Douglas Luiz

[YouUnastanFren]

5 minutes ago, QldVilla said:

I like Merino at Sociedad, believe he would suit that type of role. Has PL experience as was at Newcastle albeit, didn’t look great, but seems to be with anyone who goes to the Toon. 
 

The players are there.

Performs well in colder climates but is a bit soft

[sparrow1988]

3 minutes ago, YouUnastanFren said:

Performs well in colder climates but is a bit soft

Provides a nice secure warm feeling though.

[Indigo]

2 hours ago, TRO said:

I don't watch Brazil enough to know, but I watch him playing for us and I am confident, its not working.....That is not to say, he is a bad player.....That is not the narrative here.

He is 22 and I could change my opinion, I thought he was a very decent player after Lockdown last season and I saw a distinct improvement in his game, suffice to say, he could have been our best player, in that final run in.....not idea why he has dropped off, his intensity.

I really don't buy in to this theory, that he is always available for a pass, he is, but that is not enough in that role.....That role requires more challenges and a belligerence to stop the opposition, Dougie might be comfortable on the ball, which is great, but for me, he doesn't affect the game enough, he is passive....and where he plays is too far back to be a danger to the opposition.

I accept, we all see the game differently.....but right now there is a groundswell of opinion, leaning towards our midfield being light....there is only 3 players in there, so take your pick.

I agree, as I said I was only really responding to the kind of thing you occasionally see in this thread along the lines of "he isn't a DM, he doesn't even play there for Brazil" which is off the mark and a bit of an over simplistic explanation considering the drop off from what as you say was a high standard of performance in that exact position post lockdown.

The real concern to me isn't necessarily Luiz's drop in level but that of the whole midfield in whatever combination they seem to be played in at the moment, which is more indicative of a wider issue with the system or otherwise than each individual player. I thought Luiz/McGinn/Sanson worked great in the first half vs Wolves before alarmingly falling off a cliff in the second, and beyond that I can't really think of the last time we functioned particularly well in that area of the pitch.

[VillanousOne]

14 minutes ago, Indigo said:

I agree, as I said I was only really responding to the kind of thing you occasionally see in this thread along the lines of "he isn't a DM, he doesn't even play there for Brazil" which is off the mark and a bit of an over simplistic explanation considering the drop off from what as you say was a high standard of performance in that exact position post lockdown.

The real concern to me isn't necessarily Luiz's drop in level but that of the whole midfield in whatever combination they seem to be played in at the moment, which is more indicative of a wider issue with the system or otherwise than each individual player. I thought Luiz/McGinn/Sanson worked great in the first half vs Wolves before alarmingly falling off a cliff in the second, and beyond that I can't really think of the last time we functioned particularly well in that area of the pitch.

Of course there are layers to this, post lockdown we weren't exactly creating a lot of goals, we just stopped conceding as many and a few players stepped up to get us out of jail, but there wasn't a huge improvement from midfield, certainly in terms of goals (granted we defended as a team).

I remember when Doug first joined and he would bomb forward and shoot from distance, I know he still gets the occasional assist but it feels like his wings have been clipped a little.

But I agree his form as just as much to do with the lack of balance in midfield and constant chopping and changing as it is his own individual form.

I also think he has the ability to play DM, just not a specialist DM I think he would be wasted as that, more a box to box midfielder who is an allrounder. The issue is we don't have the players around him to create the right balance.

That aside his head has dropped of late so there is still something wrong we maybe not seeing.
 

Edited April 16, 2021 by VillanousOne

[TRO]

3 hours ago, Indigo said:

I agree, as I said I was only really responding to the kind of thing you occasionally see in this thread along the lines of "he isn't a DM, he doesn't even play there for Brazil" which is off the mark and a bit of an over simplistic explanation considering the drop off from what as you say was a high standard of performance in that exact position post lockdown.

