Steve Bruce

[Raver50032]

For me, (oooh, sounded like Alan Brazil there) there is only one real target next year and that has to be automatic promotion. I would expect him to get his collar felt and asked questions of, if it's looking like playoffs. Anything short of playoff potential form and he will be gone by November. Gone by November... Wyclef Jean?

I think the three consecutive wins bought Steve a fair bit of time and slack at the very right time. The loss to Huddersfield was regrettable but a game that we could have still lost even if we were nearer the top. We had some good scoring opportunities in that game, even if the performance wasn't actually stellar in real terms. Whilst I am not cheering his name right now (not done so thus far), I am prepared to give him time to get this lot to gel and playing better than what they are. It's a tough call... if things do not get better, by the time the trigger is pulled, the damage could already be irrrrrrrrrrretrievable.

 

All I can do is smile and wave... or cheer the team on.

[Stevo985]

Target next season is obviously automatic promotion. I can't imagine anyone at the club sees it any differently.

Promotion via playoffs is acceptable of course, but would still be a relative disappointment.

Not being promoted is failure.

[sne]

Promotion next season is the only option, don't really care how we do it tbh.

This season is a massive failure regardless of how we finish as we failed to get promoted.

Loads of finer points, but it pretty much boils down to this.

[srsmithusa]

6 hours ago, markavfc40 said:

How is that the case under Xia? We spent a lot of money last summer overhauling the squad. Results were poor and two months into the season we sacked the manager. Hardly accepting mediocrity.

We then employed the manager with the best CV going in terms of getting clubs promoted. A man with recent success. Again hardly accepting mediocrity.

In January we again made major changes to the squad bringing in some very highly rated players at this level. Again hardly accepting mediocrity.

The aim next season is promotion. To be one of the best three clubs in the division. This has clearly been stated. I am sure to help achieve that whilst I don’t expect many changes to the squad three or four changes will be made and whatever money needed will be spent.

On paper for me we already have one of the best squads in the division and with minimal changes over the summer I am confident it will be one good enough to achieve promotion. They will also be being managed by a man with a great record in terms of getting clubs promoted. As a collective they will have had the time together this season and a full pre season behind them

I see no accepting of mediocrity anywhere at the club. I see an ambitious, enthusiastic owner with it seems the means and where with it all to back it up. I see an experienced CEO, I see a highly qualified technical director, I see an experienced manager with a great record in terms of achieving our main aim at the moment and I see an excellent group of individual players for this level. What the club have, rightly in my opinion, decided is that it all needs a little longer than 5 months to come together, for a group of individuals to evolve into a team and that some stability at the club is the final key to success.

Look at the excuses from us on these pages and the statements from the club.   That's why the excuses bother me so deeply.   "We can't do any better with these injuries" is the same CULTURE that says we can't do any better without funds from an absent owner.  That's when the culture (the villa curse IMO) infected us.  The only change has been the rationale to excuse mediocrity.... these players, ACON, this midfield, this bad luck, this lack of tactics, this poor finishing, etc, etc, etc, ad nauseum  

Its the culture that's rotten and it's not changing quickly enough to satisfy me.  We are closer to relegation from the championship than promotion from it.   And this despite all the changes you note.  How can that be?   Because the culture is still one where mediocrity is accepted as the best we can do considering "the lack of stability?"  I see that as the latest in a long line of revolving excuses or rationalizations.  

[bannedfromHandV]

51 minutes ago, Grasshopper said:

Unfortunately, I think the nature of the business is so high profile with such enormous rewards, that no matter who it is, at whichever club in whichever professional league, the incumbent will always want "another chance/more time/more money to finally get it right.

Sometimes, you cant get blood out of a stone.

I don't understand sorry

[Eastie]

Only one way to go next  season - 

Ground floor:
Perfumery, stationary, and leather goods, wigs and haberdashery, kitchenware and food. Going up...

First floor:
Telephones, gents ready made suits, shirts, suits, ties, hats, underwear, and shoes. Going up...

Edited March 10, 2017 by Eastie

[Eastie]

Edit - for those under 40 I guess the above post is confusing

Edited March 10, 2017 by Eastie

[DCJonah]

2 hours ago, bobzy said:

Yeah - ridiculous.  We don't have to finish 10th, no prizes for that!  Getting the team used to playing with each other (oo-er) and getting a solid system for this season would be enough for me.

Finishing top 10 would be proof that he's getting a solid system and players used to playing with each other. Finishing low will indicate that we're still miles away from what you want. 

Interesting to me that he's put himself under this pressure by publicly stating what he expects from the next ten games. I hope Xia has put this pressure on him, promotion is vital next year, Bruce should be performing much better. 

Edited March 10, 2017 by DCJonah

[USA_Villa]

Let's be honest with ourselves. We are NOT finishing in the top 10 this season.

