now in the premier league and we’re not desperate to sell. For instance, if we were still in the championship, I sincerely doubt we’d get much more than £5m for Hourihane, let alone £12m. So in summary, even if those valuations were likely, they’re only likely because we’re in the top flight. By winning promotion, Dean Smith (and the team) made them more valuable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheStagMan Posted July 15, 2019 Share Posted July 15, 2019 11 minutes ago, LakotaDakota said: You don't think anyone would pay 12 million for a 28 year old attacking midfielder that gets a goal or assist pretty much every 200 minutes and can score free-kicks for fun? Guess we should have just let his contract expire rather than giving him a new deal Who else? Samba? 1 year contract as a free agent doesn't exactly command a huge transfer fee, Terry here for a year and is now part of the management team(there is absolutely no chance he would be here with smith if he hadn't played for us before) Hutton new deal for 1 year, popular player already here offering experienced cover for at least 2 defensive positions for 10 grand a week seems like a pretty good deal to me & why keep mentioning loans, Of course they are not going to have a sell on fee, they are loans.... Without the loans over the past 2 seasons we would not have been in any play-off finals and would not be in the premier league now. Who could we possibly have purchased that offered more than some of the loans for less than the cost of their wages (remember they would also need paying) They served their purpose exactly as they should have, So much so that we have actually bought some of them this summer The loans that really fired us to the final were Mings (Smith), Tuanzebe (poor under Bruce), Tammy (Bruce) and AEG (also poor under Bruce). Terry - well, you may be right, we will never know for sure - he would have had to go somewhere. Championship most likely (ala Frank) and we were one of the big boys down there. If you believe BannedfromH&V he would have gone to Birmingham City if he didn't come to us. However the point being discussed was that Bruce does not build teams for the long term - the number of loan signings points to that. Purslow and Smith themselves said we need to stop doing that (before we were promoted). 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheStagMan Posted July 15, 2019 Share Posted July 15, 2019 Right - things to do and places to be. Have a good evening everyone! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LakotaDakota Posted July 15, 2019 Share Posted July 15, 2019 (edited) 18 minutes ago, TheStagMan said: The loans that really fired us to the final were Mings (Smith), Tuanzebe (poor under Bruce), Tammy (Bruce) and AEG (also poor under Bruce). Terry - well, you may be right, we will never know for sure - he would have had to go somewhere. Championship most likely (ala Frank) and we were one of the big boys down there. If you believe BannedfromH&V he would have gone to Birmingham City if he didn't come to us. However the point being discussed was that Bruce does not build teams for the long term - the number of loan signings points to that. Purslow and Smith themselves said we need to stop doing that (before we were promoted). No it wasn't. You said all he does is sign old players with no resale value So loans are ok now then if they fire us to the final? But, but , but they have no resale value.... Great you pick out onomah as being shit, I can guarantee he did an awful lot more than Tom Carrol did, & how much do we get for carrol now, oh right nothing he was a loan... Abraham poor under Bruce? what the full 5 games he was here for where he scored 2 goals? El Ghazi the same, 4 league games under bruce 1 goal & 1 assist. Tuanzebe 15 appearances total over 2 seasons... Sure Terry would have ended up somewhere but i would be willing to bet every single penny i have that it would not have been as a coaching assistant to Dean Smith had he not played here the year before. You're just making shit up now If we sold Mcginn Today it would more than likely cover the cost of all of his purchases combined... Edited July 15, 2019 by LakotaDakota Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
useless Posted July 15, 2019 Share Posted July 15, 2019 (edited) Bruce most likely had never even heard of McGinn before he signed for us. If he'd had his way we most likely would have signed someone like James McArthur. Edited July 15, 2019 by useless 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rodders0223 Posted July 15, 2019 Share Posted July 15, 2019 58 minutes ago, LakotaDakota said: Well apparently McGinn is worth 50 million... Ok so players we actually bought (going on transfermarkt fees rounded to nearest half million) Hogan 10 mil - Current Value 4-5 mil Bree £3 mil - Current Value £3 mil Hourihane £3 mil - Current Value £10-15 mil Lansbury £3 mil - Current Value £3-5 mil McGinn £3 mil - Current Value £20-30 mil Nyland £3 mil - Current Value £2-3 mil Bjarnason £2 mil - Current Value £1-2 mil Whelan £1.5 mil - Current Value £0 Elmohamady £1 mil - Current Value £3-5 mil Looks ok to me Hogan, Bjarn, Nyland and Lansbury have negative values. We would have to loan them all out or pay them off to accept lesser deals elsewhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ciggiesnbeer Posted July 15, 2019 Share Posted July 15, 2019 3 minutes ago, useless said: Bruce most likely had never even heard of McGinn before he signed for us. If he'd had his way we most likely would have signed someone like James McArthur instead, who as it happens I think would have been a decent enough signing, as I think he's an underrated player, so I don't use that example as a way of criticizing Bruce. tbf Smith and Purslow have credited Bruce with his loans and signings. So