Popular Post BOF Posted December 1, 2023 Moderator Popular Post Share Posted December 1, 2023 So you're up against a football culture of not telling the truth. A club reporting false allocations and not transparently reporting reduced allocations and reasons, a ticketing procedure that encourages chaos and trouble. A hierarchy amongst the fans that facilitates the aforementioned chaos (the ultras controlling tickets). A club naively (but you would suspect knowingly) misrepresenting their own fans, and a management that wantonly turns a blind eye because the whole thing is so inextricable to his daily existence within the club that he knows any criticism will come back to bite him very quickly. It's rotten. As an entity as a whole, the package is just scum. Good **** riddance. It's a pity it looks like they'll go through. Come on AZ, knock these w*nkers out. 11 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sidcow Posted December 1, 2023 VT Supporter Share Posted December 1, 2023 17 minutes ago, Pongo's Socks said: Was that the day they got relegated? I remember trying to get up to Witton Station from the holte and then saw the line of police horses charge. Like you say, scary to see, you wouldn't want to be in their way Possibly. It was on the street outside Witton Station Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobzy Posted December 1, 2023 Share Posted December 1, 2023 I have a feeling the club may be turfed out of the competition. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mic09 Posted December 1, 2023 Share Posted December 1, 2023 27 minutes ago, bobzy said: I have a feeling the club may be turfed out of the competition. They will be anyway - They will lose against Alkmaar and that's that. Bunch of idiots. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted December 1, 2023 Share Posted December 1, 2023 1 hour ago, BleedClaretAndBlue said: 90 minutes of sustained pressure is quite impressive, have seen many Villa performances when we tire after 60 minutes 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted December 1, 2023 Share Posted December 1, 2023 5 minutes ago, Mic09 said: They will be anyway - They will lose against Alkmaar and that's that. Bunch of idiots. Maybe not. No Alkmaar fans will travel and it will be a pretty hostile atmosphere after the 1st game. AZ are also no angels I think UEFA give them a fine at most Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stewiek2 Posted December 1, 2023 Share Posted December 1, 2023 1 minute ago, Zatman said: Maybe not. No Alkmaar fans will travel and it will be a pretty hostile atmosphere after the 1st game. AZ are also no angels I think UEFA give them a fine at most It'll be a fine, warning of a ban if future conduct is as this and 3 games behind closed doors. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Demitri_C Posted December 1, 2023 Author Share Posted December 1, 2023 (edited) 6 minutes ago, Zatman said: Maybe not. No Alkmaar fans will travel and it will be a pretty hostile atmosphere after the 1st game. AZ are also no angels I think UEFA give them a fine at most There was zero issues with AZ in bosnia or here. They have some bad like most clubs but legia are in another level of thuggery and scum Az fans for their own safety shouldn't make trip and legia fans should be banned make it a behind closed doors game Ill be cheering AZ thats for sure Edited December 1, 2023 by Demitri_C Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted December 1, 2023 Share Posted December 1, 2023 1 minute ago, Demitri_C said: There was zero issues with AZ in bosnia or here. They have some bad like most clubs but legia are in another level of thuggery and scum Az fans for their own safety shouldn't make trip and legia fans should be banned make it a behind closed doors game Ill be cheering AZ thats for sure AZ fans attacked the West Ham families last season. They are as scummy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Demitri_C Posted December 1, 2023 Author Share Posted December 1, 2023 (edited) 5 minutes ago, Zatman said: AZ fans attacked the West Ham families last season. They are as scummy Scummy too but that was a small percentage of them Last night it was their whole fanbase Also we played AZ back to back and there was not one single issue Edited December 1, 2023 by Demitri_C Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoshVilla Posted December 1, 2023 Share Posted December 1, 2023 (edited) I've just listened to the phone in on TalkSport (via YouTube, so not sure if it was the whole thing). Listening to the first Legia supporter that phoned in - I just don't understand the logic at all. He says that Villa only allocated 800 tickets to away fans, so 3,000 turned up hoping that they would be let in purely because there's a lot of them. Are you being serious? Do you really think that Villa, considering the trouble that Legia fans have caused over here previously, plus the trouble in the Alkmaar game recently, are going to just ignore that and put the safety of fans at risk inside the stadium and just let a load of fans in purely because there's a large number? I feel for the genuine fans that wanted to come over and watch a game of football and have a nice trip, I really do, but they obviously have big problems and their club are burying their heads in the sand and trying to shift the blame rather than tackling the issue. I'm sure that things probably could have been done better in some cases, but for grown men to act like that over a game of football? Grow the **** up. Edited December 1, 2023 by JoshVilla Added YT vid for context 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fun Factory Posted December 1, 2023 Share Posted December 1, 2023 1 hour ago, Davkaus said: Fancied a pie? What, at our prices? