momo Posted August 20, 2023 Share Posted August 20, 2023 Just now, Captain_Townsend said: That's all well and good mate but the current core of Aston Villa is Kamara, Luiz, McGinn, Diaby and Watkins with Youri and Zaniola chomping at the bit. Who do you drop from there to start blooding young players with potential but unproven? I love Coutinho, but would think Archer should have come in before. And why buy Acuna and use him as a winger on the left when you have Bidace? I remember when Man U wasn't supposed to win anything with kids... those kids were Beckham, Neville's, Butt, Scholes, Giggs... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain_Townsend Posted August 20, 2023 Share Posted August 20, 2023 (edited) 8 minutes ago, momo said: I love Coutinho, but would think Archer should have come in before. And why buy Acuna and use him as a winger on the left when you have Bidace? I remember when Man U wasn't supposed to win anything with kids... those kids were Beckham, Neville's, Butt, Scholes, Giggs... At the time of post MON cost cutting our mantra was we would go down that route. We got rid of experienced players and persisted with Clark, Lowton, Bennett, Weimann and Westwood. What did we get? Some of the most miserable seasons I can remember. Edited August 20, 2023 by Captain_Townsend Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikeyp102 Posted August 20, 2023 Share Posted August 20, 2023 He wasn’t going to come on if it wasn’t for Coutinho injury. Clearly not fancied here. When he came on, he was trying too hard to impress. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Pinebro Posted August 20, 2023 Popular Post Share Posted August 20, 2023 (edited) 38 minutes ago, momo said: Archer, Ramsey's, Philogene-Bidace, Iroegbunam should be the future core of Aston Villa. Carney was supposed to be one of them too.. It's a shame to sell them off. What's better then players from your own academy? I can't see so many players this good coming through at the same time again in the future. We can't give them gametime which they need to develop. You don't just keep 5 youngsters in the hope that they'll make it one day. Staying here would just stall their careers. Seel them and put in a buy back clause like the rest of the big clubs do. Edited August 20, 2023 by Pinebro 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Albrighton Posted August 20, 2023 VT Supporter Share Posted August 20, 2023 28 minutes ago, cheltenham_villa said: I'm trying to work out if it is that big. I think any player we buy to replace Watkins would come in at over 50m these days. That's the only way I see him coming back tbh, if he's good enough to be our starting forward. I suppose I’m thinking we would be a bit like how I/we thought Man City would be with Luiz. Sell to us for 15m with an option of buying back at 25m, he does well, catches a few eyes, but him back for 25 and then immediately sell for 30m. Unless Archer suddenly scores 20 goals+ he isn’t going to command a price tag of over 50m. Therefore I would have thought the option of “flipping” him for a quick profit would unlikely be an option. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
momo Posted August 20, 2023 Share Posted August 20, 2023 31 minutes ago, Captain_Townsend said: At the time of post MON cost cutting our mantra was we would go down that route. We got rid of experienced players and persisted with Clark, Lowton, Bennett, Weimann and Westwood. What did we get? Some of the most miserable seasons I can remember. 2 of those were from the academy, and today's academy has so much more talent. Grealish, Carney, Tim, Archer, Bidace, Ramsey's... These are really good players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VillanousOne Posted August 20, 2023 Share Posted August 20, 2023 he looked completely un-interested, like he was resigned to leaving already, maybe that is just how he is/looks most of the time either way pointless keeping him if he is only going to make occasional pointless cameos Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PieFacE Posted August 20, 2023 VT Supporter Share Posted August 20, 2023 I'm very unsure he's going to cut it at PL level. Think he will be one of those players great in the Championship but not quite good though for PL. Early days though. Doesn't seem to have enough about his game imo. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain_Townsend Posted August 20, 2023 Share Posted August 20, 2023 (edited) 16 minutes ago, momo said: 2 of those were from the academy, and today's academy has so much more talent. Grealish, Carney, Tim, Archer, Bidace, Ramsey's... These are really good players. It's the same basic principle. We chose to go the young and hungry route in 2011 and it derailed us for the guts of a decade. We are now in a place where we have senior, established quality players on the squad. Who do you move to make space for players who may/May not have what it takes at this level? Edited August 20, 2023 by Captain_Townsend Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pinebro Posted August 20, 2023 Share Posted August 20, 2023 3 minutes ago, PieFacE said: I'm very unsure he's going to cut it at PL level. Think he will be one of those players great in the Championship but not quite good though for PL. Early days though. Doesn't seem to have enough about his game imo. He need to add more to his game. That's what emery don't like about him. He is very one dimensional Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StewieGriffin Posted August 20, 2023 Share Posted August 20, 2023 Duran coming on ahead of him was very telling. Looked pissed off when Emery was giving him his final instructions and then did nothing other than get a yellow card. Dont think he even played up top. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
