Israel, Palestine and Iran

[mjmooney]

[Keyblade]

Bet a bunch of civilians heard (and felt) it too. Smh

[villakram]

2 hours ago, Keyblade said:

Bet a bunch of civilians heard (and felt) it too. Smh

I would love to know what is going through the heads of the people who authorize these propaganda accounts. 

[omariqy]

Apartheid state

[OutByEaster?]

Frankie Boyle has been complaining that the BBC edited out the material in his New World Order show that focused on Israel, including a monologue on Gaza and the apartheid state, despite assurances to the contrary beforehand. 

[Brumerican]

10 minutes ago, OutByEaster? said:

Frankie Boyle has been complaining that the BBC edited out the material in his New World Order show that focused on Israel, including a monologue on Gaza and the apartheid state, despite assurances to the contrary beforehand. 

This is an organisation that harboured Jimmy Savile for years , knowing full well what he was up to .

The BBC is just another Lodge.

[bickster]

The US Politics topic is full of comments about the current situation in Israel. As much as the US is an integral part of this situation, the subject requires a separate topic methinks

[villakram]

23 hours ago, bickster said:

The US Politics topic is full of comments about the current situation in Israel. As much as the US is an integral part of this situation, the subject requires a separate topic methinks

Fair comment, but I would suggest that leaving the US off the thread title is a little BBC like, tut, tut 

[bickster]

1 hour ago, villakram said:

Fair comment, but I would suggest that leaving the US off the thread title is a little BBC like, tut, tut 

You can suggest all you like but I'd suggest everyone using this thread knows the US is heavily invested here. How about posting something on topic instead of sniping at someone who just did everyone a favour taking up quite a bit of my freetime in doing so

[TheAuthority]

I'm not sure if you guys can watch this link over in the UK & Ireland but it's a fine documentary by the folks at Frontline at PBS. Laying out the Saudi/Iran conflict via proxy war that threatens world stability not just the middle east.

http://www.pbs.org/video/bitter-rivals-iran-and-saudi-arabia-pqsnhk/

It's 2 parts probably totally about 4hours. Also a good place to start if the situation doesn't seem to make sense.

[omariqy]

 

[sne]

So another 2500 illegal homes to be built on occupied settlements on the West bank in 2018 according to Lieberman.

.

Edited May 24, 2018 by sne

[omariqy]

3 minutes ago, sne said:

So another 2500 illegal homes to be built on occupied settlements on the West bank in 2018 according to Lieberman.

.

Looking forward to @Glarmorgan arguing against this

[Glarmorgan]

Hi to you all. Sorry for my brief absence. It was a bit hecitic at work.

First - Thanks to moderator BOF who helped me out with the post from last week with all the links to MEMRI. 

I will try to catch up on things. Still, before I'll get to business - I have to say it all over again - I expect one thing from any of you - to have the modesty (I hope I am using the right word) when trying to teach me how things work in Israel. I will give you some biographic details:

1. I am 42 years old. 43 this upcoming Sunday.
2. I am married with 3 kids.
3. I work as a high-school teacher in the city of Ramla. Ramla is a mixed city, hosting both Jews and Arabs.
4.I served as a combatant in the IDF. As a regular between 1993-1996 (age 18-21) and as a reserves soldier from 1996 up until a couple of years ago. I served in the engineering core and took part, mostly as a part of the first or second line. I saw things with my own eyes. Made decisions in the situations as the ones you see on TV, led soldiers into dangerous situations.
5. I despise Netanyahu as a person. I never voted from him and I will never will. This does not make any of his actions a mistake, but I would be glad if another PM will take his place sooner rather than later. I support a two-state solution. One as a home for Arab-Palestinians and the second as a home for Israeli-Jews, while still being democratic and giving for civil rights to any minorities living here - Druze, Arab and so on.
6. I support Aston Villa ever since I was a child. I also have a soft spot for Hartlepool United, but... well, I have no idea why I wrote that.

I write this as I appreciate that chance for us all do discuss this situation, but at the same time - to bring you to understand that I am not some sort of an undercover Israeli agent, nor a hot-headed 20 year-old who thinks was is just like playing Call of Duty. My life holds constant involvement in Jewish-Arab interaction, right within the school I teach in. When my wife gave birth to our first born daughter (who is almost 11 years old), in the bed next to hers was an Arab woman in labor. I played, as I stated earlier, in a mixed football team named "Beitar Oranit" under an Arab manager, who was a guest at my wedding. Since I find myself, all too often, under a heavy set of "Apartheid" fire, I tend to retreat to the "defend my home country" stance, and this drives the entire conversation to a conversation of nothing. About nothing. You say "Yes" and I say "No" and vice-versa.

