zab6359 Posted January 16, 2021 Share Posted January 16, 2021 1 hour ago, QldVilla said: Disagree. You don’t know how much the poor quality of service affected his game, no PL experience etc etc, as it did many other players last season who have shown with time that they deserve to be Villa players this season. Wesley showed flashes of a quality player in a poor team just as much as Luiz. That's simply not true! However he was on course to get double figures which surely (should he get back to that standard) makes him a better option off the bench than KD. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steero113 Posted January 16, 2021 Share Posted January 16, 2021 2 hours ago, KenjiOgiwara said: Mid august to the point he got injured is not 3 months. Keep saying it won't make it right. On 25/12/2019 at 17:19, KenjiOgiwara said: What has always fascinated me is that most of these posters who seem to crave immediate success and point to us being a big club etc. they come across as too young to have actually seen us win anything. Shit I am 35 and the only thing I've seen us lift are a couple of league cups. I can understand if some of the titans on here they remember 57 and 81 etc. expect more cause they've seen it. But the rest of us? He played 21 league games for us in his first season in the PL. Your posts are all over the place and your blind dislike for this player is starting to piss a lot of people off. Support the players Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KenjiOgiwara Posted January 16, 2021 Share Posted January 16, 2021 Not sure what your point is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steero113 Posted January 16, 2021 Share Posted January 16, 2021 1 minute ago, KenjiOgiwara said: Not sure what your point is. Player joins the club, new country, new language, new league, new culture, new expectation levels, everything. Player then scores 5 in 21 and clearly shows enough potential to be given the benefit of previous said points and time to settle in before we see the best of him. Player then gets horrible injury denying himself the chance to finish the season and develop in his new team/country. You categorically pan the player even after he gets a career threatening injury. Your earlier post then clearly takes aim at criticizing fans who expect instant success....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJ_Villain Posted January 16, 2021 Share Posted January 16, 2021 1 minute ago, Steero113 said: Player joins the club, new country, new language, new league, new culture, new expectation levels, everything. Player then scores 5 in 21 and clearly shows enough potential to be given the benefit of previous said points and time to settle in before we see the best of him. Player then gets horrible injury denying himself the chance to finish the season and develop in his new team/country. You categorically pan the player even after he gets a career threatening injury. Your earlier post then clearly takes aim at criticizing fans who expect instant success....... I agree with all of that aside from the new language part... Correct me if I am wrong but Wesleys level of English was streets ahead of that of Douglas Luiz and Trezeguet when they signed... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sulberto21 Posted January 16, 2021 Share Posted January 16, 2021 A lot of us had the expectation that he'll get us between 10-15 goals for the season. He was well on his way to getting at least 12 imo with 6/7 assists. I think that would have been a reputable first season. Grealish's goal against Brighton last season came about because Wesley took a defender away with him which allowed Jack to ghost in and tap in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCJonah Posted January 16, 2021 Share Posted January 16, 2021 No chance was he getting 12 goals. He scored in 4 games with a hattrick against the worst team in the league. Also unlike Watkins, when he wasn't scoring he did nothing for the team, which was a huge problem for us and a reason we were so poor. He has a clean slate with me and I think he will be fine as back up but pretending he wasn't woeful last year is pointless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AJ Posted January 16, 2021 Share Posted January 16, 2021 When he was frequently falling to the ground fishing for a foul, he was shit. When he did actually play football, he was quite good. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steero113 Posted January 16, 2021 Share Posted January 16, 2021 2 minutes ago, DCJonah said: No chance was he getting 12 goals. He scored in 4 games with a hattrick against the worst team in the league. Also unlike Watkins, when he wasn't scoring he did nothing for the team, which was a huge problem for us and a reason we were so poor. He has a clean slate with me and I think he will be fine as back up but pretending he wasn't woeful last year is pointless. I agree that he was poor, but to just post vitriol and dislike towards the guy when he was clearly settling is just as pointless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCJonah Posted January 16, 2021 Share Posted January 16, 2021 1 minute ago, Steero113 said: I agree that he was poor, but to just post vitriol and dislike towards the guy when he was clearly settling is just as pointless. Yep. He annoyed me a lot last year but it wasn't his fault that as a club we made him the only striker we signed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KenjiOgiwara Posted January 16, 2021 Share Posted January 16, 2021 13 minutes ago, Steero113 said: Player joins the club, new country, new language, new league, new culture, new expectation levels, everything. Player then scores 5 in 21 and clearly shows enough potential to be given the benefit of previous said points and time to settle in before we see the best of him. Player then gets horrible injury denying himself the chance to finish the season and develop in his new team/country. You categorically pan the player even after he gets a career threatening injury. Your earlier post then clearly takes aim at criticizing fans who expect instant success....... I think there's a difference between wanting/expecting instant success of a club and assessing a player's quality. But I completely agree that the stuff you mention there will affect a player arriving at a new club. And like I've said on this thread more times than I can count. My issues with Wesley after observing him for 6 months, was never down to him scoring 5 in 21. Obviously it's nice with more goals, but for me it was his general play that was the problem. The attributes I felt was key for his role and this league, he simply didn't have. At all. This is starting to be some while ago, but if I remember correctly he had a pretty good match around Christmas time 2019, then he got that awful injury. And for a bunch of people here his abilities and performances has grown almost mythically the longer he has been injured. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tommo_b Posted January 16, 2021 Share Posted January 16, 2021 3 hours ago, KenjiOgiwara said: No. I mean in the sense you can't count. Or are just straight up lying to defend a point. I can say my opinion on Wesley. It's after all an opinion. You can however not make a set amount of time become something else. That's not up for opinions. It is what it is. Lol get over the time frame, the point still stands, 3 months 4 months 5 months whatever months, it’s too soon to pass a fair judgement in comparison to if he was playing in the current squad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KenjiOgiwara Posted January 16, 2021 Share Posted January 16, 2021 3 minutes ago, Tommo_b said: Lol get over the time frame, the point still stands, 3 months 4 months 5 months whatever months, it’s too soon to pass a fair judgement in comparison to if he was playing in the current squad. I just tried to point out it wasn't accurate. If wrong numbers don't bother you, fair enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tommo_b Posted January 16, 2021 Share Posted January 16, 2021 3 minutes ago, KenjiOgiwara said: I just tried to point out it wasn't accurate. If wrong numbers don't bother you, fair enough. Do wrong numbers bother you then? You’ve watched him for 6 months, that’s more time then the rest of us! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted January 16, 2021 Share Posted January 16, 2021 56 minutes ago, DJ_Villain said: I agree with all of that aside from the new language part... Correct me if I am wrong but Wesleys level of English was streets ahead of that of Douglas Luiz and Trezeguet when they signed... pretty sure Jota was translating for him for the 1st few months Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KenjiOgiwara Posted January 16, 2021 Share Posted January 16, 2021 (edited) 4 minutes ago, Tommo_b said: Do wrong numbers bother you then? You’ve watched him for 6 months, that’s more time then the rest of us! Some people watch pre-season. Not my fault you don't is it? Edited January 16, 2021 by KenjiOgiwara Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tommo_b Posted January 16, 2021 Share Posted January 16, 2021 10 minutes ago, KenjiOgiwara said: Some people watch pre-season. Not my fault you don't is it? Sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted January 16, 2021 Share Posted January 16, 2021 28 minutes ago, KenjiOgiwara said: Some people watch pre-season. Not my fault you don't is it? 2 goals in 4 pre season games and looked decent vs RB Leipzig Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KenjiOgiwara Posted January 16, 2021 Share Posted January 16, 2021 2 minutes ago, Zatman said: 2 goals in 4 pre season games and looked decent vs RB Leipzig Completely agree. He had a killer penalty as well. Which made the shite one against Norwich so baffling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keener window-cleaner Posted January 16, 2021 Share Posted January 16, 2021 1 hour ago, DCJonah said: No chance was he getting 12 goals. He scored in 4 games with a hattrick against the worst team in the league. Also unlike Watkins, when he wasn't scoring he did nothing for the team, which was a huge problem for us and a reason we were so poor. He has a clean slate with me and I think he will be fine as back up but pretending he wasn't woeful last year is pointless. I don't agree with that, if he got 5 goals in the first half of the season he could as well get 5 or 6 in the second half, he would have played against the same shit teams again (though he also scored a very good goal against Arsenal for example). Also given the improvement of our players after the corona break would suggest he could have continued to score goals. Also don't agree that he did nothing when he didn't score. On the contrary I think it became apparent how much we missed his presence up front. He is a unit and occupied many defenders, making space for others, which is a valuable contribution even if he didn't get so many touches. I would say he contributed far more than what Samatta or Davis did. Another example, against Manu away when we played quite well even some of my Man u friends pointed out that he made it difficult for their defence, even though he in that game if I remember correctly didn't have many or any shots at goal. I agree Watkins contributes far more, I currently hold Watkins in much higher regard than Wesley. But as has been pointed out so many times, new country, new culture, new style of football, being young, getting thrown in in a new unsettled team - some just have unrealistic expectations. My assessment is that he sometimes looked like he couldn't either control the ball, pass, run or jump, but then at times also played exquisite passes, made intelligent runs and showed nice control. Against Burnely he was unplayable until the thug Mee breaked his leg. All in all there were definitely enough glimpses to fully support him and have hope that he will come good. Add to that his very good attitude. The prospect of having him as cover and competition for Watkins is very encouraging imo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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