General Election 2017

[StefanAVFC]

4 minutes ago, Demitri_C said:

But then who do you vote for Stefan? Awol has made a valid poubt if the labour party was not such a laughing stock maybe people would not vote Tories. You should be angry at the labour party not people voting conservative.

Whatever I vote for, it doesn't matter.

But I'll be voting Lib Dems.

[snowychap]

9 minutes ago, Demitri_C said:

You should be angry at the labour party not people voting conservative.

Can't we be angry at both groups?

[Awol]

1 minute ago, blandy said:

I rather suspect it's not as simple as that.

There are parts of thje North in particular (and maybe elsewhere) where voting tory, no matter what people's views on Brexiting is just not going to happen. Some Brexity people will vote UKIP, some (quite a lot) will stay at home, some will vote Labour....

No doubt the brexit is the biggest "thing" in the Gen Election, but there are other things, and some will crop up in the next few weeks.

FUrther, there are a number of regretters - people who voted Brexit thinking the NHS woiuld get 350 million quid a week, or we'd stop the immigrants and all that stuff. But those promises and "hints" are not going to actually happen, and some people will therefore be angry.

It's true also that remain told some whoppers - but remainers are less likely to be angry that a bad thing didn't (yet) happen, than a leaver that a good promised thing hasn't (yet) happened.

You're probably right that the Leave stance will gain the tories some votes, but we've also seen that it can lose them votes - particularly in the South, to the Lib Dems

Ok fair one, Brexit won't be the only consideration but I think it unlikely many who voted to Leave will be backing parties that expressly want to reverse that decision.

UKIP are a dead duck, if they get 5% nationally that's probably their lot - and no MP's.

As for so called regretters, I don't think there's any data to support that, but there have been surveys recently concluding that Leave would win by more if it was rerun tomorrow.

[ml1dch]

6 minutes ago, Awol said:

As for so called regretters, I don't think there's any data to support that, but there have been surveys recently concluding that Leave would win by more if it was rerun tomorrow.

Without any real evidence to back it up, I'd wager there are probably more people who voted to remain without any real enthusiasm for it at the time, who are now fully on board the "what's done is done, let's all sail towards the iceberg together" train (to mix transport metaphors), than there are those who voted to leave who feel betrayed by what has happened since.

[Demitri_C]

47 minutes ago, snowychap said:

Can't we be angry at both groups?

Add the SNP and I'm in 

[blandy]

18 minutes ago, ml1dch said:

Without any real evidence to back it up, I'd wager there are probably more people who voted to remain without any real enthusiasm for it at the time, who are now fully on board the "what's done is done, let's all sail towards the iceberg together" train (to mix transport metaphors), than there are those who voted to leave who feel betrayed by what has happened since.

I agree. But there are "regretters" - there were some interviewed on the telly recently. Sure it's only a tiny sample and all that, but they exist.

I agree as well that the "let's just get on with it" sentiment is probably the dominant one, overall. I have a suspscion that as the process goes along, a lot more people will start to be come very unhappy with things and at that point it'll be interesting to see who gets "blamed" - whether it will be the Government or some other factor (nasty EU negotiators?, the blackened, charred stump of what used to be the Labour party...)

[NurembergVillan]

9 minutes ago, blandy said:

I agree. But there are "regretters" - there were some interviewed on the telly recently. Sure it's only a tiny sample and all that, but they exist.

Or "turncoats" as they should rightly be called.  They exist now, but not for much longer.  They'll be squashed like the pathetic insects they are.

[blandy]

[tonyh29]

6 minutes ago, blandy said:

heartening to see it wasn't just Phillip Schofield who showed his stance against terrorism by walking over Westminster Bridge

[snowychap]

From the ITV news, it would appear that May's first pledge for this next election is ... to reduce net immigration to the tens of thousands.

She did forget to say, "No ifs. No buts."

Edited April 20, 2017 by snowychap
to add 'net'

[Chindie]

She'll change her mind in a few months.

At this point, everything that comes out of her mouth is a lie.

[Ingram85]

I don't believe in the way things work anymore, the system is rigged, global corporations control it all so only the tip top of the 1% get to enjoy life and I'm always going to be living month to month working for the NHS no matter who is in the hot seat. I can't save. I don't go out much and I still have hardly nothing left at the end of the month. I'm jaded, disillusioned and frankly, I don't care about politics or who is 'in charge' anymore. We live in a country of hate, racism, class wars and all out division and tbh I'm ready to leave it at the first opportunity. 

So no, I'm not taking part this time as I'm fed up of pointless elections every 5 minutes and don't care anymore as it matters little to me. 

[saturdaygig]

46 minutes ago, Ingram85 said:

I don't care about politics or who is 'in charge' anymore.

Ain't no-one really in charge. The government are just there to give the illusion that there's a 'system'. Really there isn't, we just all do what we do every day. I've seen many governments come and go, if not for the news I wouldn't know the difference.