If you wish to hear, to learn, to better understand - I will gladly take part of it. It does not mean you have to agree or to approve my opinion or Israel's actions. It does mean that in order for this to be fruitful - you have to accept that you don't know a lot of things, due to all sorts of reason. I read your comments and it's clear. Most of you have never been here. You have never seen Gaza with your own eyes. You have never strolled through the streets of Tel Aviv or Haifa or Lod. You are too unfamiliar with our parliament and obviously, you don't know the range of opinions around here. You know Israel is the strong force and is an occupier of a land ever since 1967 or 1948 (it depends whether one acknowledges Israel's right to exist or not) and the Palestinians are weak and fight for their freedom. This is partly true, but I can totally understand how this looks from afar.

OK. Got that out of the system. Off to reply to some of your comments.
 

[Glarmorgan]

22 hours ago, omariqy said:

Looking forward to @Glarmorgan arguing against this

Oh. I can easily argue with this - it won't happen. 

The current political situation is as follows - Netanyahu, Bennet and Lieberman are fighting for the same voters. They are right wing people so they have to cry out right-wing sayings. Adding 2500 news homes is a part of these sayings, but this involves other stuff you are unfamiliar with.

For example - these three are fighting a war of "who'll get the harshest stance against the Supreme Court rulings", since the right wing parties try to draw the Supreme Court as a body which holds them from fulfilling their policies. This is untrue, but it's easier to blame the Supreme Court rather than admitting of their inability to rule properly.

I can give you a bunch of other examples, but I hope you get the picture right now. Lieberman, according to the latest surveys, hangs on a thread. If elections would take place today, he might not get into the parliament due to lack of voters, so he's trying to change the laws, to allows smaller parties to get in (hence, increasing his chances). 

2500 homes? Give me a call when this will happen. I'll buy you a pint of anything you'd like (as long as it can be done via Paypal...) 

[Glarmorgan]

On 17/05/2018 at 13:23, mjmooney said:

Nope. We are entitled to the land here thanks to a UN resolution.

 

[Glarmorgan]

On 17/05/2018 at 01:04, snowychap said:

I don't understand Arabic (I'm guessing that's what language the interviews were conducted in) so have to rely on the translation of thia 'Memri TV' lot. I know nothing of them so I had a look at the Wiki page on them (you were fine with Wiki as a source earlier) and it says this in the opening:

 

Maybe, maybe not.

OK, so here's a link from CNN, stating the Hammas leader claimed that 50 of the dead were Hammas operatives. I am sorry, you can't just claim "MEMRI might be lying" just because it contradicts your opinion or thoughts. MEMRI is built on being credible. If you, or I, will find out it's lying, we will both ignore it. The problem is that the Palestinians tend to say things clearly enough. The western world tend to try and give its own interpretation to these words, as it's inconceivable that someone will say things so bluntly. Just listen to their words. If you wish for me to bring other sources to give such examples - I will do it. I am using "Google" and things come up.

 

Link to CNN
 

Quote

Gaza (CNN)A senior member of Hamas' political bureau said during a TV interview on Wednesday that 50 people killed by Israeli soldiers during clashes in Gaza on Monday were members of Hamas.

Salah al-Bardaweel was responding to suggestions from the interviewer that Hamas, the militant group that runs Gaza, was sending other people to die in the protests.

"In the last round [of demonstrations] 62 people were martyred; 50 of them are from Hamas and 12 from the people," al-Bardaweel replied, adding, "I am telling you, these are official numbers."

This sole example should bring anyone who thought that Israel massacres innocent women and children, to at least understand there are aspects which they are unfamiliar with. 

[Glarmorgan]

On 16/05/2018 at 23:50, bickster said:

You'd really have to wonder for about half a second why they'd feel like that wouldn't you

There is a HUGE gap between hating Israel and having 10 year old kids slaughtering and burning a donkey.

But, if you want to better understand the reasons behind such hatred, you can check this article, regarding the UK funding school teachers who use "how to better use a slingshot to hurl stones at the soldiers" as a part of study physics . They also teach elemntry school children that scarifying their lives is the most important thing. Here's a link and inside the article - there's a link to the whole research.

Link to the article

 

Quote

A review by the Institute for Monitoring Peace and Cultural Tolerance in School Education (IMPACT-se) found that study material from the Palestinian Authority textbooks “exerts pressure over young Palestinians to acts of violence.”

 

[bickster]

1 hour ago, Glarmorgan said:

There is a HUGE gap between hating Israel and having 10 year old kids slaughtering and burning a donkey.

But, if you want to better understand the reasons behind such hatred, you can check this article, regarding the UK funding school teachers who use "how to better use a slingshot to hurl stones at the soldiers" as a part of study physics . They also teach elemntry school children that scarifying their lives is the most important thing. Here's a link and inside the article - there's a link to the whole research.

Link to the article

 

 

Normal morals can't really apply to countries who are under siege and considered to be occupied by the UN. Especially when this has been going on decades. If Israel treats people in the way that Israel has treated the Palestinians, you can only expect that this will happen.

This really is no chicken and egg situation. Israel created this situation and continues to worsen it on a daily basis.

Try taking a step back and see how you'd feel if it was Israel in this position for over half a century instead of propagandising your country's absolutely morally indefensible position

 

[LondonLax]

I appreciate Glarmorgan's contributions to this thread.