Mark Albrighton Posted September 30, 2018 VT Supporter Share Posted September 30, 2018 4 minutes ago, HeyAnty said: I get what you are saying and everyone would say the same, but Smith would be here for alot longer than 2 games. In our next appointment we have to look at someone who is able to build something and if it doesn’t work out someone else can come in and pick up were he left off. As it is with Bruce, Villa is to big a club for Smith. Oh of course, I want us to choose a manager carefully with a view to the next few seasons. For me, Smith isn’t that man for us I think the step up to a bigger infrastructure at Villa would be too much, but I appreciate what he’s done at Brentford. All I meant is that I would have more confidence in Smith than I currently do in Bruce. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villabromsgrove Posted September 30, 2018 Share Posted September 30, 2018 I'd take Dean Smith in a heart beat! Look at where we are now .... Look at where we need to go .... Look at the transition that we need to make to get there. We are mid table in the Championship playing slow defensive non pressing negative football, and we have to begin to play attacking high tempo pressing football against other teams with players that generally aren't quite as good as ours. We have the players and the squad to get promoted! Smith would be able to slot in seamlessly from day one and start to change us in terms of fitness, tactics and mentality. Other managers may well do a decent job, but I doubt that they would hit the ground running in the way that Smith and his (essential) coaching staff would. We shouldn't be looking at the perfect fit for a long term appointment at the moment, because our urgent priority has to be promotion this season. It's what happens immediately that has to be our 100% focus. With Smith in charge we buy ourselves both the possibility of promotion, and the time to plan properly for Villa's future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thejoker Posted September 30, 2018 Share Posted September 30, 2018 58 minutes ago, guyavfc said: Well anyone is better than Bruce, so I'd take Smith. It annoys me that apparently Bruce has 2 games to save his job. Why bother giving him chance to **** our season up further? It doesn’t actually say Bruce has 2 games to save his job. Just that he MAY have the next 2 games, then a decision will be made. He could win the next 2 games and still be sacked in my opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted September 30, 2018 Share Posted September 30, 2018 (edited) 59 minutes ago, sne said: Full article is much longer. https://www.telegraph.co.uk/football/2016/10/12/brentford-fc---the-club-thinking-outside-the-box/ Interesting article......The proverb of " Necessity is the mother of invention" springs to mind. Edited September 30, 2018 by TRO 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnnyp Posted September 30, 2018 Share Posted September 30, 2018 1 hour ago, Dr_Pangloss said: I like Dean Smith and he's doing a wonderful job at Brentford, I wouldn't be massive unhappy with him but do agree that we absolutely should be aiming higher. The two issues I'd have with Smith is that firstly, we'd probably have to acquire Brentford's infrastructure, the job that Smith does isn't of course just down to him, we'd need his coaches and scouts. The second issue is we just don't know how he'd deal with a club of our size. Just as Bruce demonstrates time and time again that he cannot handle the pressure, it's possible that Smith will be out of his comfort zone at a club this big. Maybe though the structure at Villa is going to change behind the scenes so it suits us to go more down the head coach route in which case I'd favour dean smith. I like the fact that his training seems very sharp, innovative and constantly fresh from what I've heard. It's geared towards match day, as it should be..rather than reactive , no plan football with the current guy. And Smith 100% looks to speak to Villa if an approach is made. No doubt about that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnnyp Posted September 30, 2018 Share Posted September 30, 2018 2 hours ago, DaveAV1 said: Based on what? No managerial experience. ( lampard's done nothing yet before you allude to him ) Don't want us to be anyone's guinea pig . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnnyp Posted September 30, 2018 Share Posted September 30, 2018 1 hour ago, striker said: Good post but isn’t this exactly why you would be employing someone like Smith to put a much better and forward thinking infrastructure in place? That’s what Villa need and not another appointment like Bruce playing stuck in the past football with archaic coaching. Personally I think Villa should go all out and nab Rodgers from Celtic as he knows how to manage a big club but again you would have to pay the extra to bring his preferred coaching and scouting staff. You might also have to forsake promotion this season until that new way of playing becomes imbedded into the club but the Championship is that poor this season that may not happen anyway? Exactly. Smith would bring an absolute ton of stuff he learned at how Brentford operate + stuff he maybe wanted to implement himself but benham didn't. He is a serious coach on the grass though fellas. Really good. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveAV1 Posted September 30, 2018 Share Posted September 30, 2018 8 minutes ago, Johnnyp said: No managerial experience. ( lampard's done nothing yet before you allude to him ) Don't want us to be anyone's guinea pig . It’s not Lampard’s fault that he hasn’t done anything yet, but he has certainly started pretty well, as has Gerrard at Rangers. To be honest I thought both appointments were ridiculous and they got the jobs because of who they were and not what they could do. Never the less they have both, so far, which is all we can judge them on, done well. There’s an obvious risk giving a manager his first job, but I don’t think we can dismiss anyone just on that basis. I believe Pepe Guardiola’s only experience was head coach at Barcelona B, before he was given the first team job. Sarri at Chelsea was somewhat out of left field too, there were managers with much more meat on their cv, but Chelsea appointed him and again, so far so good. As a club we need to stop this almost continuous cycle of obvious choice, relevant experience managers. I don’t mean a pin the tail on the donkey approach, but with the right research and due diligence we may be able to unearth a gem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnnyp Posted September 30, 2018 Share Posted September 30, 2018 2 minutes ago, DaveAV1 said: It’s not Lampard’s fault that he hasn’t done anything yet, but he has certainly started pretty well, as has Gerrard at Rangers. To be honest I thought both appointments were ridiculous and they got the jobs because of who they were and not what they could do. Never the less they have both, so far, which is all we can judge them on, done well. There’s an obvious risk giving a manager his first job, but I don’t think we can dismiss anyone just on that basis. I believe Pepe Guardiola’s only experience was head coach at Barcelona B, before he was given the first team job. Sarri at Chelsea was somewhat out of left field too, there were managers with much more meat on their cv, but Chelsea appointed him and again, so far so good. As a club we need to stop this almost continuous cycle of obvious choice, relevant experience managers. I don’t mean a pin the tail on the donkey approach, but with the right research and due diligence we may be able to unearth a gem. You have to consider though that maybe the relevant people tasked with hiring and firing at Villa have done their due diligence on Dean Smith and like what they've seen/heard. They ain't gonna give it to him because he's a West Midlands lad who supports villa. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hippo Posted September 30, 2018 Share Posted September 30, 2018 2 hours ago, guyavfc said: Well anyone is better than Bruce, so I'd take Smith. It annoys me that apparently Bruce has 2 games to save his job. Why bother giving him chance to **** our season up further? not defending Bruce . .but just thinking any old manager will do better is a dangerous road to go down 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hippo Posted September 30, 2018 Share Posted September 30, 2018 1 hour ago, villabromsgrove said: I'd take Dean Smith in a heart beat! Look at where we are now .... Look at where we need to go .... Look at the transition that we need to make to get there. We are mid table in the Championship playing slow defensive non pressing negative football, and we have to begin to play attacking high tempo pressing football against other teams with players that generally aren't quite as good as ours. We have the players and the squad to get promoted! Smith would be able to slot in seamlessly from day one and start to change us in terms of fitness, tactics and mentality. Other managers may well do a decent job, but I doubt that they would hit the ground running in the way that Smith and his (essential) coaching staff would. We shouldn't be looking at the perfect fit for a long term appointment at the moment, because our urgent priority has to be promotion this season. It's what happens immediately that has to be our 100% focus. With Smith in charge we buy ourselves both the possibility of promotion, and the time to plan properly for Villa's future. So a man who specialises in mid tables finish...is going to come in mid season and push into a promotion place.... Brentford lost more points from winning positions than any other team in the championship last season....the defence was very much there weakness It's notes the worst suggestion out there...but it's not a brave new world either. I reckon he would last 12 months ...tops 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thejoker Posted September 30, 2018 Share Posted September 30, 2018 1 hour ago, villabromsgrove said: I'd take Dean Smith in a heart beat! Look at where we are now .... Look at where we need to go .... Look at the transition that we need to make to get there. We are mid table in the Championship playing slow defensive non pressing negative football, and we have to begin to play attacking high tempo pressing football against other teams with players that generally aren't quite as good as ours. We have the players and the squad to get promoted! Smith would be able to slot in seamlessly from day one and start to change us in terms of fitness, tactics and mentality. Other managers may well do a decent job, but I doubt that they would hit the ground running in the way that Smith and his (essential) coaching staff would. We shouldn't be looking at the perfect fit for a long term appointment at the moment, because our urgent priority has to be promotion this season. It's what happens immediately that has to be our 100% focus. With Smith in charge we buy ourselves both the possibility of promotion, and the time to plan properly for Villa's future. I’m not sure Dean Smith would drastically improve us quickly. Took him 4 years at Walsall and 18 months at Brentford to get the teams playing how he wanted. I’d take him, but I wouldn’t expect him to promote us this season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted September 30, 2018 Share Posted September 30, 2018 46 minutes ago, DaveAV1 said: It’s not Lampard’s fault that he hasn’t done anything yet, but he has certainly started pretty well, as has Gerrard at Rangers. To be honest I thought both appointments were ridiculous and they got the jobs because of who they were and not what they could do. Never the less they have both, so far, which is all we can judge them on, done well. There’s an obvious risk giving a manager his first job, but I don’t think we can dismiss anyone just on that basis. I believe Pepe