The real concern to me isn't necessarily Luiz's drop in level but that of the whole midfield in whatever combination they seem to be played in at the moment, which is more indicative of a wider issue with the system or otherwise than each individual player. I thought Luiz/McGinn/Sanson worked great in the first half vs Wolves before alarmingly falling off a cliff in the second, and beyond that I can't really think of the last time we functioned particularly well in that area of the pitch.

Too samey as individuals, is my suspicion.....they need variety, from each other.

i mean, who can head the ball?.....who can win the ball?.....we need variety.

[TRO]

On 25/03/2021 at 19:17, MrBlack said:

Nakamba needs to come back in. He hasn't had a bad game all season. Play him alongside Luiz, give Luiz freedom to take the ball off him and get forward and we may just see ourselves holding on to the ball a bit longer than 10 seconds.

Sanson the forward of the trio and I think that's our best midfield at the moment.  McGinn needs a rest. Ramsey needs a bit more experience but has the potential to be really good.  The less said about Ross the better. 

Be good if Grealish was then the middle man in front of them when he's back, but Luiz given a bit more freedom would do us the world of good and play more to his strengths. 

 

precisely.

[TRO]

Some folk talk about Luiz playing the "Volante" role for Brazil, "Volante" is described there as defensive midfielder, everywhere else in South America a "Volante " is just a central midfielder.....There is a distinction in interpretation.

There maybe confusion here.....as some Vasco De Gama fans say he is not a no6, he is a number 8 ( meaning his best position)......personally, thats what I see him as.

[TRO]

On 16/04/2021 at 15:14, VillanousOne said:

Of course there are layers to this, post lockdown we weren't exactly creating a lot of goals, we just stopped conceding as many and a few players stepped up to get us out of jail, but there wasn't a huge improvement from midfield, certainly in terms of goals (granted we defended as a team).

I remember when Doug first joined and he would bomb forward and shoot from distance, I know he still gets the occasional assist but it feels like his wings have been clipped a little.

But I agree his form as just as much to do with the lack of balance in midfield and constant chopping and changing as it is his own individual form.

I also think he has the ability to play DM, just not a specialist DM I think he would be wasted as that, more a box to box midfielder who is an allrounder. The issue is we don't have the players around him to create the right balance.

That aside his head has dropped of late so there is still something wrong we maybe not seeing.
 

I think, everyone has the ability to play in a different position at a pro football club, the burning question is at what level ot to what standard?....It use to be something Martin O'Neill used to encourage, for young players to learn the game.

but its a specialist position that needs the key attributes to be employed to create the crucial balance to the team......its a variety of these attributes that gives a team Balance....as an example Rodrigo is a stark difference to Foden, but both play in and around the midfield, subject to interpretation......ours are all to similar....we have mostly CM's few CDM's or CAM's.......Its essential to get the balance right, else eventually your form dips.....Oops.

Edited April 18, 2021 by TRO

[villalad21]

1 hour ago, TRO said:

Some folk talk about Luiz playing the "Volante" role for Brazil, "Volante" is described there as defensive midfielder, everywhere else in South America a "Volante " is just a central midfielder.....There is a distinction in interpretation.

There maybe confusion here.....as some Vasco De Gama fans say he is not a no6, he is a number 8 ( meaning his best position)......personally, thats what I see him as.

Spot on. 

Some of us been saying it for over a year now. 

[TRO]

2 minutes ago, villalad21 said:

Spot on. 

Some of us been saying it for over a year now. 

It falls on deaf ears, in the main.....some have picked up on it to be fair.

Edited April 18, 2021 by TRO

[VillaChris]

1 hour ago, TRO said:

Some folk talk about Luiz playing the "Volante" role for Brazil, "Volante" is described there as defensive midfielder, everywhere else in South America a "Volante " is just a central midfielder.....There is a distinction in interpretation.

There maybe confusion here.....as some Vasco De Gama fans say he is not a no6, he is a number 8 ( meaning his best position)......personally, thats what I see him as.

Yeah Brazil in last few games he's started always have Casemiro as the pure DM and Doug plays slightly infront, still mainly defensive but gets forward when he can.

