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Racism Part two


Demitri_C

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From the article:

'Asked what it would mean to have a black man or woman as chairman, Mings said: "Of course it would be a huge step. It would be everything that a lot of people have worked for.

"We're not necessarily asking for the next chairman or chief to be black," Aston Villa's Mings added: "What we're asking for is equal opportunities for both black and white people, or ethnic minorities."'

Hard to see what people are upset about, or why you would be upset about those comments.

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2 minutes ago, HanoiVillan said:

Hard to see what people are upset about, or why you would be upset about those comments.

Exactly why we have an issue with racism in this country. People see anything related to 'black' or 'equality' and their backs are up because '...the blacks are going on and on again.'

They think that they should be higher, and any comments that challenge that hierarchy threaten that.

It isn't outward, direct racism so it's harder to spot and harder to combat but it 100% exists.

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We've made a lot of progress but there's still a lot of the petty discrimination (of all sorts) out there. A lot of the current 'trans debate' only reveals it starkly - a lot of people that would consider themselves 'left' even have problems with trans issues.

It doesn't help that, in case of racism, a lot of people still don't 'get' it. Or actively don't recognise it - the things that Mings is raising are simply outright rejected by a lot of people. Despite being a completely obvious issue.

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2 minutes ago, stuart_75 said:

That's worth a thread all to itself for people to rant about.

I used to be quite frightened to mention anything to do with trans issues On Here, but the last time the subject came up, the conversation was significantly more enlightened than the Guardian's Opinion page tends to be to be fair.

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1 minute ago, HanoiVillan said:

I used to be quite frightened to mention anything to do with trans issues On Here, but the last time the subject came up, the conversation was significantly more enlightened than the Guardian's Opinion page tends to be to be fair.

Trans women competing in women's sport is one huge can of worms...

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2 minutes ago, stuart_75 said:

Trans women competing in women's sport is one huge can of worms...

That is nothing compared to which public convenience or changing room they should use.

And it has to be said, that its mainly the female of the species that has an issue with it

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3 minutes ago, bickster said:

That is nothing compared to which public convenience or changing room they should use.

And it has to be said, that its mainly the female of the species that has an issue with it

The thing that gets me, is this overriding opinion that Trans people are paedos/perves who go through massive emotional, physical and mental changes just to get into girls' toilets. It's mad.

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3 minutes ago, StefanAVFC said:

The thing that gets me, is this overriding opinion that Trans people are paedos/perves who go through massive emotional, physical and mental changes just to get into girls' toilets. It's mad.

The changing rooms/toilets/sports issue is the hardest thing to cover really, it's a huge can of worms and as a man, it isn't my position to judge or given an opinion on really.  What I don't want to happen is, for women to feel "punished" by having a "morally correct" code to observe, which many of them don't agree with. 

A lot of women out there feel as though their rights and achievements are being eroded by the whole issue and that's a shame. 

There needs to be a huge conversation between women and transgender people to see what lines are drawn. 

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(I appreciate there's another thread now, so I won't add more here, but just following on from above)

The 'debate' about bathroom access is not a particularly complicated one. The Equality Act of 2010 makes clear that trans women are women, that it is illegal to exclude people on the basis of protected characteristics (with a small set of possible exemptions which do not include bathrooms) and as such trans women should access women's facilities. Cis women have no more right to harrass trans women in women's bathrooms than they would have to harrass lesbians or black women or any other group. For that matter, nor do men have any right to harrass trans men.

The idea that there is a 'debate' to be had on this issue is ultimately an attempt to take away rights that people have had for 10 years, and an attempt to create a sub-group of people who can be harrassed in public. I accept that there's more of a genuine debate around trans issues in sport, though even there the principle should be the widest possible access unless specific harms can be proven.

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one of the things they changed int he last decade is there is no such thing as a "disabled" toilet anymore, they changed the wording to "accessible" but they've failed to convey that these toilets are for everyone, even someone like myself who just enjoys the extra room and beating the queue 

they will become more prevalent, they will shake off the stigma and the whole thing should disappear, its currently 5 toilets and 5 wash basins per 100 people or 4 urinals per 100 men

new build wet changing rooms have already gone unisex using cubicle systems with then group changing areas, from my experience the biggest moaners about that was old men who felt that they could walk around naked anymore, dry changing rooms are still split

the answer from building control and design is that you just dont categorise by sex at all, not male or female or any other division or variant from that, they dont recognise any of them

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14 minutes ago, villa4europe said:

one of the things they changed int he last decade is there is no such thing as a "disabled" toilet anymore, they changed the wording to "accessible" but they've failed to convey that these toilets are for everyone, even someone like myself who just enjoys the extra room and beating the queue 

Just ‘cus....

 

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2 hours ago, HanoiVillan said:

From the article:

'Asked what it would mean to have a black man or woman as chairman, Mings said: "Of course it would be a huge step. It would be everything that a lot of people have worked for.

"We're not necessarily asking for the next chairman or chief to be black," Aston Villa's Mings added: "What we're asking for is equal opportunities for both black and white people, or ethnic minorities."'

Hard to see what people are upset about, or why you would be upset about those comments.

on the people being upset theme

 

The other day Southampton went top of the league and posted a rather witty "Stop the count" post on their official feed  .. Quite topical and quite clever

 

I made the mistake of looking at the comments section ,  1st one was calling them a a small club and clearly the poster missed the joke  ...  by about the 3rd comment it was " stop the kneeling " and loads of agreement and  full on racism .... that was the point I reminded myself why I don't usually click on comment sections and I went and looked at something else instead

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49 minutes ago, villa4europe said:

one of the things they changed int he last decade is there is no such thing as a "disabled" toilet anymore, they changed the wording to "accessible" but they've failed to convey that these toilets are for everyone, even someone like myself who just enjoys the extra room and beating the queue 

 

sorry to deflect the topic  , but was it just me that had this spring to mind

 

 

Edited by tonyh29
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6 minutes ago, tonyh29 said:

on the people being upset theme

 

The other day Southampton went top of the league and posted a rather witty "Stop the count" post on their official feed  .. Quite topical and quite clever

 

I made the mistake of looking at the comments section ,  1st one was calling them a a small club and clearly the poster missed the joke  ...  by about the 3rd comment it was " stop the kneeling " and loads of agreement and  full on racism .... that was the point I reminded myself why I don't usually click on comment sections and I went and looked at something else instead

Lesson 1 of the internet:- Stay away from the twitter comments section. I genuinely think my mental health has improved.

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17 minutes ago, MCU said:

Lesson 1 of the internet:- Stay away from the twitter comments section. I genuinely think my mental health has improved.

Ha ...... As a rule I stay away from Twitter on the whole , it was a syndicated type  article that then lured me into the click trap :)

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