[HanoiVillan]

14 minutes ago, DCJonah said:

Finishing top 10 would be proof that he's getting a solid system and players used to playing with each other. Finishing low will indicate that we're still miles away from what you want. 

Interesting to me that he's put himself under this pressure by publicly stating what he expects from the next ten games. I hope Xia has put this pressure on him, promotion is vital next year, Bruce should be performing much better. 

While I agree we should be finishing in the top 10, or at least the top half, I don't think failing to do so would necessarily indicate that we're miles away. Everybody's new favourites Huddersfield finished poorly last season. A lot can happen over a summer window and a pre-season. 

That being said, I think it's clear that this pressure has come from above so he could yet be pushed out in the summer. 

[TheMelvillan]

1 hour ago, Raver50032 said:

For me, (oooh, sounded like Alan Brazil there) there is only one real target next year and that has to be automatic promotion. I would expect him to get his collar felt and asked questions of, if it's looking like playoffs. Anything short of playoff potential form and he will be gone by November. Gone by November... Wyclef Jean?

I think the three consecutive wins bought Steve a fair bit of time and slack at the very right time. The loss to Huddersfield was regrettable but a game that we could have still lost even if we were nearer the top. We had some good scoring opportunities in that game, even if the performance wasn't actually stellar in real terms. Whilst I am not cheering his name right now (not done so thus far), I am prepared to give him time to get this lot to gel and playing better than what they are. It's a tough call... if things do not get better, by the time the trigger is pulled, the damage could already be irrrrrrrrrrretrievable.

 

All I can do is smile and wave... or cheer the team on.

wow. Totally unrelated but this song has been stuck in my head since yesterday cos of a random comment i heard in work. Havent thought of it or heard the song song before then for about 15 years. And now you go and quote it today. Stuff like that freaks me out man!! 

 

anyhoo, sorry to be OT. We will now return to our scheduled programming.....

[JAMAICAN-VILLAN]

9 minutes ago, USA_Villa said:

Let's be honest with ourselves. We are NOT finishing in the top 10 this season.

I'm being honest, 10 games to make up 7 points is nothing, we recently won 3 games in a row, not saying we will do that again this season but I think ruling out top 10 at this stage is ridiculous.

[TRO]

3 hours ago, AJ said:

Last season, we finished with 17 points, half of what Norwich had. We were not PL standard by any stretch, and what we amassed would have been the standard of a mid to lower mid table championship team if somehow they were in the PL. This happens to be what we are now.

When we were looking for RDM's replacement, Steve Bruce was the best credible available option. He started well. We were winning games, and we were doing it with next to no midfield. Good job, Mr Bruce!

Then January came. There was that perplexing signing of Sam Johnstone. We stopped winning. Tactics and the use of, or lack of use of substitutes was baffling. It was frustrating, and criticism and doubt about Steve Bruce was understandable and fair game. After being quite close to being to the play off spots, we are now out of contention. Bad Bruce! Bad, bad, Bruce!

What we should be expecting, is a decent platform for next season. We are not going anywhere. Lets get the team gelling. Lets start getting our tactics and style of play down pat. Lets start looking like a football team again.

If we were to decide if Bruce was to stay next season, what yardstick should we use? Finish above 10th, while winning the last few games that show us that good times are to come?

If Bruce fails to deliver on this and Tony decides to pull the trigger, I am cool with that.

We have most of the players to be a force, it is just a matter of finding the right button pusher to push the right buttons. In the summer, rather than splashing out on players, maybe Tony should use his wallet wallop in finding a decent manager. Maybe another striker, and another decent DM should do us as far as players. Oh, and GK.

I know I am going to get ragged on for this, but shut up and listen to my wacky reasoning after I have the audacity of mentioning his name. Guus Hiddink. I understand most would think he is out of reach, but just hear me out. I don't believe he manages for glory. Twice he has stepped in at Chelsea, and stabilised them by the end of the seasons he has stepped in. Both times, he could have stayed on, and done a job with them, but he didn't. He also managed Australia, even though he knew we had no chance of winning, but still did an excellent job. He seems like a nice guy, he is unemployed, and if it means paying him a lot of money, then why not at least try? If Bruce isn't good enough, then why not raise our own bar and fix a problem that has been bothering us for this decade?

Whether Bruce is good enough to stay, or we find a decent replacement, the real bottom line is what is best for Villa.

That is a real subjective statement.....and I would guess the whole fan base would have a different view.

Guus Hiddinck.....I think he has been amongst the worlds best managers during his Career.....The Chelsea Job just suited him, Caretaking it until a resident manager came in.I don't think he wants the pressure at his age of a resident managers job and usually their families tell them not to.

Guus's best days are gone IMO and a rebuild such as ours would require more energy than he has and perhaps more time to fix than he would wish for.

