bannedfromHandV Posted July 15, 2019 Share Posted July 15, 2019 Just now, TrentVilla said: I think people thought he under achieved with the squad he had, in my view that is fair. The squad he had compared to many in the Championship was very strong, that doesn't mean that he was good at signing players for the reasons I've already pointed out. So sorry, there isn't the contradiction you seek to point out. Honestly, I am astounded that you cannot see the contradiction. Literally the most surprising thing to happen since you last posted on the subject 5 minutes ago. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
useless Posted July 15, 2019 Share Posted July 15, 2019 I didn't say any signings were 'crap', and the only person I damned was Bruce. How he can be praised for signing some good players I'm not sure, he couldn't fail but to do so with the resources he had, it would be like praising Guardiola for signing some good players for City even if he failed. Like I say if Bruce built such a wonderful squad then it makes it reflects all the more badly on him that he was such an utter failure with it. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villa4europe Posted July 15, 2019 Share Posted July 15, 2019 1 minute ago, bannedfromHandV said: Also, wasn't the narrative last season (or season before last) that we had a great squad and should have walked the league so only finishing in the playoffs was a massive failure? Well make your minds up folks, either he helped to assemble a great squad (in relative terms) and failed or he didn't assemble a great squad and I guess therefore overachieved in getting to the playoffs? Which is it? he assembled a great squad for the championship in an unsustainable fashion due to loan and old players* which he then failed to use properly falling short of his target of promotion which was actually a blessing in disguise because if he had got promotion the shortcomings of his philosophy would have been demonstrated * I think di matteo did the same, we didn't do what I thought we should have done, 18-21 year olds, give them football, develop them, they step up, we step up, they continue to progress in the PL as we climb, the championships best players, old heads on big contracts, lots of loans set up is short term thinking, dreaming of the PL cash 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCJonah Posted July 15, 2019 Share Posted July 15, 2019 2 minutes ago, bannedfromHandV said: Ah okay, guess we'll let him off the hook somewhat for Hogan then eh? Ah let me guess, that one was all Bruce but let's say McGinn, that was a club effort right? I haven't seen anyone not give any credit for the mcginn signing. Like when he was here you are getting worked up to defend the failure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobzy Posted July 15, 2019 Share Posted July 15, 2019 (edited) 7 minutes ago, useless said: I didn't say any signings were 'crap', and the only person I damned was Bruce. How he can be praised for signing some good players I'm not sure, he couldn't fail but to do so with the resources he had, it would be like praising Guardiola for signing some good players for City even if he failed. Like I say if Bruce built such a wonderful squad then it makes it reflects all the more badly on him that he was such an utter failure with it. Well, no, that's not true - because he did also make bad signings. As did Di Matteo. As have lots and lots and lots of managers when there's plenty of money to throw around. The Guardiola analogy here just doesn't work either. Guardiola and Klopp have made brilliant signings with lots of money and seen their respective clubs form a genuine top 2 at the top of the league. Mourinho spent loads at Man Utd and they're nowhere near them. Money doesn't = awesome. Bruce didn't "build such a wonderful squad" either. No-one is saying he did. The original comment came from something like Bruce leaves teams in a horrible mess because of his recruitment policy. As seen at Villa, the truth is somewhere in the middle of this and the sarcastic comment you've made. Central defence was left in a horrible mess, our attacking third was quite brilliantly stacked for the Championship. He was rightly sacked. He should've done a better job last season. I don't think anyone will argue otherwise. However, a lot of the players he signed (or not lolz) played a major role in us getting promoted. It wasn't all terrible dross. Edited July 15, 2019 by bobzy 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bannedfromHandV Posted July 15, 2019 Share Posted July 15, 2019 3 minutes ago, DCJonah said: I haven't seen anyone not give any credit for the mcginn signing. Like when he was here you are getting worked up to defend the failure. Nice dodge of the question asked. I'll just assume that to answer it honestly would weakened your 'point'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrentVilla Posted July 15, 2019 Moderator Share Posted July 15, 2019 9 minutes ago, bannedfromHandV said: Honestly, I am astounded that you cannot see the contradiction. Literally the most surprising thing to happen since you last posted on the subject 5 minutes ago. It isn't that I don't see it, its that I don't think it is there. In reply to your constant posts you mean? What a odd point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
delboy54 Posted July 15, 2019 Share Posted July 15, 2019 Aren't we all supposed to be "laughing at Newcastle", guys?..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AvfcRigo82 Posted July 15, 2019 Share Posted July 15, 2019 3 hours ago, Stuartc445 said: By mess you mean the players that have just got us promoted, the playoff final team only Mings was a Smith addition in the starting lineup and the other one was Hause on the bench so in the squad only 2 were Smith's. Bruce did a good job recruiting but just couldn't set them up. What absolute bollocks! The players that got us promoted at Wembley you will find only 4 of that starting XI had been signed by Bruce and - also another 3 were loans. Elmo, Whelan, McGinn, Hourihane. Tuanzebe, El Ghazi & Abraham. Of that crop only Elmo, JMG, CH remain - Dean Smith has since signed El Ghazi. As for Brucies recruitment, let's have a look at that: Scott Hogan - £9m flop, James Bree - £3m barely featured, Elmohamady - £1m been okay, John McGinn - £3m his best signing, Jacob Bedeau - £1.5m barely featured, Glenn Whelan - £1.5m played better after Bruce had gone, Conor Hourihane - £3m good signing, Birkir Bjarnasson - £1.8m barely features, Orjan Nyland - £2.7m barely features and not all that, Henri Lansbury - £3m barely features and forever injured. I would say that his recruitment of 10 players, 2 of those have been standouts. His job of recruiting was not all that. As for not being able to set a team up shows that he is now outdated. Throwingn anyone into any position doesn't work as well as it might on Ultimate Soccer Manager. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jareth Posted July 15, 2019 VT Supporter Share Posted July 15, 2019 Staggered that they've paid £4mill compo to get him. Says it all about Ashley, the money is there, but he wants a yes man managing the club, who will make sure they are there or thereabouts until the day someone wants to buy the club for the most ridiculously one-sided deal in history. Ashley will never sell. I do honestly, without sass, feel sorry for the land of jimmy nail and byker grove. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bannedfromHandV Posted July 15, 2019 Share Posted July 15, 2019 23 minutes ago, TrentVilla said: It isn't that I don't see it, its that I don't think it is there. In reply to your constant posts you mean? What a odd point. Constant posts? Yeah okay mate, well constant. I've barely commented on Bruce in months but will speak up when the usual BS brigade come around for the weekly insults and digs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AvfcRigo82 Posted July 15, 2019 Share Posted July 15, 2019 4 minutes ago, Jareth said: Staggered that they've paid £4mill compo to get him. Says it all about Ashley, the money is there, but he wants a yes man managing the club, who will make sure they are there or thereabouts until the day someone wants to buy the club for the most ridiculously one-sided deal in history. Ashley will never sell. I do honestly, without sass, feel sorry for the land of jimmy nail and byker grove. It's a match made in heaven. The manager and chairman will get along great with trips to the kebab house, a yes man indeed until Bruce get's bored and the excuses start coming. Losing Rafa Benithez for Steve Bruce is one of the most incredible things I have witnessed in football management. As for Newcastle, if they didn't have such an arsehole opinion of us over their relegation etc. and then loved it when it was us, Na **** em. It's a brilliant season... Villa going wild with signings like Posh Spice on speed, Birmingham City sinking deeper in the shit everyday and now Newcastle have been gifted and it's going to be such a pantomime of a season for them. Can this season get any better before it's even began? 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fowlersrs Posted July 15, 2019 Share Posted July 15, 2019 What we can all agree on over or under achieve is that bruce ball was dull. They style of play and lack of training within the club was of a epic proportion and everything about it is so out of touch with the modern day game. Newcastle fans will be devastated, he will set them up not to loose. Il be amazed if they manage to stay up. I'm in the camp of he needs to hang his boots up, hes stopping young up and coming managers having a crack and developing there game for the sake of his pension fund. You cant blame the guy, who wouldn't take the ££s, its just a sorry state for football. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davkaus Posted July 15, 2019 Share Posted July 15, 2019 I really hope that NEwcastle give the job to someone else now he's resigned. 1 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fowlersrs Posted July 15, 2019 Share Posted July 15, 2019 Newcastle have paid 4m for him now according to Nixon... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrentVilla Posted July 15, 2019 Moderator Share Posted July 15, 2019 9 minutes ago, bannedfromHandV said: Constant posts? Yeah okay mate, well constant. I've barely commented on Bruce in months but will speak up when the usual BS brigade come around for the weekly insults and digs. Well most of my posts have been in reply to yours.... I’m not sure being critical of his transfer record is being insulting or taking digs but you think whatever you want mate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Demitri_C Posted July 15, 2019 Share Posted July 15, 2019 That game at villa park should be interesting. Let's arrange a vegetable day at villa park that day and all come dressed as our favourite vegetable Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stuartc445 Posted July 15, 2019 Share Posted July 15, 2019 (edited) 4 hours ago, TheStagMan said: Seriously? SERIOUSLY? Like the 8 players we just released, like the complete lack of a central defence, like ruining Chester's career because of it, like nearly going bankrupt due to the short term planning from our manager (admittedly piled on top of years of recklessness - but completely fecking up the opportunity to sort things properly)? Many of the players that got us up whilst also not being Smith signings were also not Bruce signings either. He didn't do a good job recruiting, he really did not - otherwise we would not be needing to rebuild to the extent we are now. Hit and hope merchant. How anyone can defend his recruitment is utterly bewildering. John McGinn, El Ghazi, Conor Hourihane, Glen Whelan, Tammy Abraham, Elmo, Axel Tuanzebe. You're right how terrible Bruce's recruitment was wish he hadn't lumbered us with McGinn. Tbh I don't care about Bruce anymore as he's gone i just find it ridiculous how people talk about him. Honestly if you were an outsider reading some of these comments you'd think he had us scrapping for survival in the championship all the time he was here. I also find the people mocking him for saying he was never accepted here are usually the people that never accepted him. We are in the Premier League with Smith as manager surely it's time people move on from Bruce and stop going over the same old tired ground. Edited July 15, 2019 by Stuartc445 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villa4europe Posted July 15, 2019 Share Posted July 15, 2019 30 minutes ago, Demitri_C said: That game at villa park should be interesting. Let's arrange a vegetable day at villa park that day and all come dressed as our favourite vegetable I think it will be like Sunderland when they had MON, we start chanting something derogatory and they join in Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Demitri_C Posted July 15, 2019 Share Posted July 15, 2019 Best way to describe Bruce's football Newcastle fans Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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