[villakram]

The Lib dems offering a referendum on the final Brexit deal is solid politics. Corbyn sorta saying he'd do that too is promising. Brexit means that we'll go for a deal that means out, but of the soft Brexit variety and then give you lot a say. 

It'll be interesting to see how the fascist Tories retort.

[villakram]

2 hours ago, snowychap said:

From the ITV news, it would appear that May's first pledge for this next election is ... to reduce net immigration to the tens of thousands.

She did forget to say, "No ifs. No buts."

So the Ifelseistanis and the Buttasstanis are out... who does that leave?

[Chindie]

3 minutes ago, villakram said:

The Lib dems offering a referendum on the final Brexit deal is solid politics. Corbyn sorta saying he'd do that too is promising. Brexit means that we'll go for a deal that means out, but of the soft Brexit variety and then give you lot a say. 

It'll be interesting to see how the fascist Tories retort.

Hasn't Corbyn today confirmed he's against a second referendum and a Labour government (snigger) wouldn't offer one?

The only anti-Brexit 'major' party is the Lib Dems and they've got no chance of having any influence at all even if they have an absurdly, historically, good election.

The choice is basically Brexit chaos, Brexit words removed or forlorn hope. Or spoilt.

[markavfc40]

1 hour ago, Ingram85 said:

I don't believe in the way things work anymore, the system is rigged, global corporations control it all so only the tip top of the 1% get to enjoy life and I'm always going to be living month to month working for the NHS no matter who is in the hot seat. I can't save. I don't go out much and I still have hardly nothing left at the end of the month. I'm jaded, disillusioned and frankly, I don't care about politics or who is 'in charge' anymore. We live in a country of hate, racism, class wars and all out division and tbh I'm ready to leave it at the first opportunity. 

So no, I'm not taking part this time as I'm fed up of pointless elections every 5 minutes and don't care anymore as it matters little to me. 

Reading posts like yours make me sad and angry. You are working, in fact working for a vital public service, yet struggling to make ends meet and overall you feel totally disillusioned with your own situation and the wider issues around you.

You are not alone. There are millions like you. Worse still though there are millions in a worse situation than you. That despite working simply aren't even close to making ends meet. That are disabled/elderly/out of work and feel total demonized and abandoned. People that are homeless and/or reliant on foodbanks. More children than ever living in poverty.

I don't know who or what the answer is but I do know that things have gotten way worse for most since the Tories came into power and that will continue to be the case for the next five years if they do again get elected. The easy fix is therefore not to vote for them. 

Of course that leads to the question of who you do vote for. I think a country under anyone but the Tories or UKIP is a country that will be better for the majority. Be it Labour, Lib Dems, Greens or a coalition of them all including the SNP.

One thing is certain in this election. You keeping voting for the Tories you will continue to see the ideological wilful destruction of our public services, continue to see the demonization of anyone in need be it the disabled, working poor, those out of work or the elderly and frail. Continue to see your wages stagnate, off the back of Brexit see your workers rights eroded and continue to see the county become more divided as the Government turns a blind eye to anyone but them being blamed for our woes be it Johnny Foreigner or anyone in need of state help.

Anything, other than other right wings nut jobs like UKIP, has to be better than another five years of Tories.

Edited April 20, 2017 by markavfc40

[PompeyVillan]

12 minutes ago, Chindie said:

Hasn't Corbyn today confirmed he's against a second referendum and a Labour government (snigger) wouldn't offer one?

The only anti-Brexit 'major' party is the Lib Dems and they've got no chance of having any influence at all even if they have an absurdly, historically, good election.

The choice is basically Brexit chaos, Brexit words removed or forlorn hope. Or spoilt.

Why should this election be just about Brexit? I voted remain and I'm still smarting about the result. But Brexit is happening.

We can have another referendum on it, but it'll achieve nothing. It's not an issue that will ever go away. The anti immigration feeling is too strong, a 'soft' Brexit will never be accepted.

For me this should be less about what will happen in a Brexit negotiation, but more about a vision for the future of the country, with Brexit as a part of that.

We can leave the EU single market and still properly fund the NHS for example.

[a m ole]

30 minutes ago, saturdaygig said:

Ain't no-one really in charge. The government are just there to give the illusion that there's a 'system'. Really there isn't, we just all do what we do every day. I've seen many governments come and go, if not for the news I wouldn't know the difference.

Absolutey everything you do every day is affected by the government and the changes they make to the law. I don't think there is any way what you said could be more wrong.

[dAVe80]

I think the question I'd ask to anyone disillusions by the current status quo, that they don't feel like voting, is are they happy with things as they are at the moment? If the answer is no, then vote out the current government. If you want to completely change the system, then get involved. Organise locally, pressure your local MP, even join a party. Make politics work for you.

 

Edited April 20, 2017 by dAVe80