I still think he could do that for us but McGinn is also supposed to play that role....and Sanson also seems that type so if we're not careful it's going to be a very samey midfield even though ironically none of them can actually score these days.

[Rightdm00]

1 hour ago, TRO said:

Some folk talk about Luiz playing the "Volante" role for Brazil, "Volante" is described there as defensive midfielder, everywhere else in South America a "Volante " is just a central midfielder.....There is a distinction in interpretation.

There maybe confusion here.....as some Vasco De Gama fans say he is not a no6, he is a number 8 ( meaning his best position)......personally, thats what I see him as.

Brazil is the only Portuguese speaking South American country. So it's not as simple to say it's a one to one comparison amongst all the countries of South America. 

[villalad21]

1 hour ago, VillaChris said:

Yeah Brazil in last few games he's started always have Casemiro as the pure DM and Doug plays slightly infront, still mainly defensive but gets forward when he can.

I still think he could do that for us but McGinn is also supposed to play that role....and Sanson also seems that type so if we're not careful it's going to be a very samey midfield even though ironically none of them can actually score these days.

Would love to watch a Brazil game with Luiz and Casemiro together.

Be interesting to see the dynamic and how they work their roles out

[Sam-AVFC]

5 minutes ago, villalad21 said:

Would love to watch a Brazil game with Luiz and Casemiro together.

Be interesting to see the dynamic and how they work their roles out

The one I've seen was pretty underwhelming.

[VillaChris]

14 minutes ago, villalad21 said:

Would love to watch a Brazil game with Luiz and Casemiro together.

Be interesting to see the dynamic and how they work their roles out

 

[Vive_La_Villa]

28 minutes ago, villalad21 said:

Would love to watch a Brazil game with Luiz and Casemiro together.

Be interesting to see the dynamic and how they work their roles out

Watched a bit and it looks quite simple. Casemiro sits in the middle with 2 midfields either side of with a bit more license to get forward. He is the one on the left. 

[villalad21]

7 minutes ago, Vive_La_Villa said:

Watched a bit and it looks quite simple. Casemiro sits in the middle with 2 midfields either side of with a bit more license to get forward. He is the one on the left. 

I think that is his best position buddy.

Luiz have so many wonderul attributes that he don't get to use in a limited DM role.

[Rightdm00]

6 minutes ago, villalad21 said:

I think that is his best position buddy.

Luiz have so many wonderul attributes that he don't get to use in a limited DM role.

Your insistent on forcing Luiz out of his natural role makes sense now.  You see the DM position as a non-footballer role for an athletic tackler who wins the ball and immediately gives it up. 

It doesn't have to be played that way.  When Luiz is on his game he literally runs the entire attack from deep. If anything, you leave Luiz right where he is and give him a front 3 of attackers he can release down the channels. 

It amazes me that a footballer can declare his favored position, his manager agree, and some football fans can go " no you're both wrong."

 

[JAMAICAN-VILLAN]

2 hours ago, villalad21 said:

Would love to watch a Brazil game with Luiz and Casemiro together.

Be interesting to see the dynamic and how they work their roles out

We need to make it a point to all tune in next time they play.

[Indigo]

1 hour ago, Rightdm00 said:

Your insistent on forcing Luiz out of his natural role makes sense now.  You see the DM position as a non-footballer role for an athletic tackler who wins the ball and immediately gives it up. 

It doesn't have to be played that way.  When Luiz is on his game he literally runs the entire attack from deep. If anything, you leave Luiz right where he is and give him a front 3 of attackers he can release down the channels. 

It amazes me that a footballer can declare his favored position, his manager agree, and some football fans can go " no you're both wrong."

 

Yeah, to be fair it's not even that there's anything wrong with disagreeing with them as if you think Luiz has the attributes more suited to an 8 then fair enough you're entitled to do so, but there's a bit of a strange trend in this thread where if you think he's a 6 you've apparently got your head in the sand somehow despite him mostly playing there, having his best performances there, and largely being described as one by more people than not.