Guardiola’s only experience was head coach at Barcelona B, before he was given the first team job. Sarri at Chelsea was somewhat out of left field too, there were managers with much more meat on their cv, but Chelsea appointed him and again, so far so good. As a club we need to stop this almost continuous cycle of obvious choice, relevant experience managers. I don’t mean a pin the tail on the donkey approach, but with the right research and due diligence we may be able to unearth a gem. I think Jorgie boy might help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted September 30, 2018 Share Posted September 30, 2018 (edited) 2 hours ago, hippo said: So a man who specialises in mid tables finish...is going to come in mid season and push into a promotion place.... Brentford lost more points from winning positions than any other team in the championship last season....the defence was very much there weakness It's notes the worst suggestion out there...but it's not a brave new world either. I reckon he would last 12 months ...tops Its a very significant point. No one wants to see defensive football.....but you have to be able to defend, there is a subtle difference. Wolves are a good example.....Folk sometimes forget how apt they are at defending in addition to their prowess at Attacking. We also have a different agenda to Brentford, we are not the same profile....it requires a different approach, However I am in favour of their deep thinking and attention to detail. Edited September 30, 2018 by TRO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villanmac Posted September 30, 2018 Share Posted September 30, 2018 (edited) 2 hours ago, sidcow said: So to be clear. Dean Smith is essentially rubbish. Anyone could do his job because the system is what wins the games. The players are essentially rubbish and so long as they fit into the system, regardless of their ability the system will win the games. I DON'T BUY IT. Not saying he is the man for the job but I just don't believe some magical system allows managers with little talent to manage on autopilot and average players hugely over acheived because of some system. If it was the case everyone would do it. It's all just sound bytes in my opinion. He just puts the cones out, does the interviews and every week pressses the big red button on the computer which sorts out the week's tactics and the training. Oh yeah and when he plays us he tells the players he's a big Villa fan so they play extra well for him. Edited September 30, 2018 by villanmac 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villabromsgrove Posted September 30, 2018 Share Posted September 30, 2018 50 minutes ago, hippo said: So a man who specialises in mid tables finish...is going to come in mid season and push into a promotion place.... Brentford lost more points from winning positions than any other team in the championship last season....the defence was very much there weakness It's notes the worst suggestion out there...but it's not a brave new world either. I reckon he would last 12 months ...tops 28 minutes ago, thejoker said: I’m not sure Dean Smith would drastically improve us quickly. Took him 4 years at Walsall and 18 months at Brentford to get the teams playing how he wanted. I’d take him, but I wouldn’t expect him to promote us this season. My post wasn't about Smith being a complete answer to our current situation, it was about my belief that our current squad is good enough to get promoted if we had a manager/coach who was currently more effective than Bruce. The players can do the job if they're assisted by a manager who tries to win matches, rather than held back by a manager who sets out not to lose. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveAV1 Posted September 30, 2018 Share Posted September 30, 2018 (edited) 1 hour ago, Johnnyp said: You have to consider though that maybe the relevant people tasked with hiring and firing at Villa have done their due diligence on Dean Smith and like what they've seen/heard. They ain't gonna give it to him because he's a West Midlands lad who supports villa. I do agree with that. I don’t buy into this theory that the system at Brentford makes the manager irrelevant and you or I could do it. I think Dean Smith could be very good for us, and any system that is successful at Brentford we could surely replicate all or part of it at BMH. I’m really not sure who would be best for us, but I’m pretty try certain it’s not Steve Bruce. I’d just like to see a manager come in with a fresh approach and hopefully a more attractive and winning style of football. Additionally I don’t agree with, the players won’t respect anyone who’s not a big name. If you’ve got it the players will know and will give you respect. Edited September 30, 2018 by DaveAV1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vive_La_Villa Posted September 30, 2018 Share Posted September 30, 2018 I understand why many don’t want Dean Smith but if he is the only realistic manager available would you rather we stay with Bruce or take the gamble on Smith. Id like to see the flub take the gamble. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thabucks Posted September 30, 2018 Share Posted September 30, 2018 So according to Brum mail it’s not gunna be Smith Quote There has also been a suggestion that Villa are thinking about an approach to Brentford, to speak with their manager Dean Smith. However, BirminghamLive understands that Smith is not someone who is being considered, should the club hierarchy decide to change manager. https://www.birminghammail.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/steve-bruces-aston-villa-future-15219005 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farlz Posted September 30, 2018 Share Posted September 30, 2018 Smith done a good job at Walsall as well. It's not just this structure at Brentford that makes him look good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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