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genie Posted December 1, 2023 Share Posted December 1, 2023 5 minutes ago, The Fun Factory said: What, at our prices? Hence the riot gear, they weren’t paying 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post OutByEaster? Posted December 1, 2023 Moderator Popular Post Share Posted December 1, 2023 6 hours ago, sidcow said: It wasn't 2,000 people suddenly arrived at the ground in one block. People would have arrived over a period of time eventually ramping up to 2,000. Many people like to arrive at and get into the ground early. I'm sure many hundreds of people arriving were genuine fans just wanting to see the game. Picking out fans with tickets as they rock up should be fairly easy..... Show us your ticket. They clearly didn't allow a single person in, even if you got there an hour before kick off and allowed the mob to grow and grow mixing those there purely to cause trouble with some damn angry more "normal" fans and penning them in with presumably families with kids etc As I said it was absolutely clear there was no plan and a lot of panic amongst the senior officers. Legia fans started to arrive at the ground at around 15:00 and my understanding was that there were several hundred there in the afternoon, by about 18:00 it seems like the vast majority were there - by 18:30 the disorder had started. I got there at about 18:20 and went to have a peep out of curiosity, by that time, i seriously doubt that the group behind the police vans was in the mood to line up and show tickets. The stewards are briefed and in position in the away end at around 18:15 I believe - that really doesn't give WMP the opportunity to do much in terms of finding out who does and doesn't have tickets in those 15 minutes before bits of wood start coming over the fence. I believe that Paul Tyrell and some of the Villa staff went down to speak to the Legia fans, but weren't able to find a way to negotiate for only those with legitimate tickets to get in - I may be wrong on that, but it's something I heard and ties in with the idea that the Legia ultras were operating an all-or-none policy in terms of what they wanted to do with tickets. The key police learning will be about how they process ticketed and ticketless fans at these games in future - for me, the best way to do it would have been to have Legia fans collect tickets in Birmingham City centre at lunchtime, then be bussed from the city centre to the ground prior to kick off - a bus that took them to the away car park, then a police escort, one bus load at a time, walking them across the road and into the stadium - if they'd done that, any other away fan anywhere near the ground could have been rounded up and taken away under a dispersal order. The big problem with that is that in order to co-ordinate it, you need the away club - only Legia can organise the distribution of Legia tickets. It would appear that Legia didn't want to do that, it would appear that Legia wanted a full allocation and it would appear that Legia were quite happy to support the illegal, forced entry of a thousand ticketless supporters in order to achieve it. The allocation was set, weeks in advance of the game - and Legia refused to accept that decision. On the night, for the police in the situation they were in, it's hard to see any other option for them - if they'd let all the fans in, there could have been widespread disruption and violence within the stadium, carried out by a group of unknown and unidentifiable individuals. Policing of UK football grounds is centred around the idea that the police can pick out a seat and find out from the club the name and address of the person in that seat - they aren't going to let in a thousand ticketless fans - let alone a thousand ticketless fans that are already involved in serious disorder. WMP deserve a lot of credit yesterday for their bravery in thought and action - they kept Villa fans safe. 18 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UpTheVilla26 Posted December 1, 2023 Share Posted December 1, 2023 15 minutes ago, JoshVilla said: I've just listened to the phone in on TalkSport (via YouTube, so not sure if it was the whole thing). Listening to the first Legia supporter that phoned in - I just don't understand the logic at all. He says that Villa only allocated 800 tickets to away fans, so 3,000 turned up hoping that they would be let in purely because there's a lot of them. Are you being serious? Do you really think that Villa, considering the trouble that Legia fans have caused over here previously, plus the trouble in the Alkmaar game recently, are going to just ignore that and put the safety of fans at risk inside the stadium and just let a load of fans in purely because there's a large number? I feel for the genuine fans that wanted to come over and watch a game of football and have a nice trip, I really do, but they obviously have big problems and their club are burying their heads in the sand and trying to shift the blame rather than tackling the issue. I'm sure that things probably could have been done better in some cases, but for grown men to act like that over a game of football? Grow the **** up. He was a bell-end that Legia fan, I'm glad Cundy & O'Hara basically told him he was chatting shit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OutByEaster? Posted December 1, 2023 Moderator Share Posted December 1, 2023 The man most responsible for last nights behaviour is a chap called Dariusz Mioduski, Legia Warsaw owner and President - the man responsible for how Legia distributed their tickets, the statements they made leading up to and around the game, and the chap who got involved with the Dutch police in Alkmaar. He's the vice-president of UEFA's European Club Association. Surely that position becomes untenable, you can't have a man who supports hooliganism and criminality in a leading position within UEFA's club management board. If we're talking about suitable punishments - that surely must be one of the first things that should happen? 