you could well be right and it was Villa's org that offered McGinn to Bruce, but he had the sense to accept him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rodders0223 Posted July 15, 2019 Share Posted July 15, 2019 Bruce never signed Bedeau, you would say he was a RDM signing but I doubt he was tbf. I would love to know who the **** signed off that or pleaded the case for him to be signed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Albrighton Posted July 15, 2019 VT Supporter Share Posted July 15, 2019 16 minutes ago, rodders0223 said: Bruce never signed Bedeau, you would say he was a RDM signing but I doubt he was tbf. I would love to know who the **** signed off that or pleaded the case for him to be signed. We bought him in January 2017. Quote The 17-year-old defender moves to Villa Park for £1m and has signed a two-and-a-half-year deal. Link To keep this on topic, erm, Newcastle United didn’t sign Bedeau in January 2017. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ferguson1 Posted July 15, 2019 Share Posted July 15, 2019 (edited) Edited July 15, 2019 by ferguson1 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sne Posted July 15, 2019 Share Posted July 15, 2019 As exciting as it is with promotion, new signings and actually watchable football you still got to enjoy the classics. Steve Bruce being Steve Bruce is still quality content 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheStagMan Posted July 15, 2019 Share Posted July 15, 2019 1 hour ago, LakotaDakota said: No it wasn't. You said all he does is sign old players with no resale value So loans are ok now then if they fire us to the final? But, but , but they have no resale value.... Great you pick out onomah as being shit, I can guarantee he did an awful lot more than Tom Carrol did, & how much do we get for carrol now, oh right nothing he was a loan... Abraham poor under Bruce? what the full 5 games he was here for where he scored 2 goals? El Ghazi the same, 4 league games under bruce 1 goal & 1 assist. Tuanzebe 15 appearances total over 2 seasons... Sure Terry would have ended up somewhere but i would be willing to bet every single penny i have that it would not have been as a coaching assistant to Dean Smith had he not played here the year before. You're just making shit up now If we sold Mcginn Today it would more than likely cover the cost of all of his purchases combined... Making shit up. Oh dear me. You carry on thinking that if it helps you. OK. You win! I have better things to do than argue with someone who is trying to tell me that Bruce wasn't a shit manager and makes good signings. by bringing Tom Carrol into things. Lord almighty. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest av1 Posted July 15, 2019 Share Posted July 15, 2019 3 hours ago, VillaChris said: Anyway people think we never give him a chance....look at some of thse comments! https://www.newcastle-online.org/forum/index.php?topic=103091.3175 Wow, they really are spitting feathers. My personal favourite is I hope the daft c*** chokes on a Pasty while getting his eyes clawed out by an owl. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest av1 Posted July 15, 2019 Share Posted July 15, 2019 From twitter If reports are correct - Steve Bruce now becomes our record outgoing transfer at £4m, exceeding the £3m WBA paid for Chris Brunt in 2007 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob182 Posted July 15, 2019 Share Posted July 15, 2019 Hang on, I’ve just thought. If Bruce takes Newcastle down, at least they’ll have the perfect man to take them back up. I mean, who could they get that is better? 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rjw63 Posted July 15, 2019 Share Posted July 15, 2019 Just read that Bruce wants to make his first Newcastle signing... Yannick Bolasie 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rjw63 Posted July 15, 2019 Share Posted July 15, 2019 Hundreds of comments on BBC Sport, and pretty much 100% of Jawdees don't want FistFace. Unsurprisingly, a small heath fan piped up and put "SOTV" at the end of the comment. No doubt his mommy typed it out for him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VillaChris Posted July 15, 2019 Share Posted July 15, 2019 (edited) 4 hours ago, rodders0223 said: Bruce never signed Bedeau, you would say he was a RDM signing but I doubt he was tbf. I would love to know who the **** signed off that or pleaded the case for him to be signed. He was just a youth team signing, it was pretty much a signing for our under 23 team. Bree was obviously one seen as more first team ready given he was a regular at Barnsley at the time who were above us in the league IIRC. Edit: I actually give him a pass for many of the squad player signings. Most were low fee signings (albeit pretty decent on the wage bill list) and someone like Bjarni was regular in CL with Basle and had a decent euro 2016 so certainly on paper not a bad signing for a mid table championship club. Hourihane has turned out o.k surely after a slow start?! You're playing 46 games so you certainly need more than 11 players so squad players to come in and do jobs for 4-5 games but obviously don't have the quality to play week in week out. His worst signing was Hogan. I'm convinced he didn't actually scout him but just looked at his goalscoring stats and also saw West Ham were in for him so must've thought if mid table prem club wants him it's a no lose signing. Clearly didn't watch him play as we just bang long balls up to him to try to hold up which is completely different to how Brentford were getting him to score. He can have him at Newcastle given they have just two strikers on their books now. Edited July 15, 2019 by VillaChris 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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