useless Posted August 20, 2023 Share Posted August 20, 2023 Archer looked really happy for Duran after goal, when could have been feeling grumpy because he wasn't brought on instead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rodders Posted August 20, 2023 Share Posted August 20, 2023 It was a tough situation to impress when your team mates are just happy to clock off and control the game. He may well be off, but tough game to have an impact in a dead situation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nicho Posted August 20, 2023 Share Posted August 20, 2023 37 minutes ago, PieFacE said: I'm very unsure he's going to cut it at PL level. Think he will be one of those players great in the Championship but not quite good though for PL. Early days though. Doesn't seem to have enough about his game imo. He’s not a winger, get him around the box and he’ll score goals. Has he got what it takes to carry out what Unai is asking him to do is the question. Coutinho came on instead of him and looked bright. He’s injured now so maybe he will get another chance? I think we’ll sell him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thabucks Posted August 20, 2023 Share Posted August 20, 2023 If he was considered good enough he’d play - simples. If he’d come through under Smiths time as manager then things may have been different but we are operating and playing at a whole different level now. He’s not going to improve us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theboyangel Posted August 20, 2023 Share Posted August 20, 2023 54 minutes ago, PieFacE said: I'm very unsure he's going to cut it at PL level. Think he will be one of those players great in the Championship but not quite good though for PL. Early days though. Doesn't seem to have enough about his game imo. Could be the next Dwight Gayle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markavfc40 Posted August 20, 2023 Share Posted August 20, 2023 (edited) It said a lot that it was Duran, only back in training for a few days, who came on for Watkins. Archer wasn't going to come on at all as Chambers was about to come on then Coutinho got injured. It would definitely be unfair to judge him on the 14 mins (inc injury time) that he got today as we were just going through the motions. I think it is becoming clear though that Emery doesn't fancy him and if he wants someone to deputise for Ollie then I think Emery is right in thinking that Archer isn't that player as whilst he is a good finisher he doesn't have that all round game that Ollie has. I have said before that the game is littered with strikers, both past and present, who can do it at Championship level but aren't quite good enough for the Premier league. That may not be the case with Archer but we aren't just wanting players to now be good enough for a mid to lower table Prem club we are wanting players to be good enough for a club striving to finish top 6 and I don't see that he is that or has enough about him to develop to become that. Edited August 20, 2023 by markavfc40 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
troon_villan Posted August 20, 2023 Share Posted August 20, 2023 Yawning on the bench 8 mins into the game and generally looking miserable and uninterested. Probably means absolutely nothing and just the younger gens way but was noticeable. I hope he gets more time on Wednesday all the same. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheltenham_villa Posted August 20, 2023 Share Posted August 20, 2023 1 hour ago, Mark Albrighton said: I suppose I’m thinking we would be a bit like how I/we thought Man City would be with Luiz. Sell to us for 15m with an option of buying back at 25m, he does well, catches a few eyes, but him back for 25 and then immediately sell for 30m. Unless Archer suddenly scores 20 goals+ he isn’t going to command a price tag of over 50m. Therefore I would have thought the option of “flipping” him for a quick profit would unlikely be an option. Wasn't it 25 and then 35. I think the key is it has to work for both, if I'm sheff united and you tell me you want a buy back, I'd want it to be worth my while. 50m sounds worth my while, 30m doesn't, maybe 40 is about right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted August 20, 2023 Author Share Posted August 20, 2023 4 hours ago, Newry_Villan said: Didn't look happy coming on and a bit of "side eye" at Duran at the end. He was celebrating with Duran when he scored as he was the nearest sub 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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