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fightoffyour Posted December 1, 2023 VT Supporter Share Posted December 1, 2023 Also Warsaw is a shthole. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vive_La_Villa Posted December 1, 2023 Share Posted December 1, 2023 (edited) Still think the biggest blunder was cutting the fan allocation rather than just an outright ban. Many LW fans had been talking about turning up without soon as the reduction happened. It was a difficult one for the police and the main thing is they kept all the Villa fans safe. Edited December 1, 2023 by Vive_La_Villa 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sidcow Posted December 1, 2023 VT Supporter Share Posted December 1, 2023 (edited) 1 hour ago, OutByEaster? said: Legia fans started to arrive at the ground at around 15:00 and my understanding was that there were several hundred there in the afternoon, by about 18:00 it seems like the vast majority were there - by 18:30 the disorder had started. I got there at about 18:20 and went to have a peep out of curiosity, by that time, i seriously doubt that the group behind the police fans was in the mood to line up and show tickets. The stewards are briefed and in position in the away end at around 18:15 I believe - that really doesn't give WMP the opportunity to do much in terms of finding out who does and doesn't have tickets in those 15 minutes before bits of wood start coming over the fence. I believe that Paul Tyrell and some of the Villa staff went down to speak to the Legia fans, but weren't able to find a way to negotiate for only those with legitimate tickets to get in - I may be wrong on that, but it's something I heard and ties in with the idea that the Legia ultras were operating an all-or-none policy in terms of what they wanted to do with tickets. The key police learning will be about how they process ticketed and ticketless fans at these games in future - for me, the best way to do it would have been to have Legia fans collect tickets in Birmingham City centre at lunchtime, then be bussed from the city centre to the ground prior to kick off - a bus that took them to the away car park, then a police escort, one bus load at a time, walking them across the road and into the stadium - if they'd done that, any other away fan anywhere near the ground could have been rounded up and taken away under a dispersal order. The big problem with that is that in order to co-ordinate it, you need the away club - only Legia can organise the distribution of Legia tickets. It would appear that Legia didn't want to do that, it would appear that Legia wanted a full allocation and it would appear that Legia were quite happy to support the illegal, forced entry of a thousand ticketless supporters in order to achieve it. The allocation was set, weeks in advance of the game - and Legia refused to accept that decision. On the night, for the police in the situation they were in, it's hard to see any other option for them - if they'd let all the fans in, there could have been widespread disruption and violence within the stadium, carried out by a group of unknown and unidentifiable individuals. Policing of UK football grounds is centred around the idea that the police can pick out a seat and find out from the club the name and address of the person in that seat - they aren't going to let in a thousand ticketless fans - let alone a thousand ticketless fans that are already involved in serious disorder. WMP deserve a lot of credit yesterday for their bravery in thought and action - they kept Villa fans safe. Thanks. Obviously I didn't know about the no tickets issued when I made my OP. Insane that LW are allowed to compete. They really really need to be thrown put an the Polish Government need to get a handle on the Ultra's culture. Sounds far more like organised crime to me than passionate football supporters. Edited December 1, 2023 by sidcow 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vive_La_Villa Posted December 1, 2023 Share Posted December 1, 2023 3 minutes ago, OutByEaster? said: The man most responsible for last nights behaviour is a chap called Dariusz Mioduski, Legia Warsaw owner and President - the man responsible for how Legia distributed their tickets, the statements they made leading up to and around the game, and the chap who got involved with the Dutch police in Alkmaar. He's the vice-president of UEFA's European Club Association. Surely that position becomes untenable, you can't have a man who supports hooliganism and criminality in a leading position within UEFA's club management board. If we're talking about suitable punishments - that surely must be one of the first things that should happen? Not sure how true but I heard the right wing government is quite lenient on hooliganism as they need many of them to stay in power ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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