I am not saying for one minute Steve is in the Guus Hiddinck class and I would also be amazed if Guus would be interested in us......but when all the criteria is considered i think we have a very decent manager who is in the early stages of a rebuild, when we get to the stage of a few players per window coming in to an already established team, we will all see the difference and the improvement will also gather pace.........(Every seen an old steam train leaving from a standing start?.....thats like us now) The momentum will gather.

I think Steve Bruce is good enough for what we want.....whether a few years down the line, we feel we have plateaued with him or conversely he has had enough, who knows.

In my opinion.....This is no ordinary rebuild on the contrary, I would say Extraordinary......I see signs of improvement already in the play and the players desire and attitude.

Not there yet, but as long as we are making steady progress, its all we can ask.

Lets not disrupt a job that is in progress, for an opportunity of a quick fix that could us back where we come from.

Stability and sustainability, will not come from a quick fix.....It will come from a strategy that is nurtured and worked over a period of time and it grows in to the thing you want now.

Personally, I think we was lucky to get Steve Bruce, like the Albion was lucky to get Pulis, ( but he has had his detractors too, from fans wanting immediate results and performances)

We will be ok.....but we may have some further setbacks on the way,we have to believe in what we are doing, we must stay strong, the club is on the right lines and they have trust in their manager

[Eastie]

26 minutes ago, USA_Villa said:

Let's be honest with ourselves. We are NOT finishing in the top 10 this season.

Every chance we could be 4 points off with 9 games to play after tomorrow - I expect derby to lose at Brighton tonight .

there is a 7 point gap with 10 to play - no reason to give up so easily , in fact top 8 is achievable with a decent finish - we have 9 points from the last 4 games so every reason for positivity.

Edited March 10, 2017 by Eastie

[TRO]

I would dump the league placing and concentrate on the form table.

That for me is a much better barometer of where we are going and what progress is being made.

The league table takes in RDM's stewardship and that is not really that helpful to us now.

IMO there has been too much mess this season to make anything plausible out of a League table placing.

Edited March 10, 2017 by TRO

[DCJonah]

21 minutes ago, HanoiVillan said:

While I agree we should be finishing in the top 10, or at least the top half, I don't think failing to do so would necessarily indicate that we're miles away. Everybody's new favourites Huddersfield finished poorly last season. A lot can happen over a summer window and a pre-season. 

That being said, I think it's clear that this pressure has come from above so he could yet be pushed out in the summer. 

True about Huddersfield. But how many times does a team finish near the relegation zone and then challenge for automatic promotion the following season? 

If we don't finish the season well, I don't see us being the type of team that has a miracle turn around over the summer period. We haven't had that sort of turn around in years and I see little to indicate there's even a remote chance if it happening. 

I think it's positive if the pressure has come from above. I still feel we could finish strong and finish 12th say, so I wouldn't call it complete failure if we aren't too 10. Needs to do a lot more though. 

[dn1982]

Why not aim for 10th? You've got to set yourselves high targets. 6 weeks ago we were talking about catching 6th that's gone but it doesn't mean we shouldn't be targeting as high as possible. I want us to average 2pts a game and that should get us there or there abouts. 2pts is the target Bruce set when he game a target we were on course for until we lost the plot. Getting back to it will mean we end the season well and will hide well for next season. Between now and the end I hope Bruce tries a few things out. Keep a back 4 but try different shapes further forward. 442 4231 and the 433 we are playing now should be our options next season so try them out. I'd try Gardner as the DM as a back up to Jedinak. Try a couple of the kids out wide and give Lyden a run in midfield replacing CH or HL late in games. If RHM gets fit he needs 15/20 regular. Pre season starts now. Let's get an advantage for once. 

[TRO]

3 hours ago, ThunderPower_14 said:

 

I know it's not a perfect example, but Ranieri didn't get Leicester into the PL. They toiled away for a bit under Pearson and built themselves up before getting the right manager in place.

 

Unless Dr Tony is going to spend Chelsea or Man City money (and he can't with FFP), we're going to need to build slowly and sustainably. We've turned over the staff and we've made good signings, and we've grabbed a decent manager who has gotten teams out of the Championship before. It's all about a culture change now. Our culture took half a decade to break down under Lerner and it might take half a decade to be repaired. A bit of stability will help that enormously.

Its hypothetical I know, but Pearson could have had the same response that Ranieri did......not trying to take anything away for Claudio by the way.....we will never know.

back to us.....

I don't think it will take that long, but I am not arguing with your general thoughts.....but,It will take much longer than some fans think though.

There will come a time when to enter the next phase, big money may have to be found.......right now I think we can achieve our objectives without big money spent..I think we have done enough of that for now.....I think the nucleus is there.

[DaveAV1]

1 hour ago, Eastie said:

Edit - for those under 40 I guess the above post is confusing

Those of us over 40 now have an unwelcome and disturbing image of you as Mr Humphries 

[DaveAV1]

And I hope you had to Google those lines and didn't just know them off pat!!??