ReasonforRevolution Posted February 11, 2015 Share Posted February 11, 2015 We are deep in the dogfight! The attitude of Lambert has been a laid back "we'll be fine". Quite an arrogant approach as no performances point to us being fine. I don't buy that losing at home to Chelsea is enough to inspire us as fans that this is enough to secure safety. It is not enough. After yesterday's loss to Hull, Lambert has had a slight realisation and said we have "13 cup finals". Maybe a little too late. Was it just the fans that could see this coming months and months ago?! It seems the only fight and desire to change has come from the terraces. We have a lacklustre (and/or) poorly managed players, uninspiring management and a hierarchy not aware of the trouble we are actually in. A massive concern now is that other teams in the relegation battle have been rolling there sleeves up and trying to rectify it for a while now. Take Palace with the appointment of Pardew. Sunderland with the acquisition of Defoe as examples. More worrying now is QPR, Hull and Leicester have began picking up points all of who have done so at our expense. As Josh previously mentioned this is huge psychologically. Something I highlighted at the end of last season we were lucky in sense that we won games against Arsenal, Manchester City, Chelsea and Southampton; bonus points on the tally for our survival. Without them though we would of been doomed. In contrast this season we are following the trend of losing teams around us but I cannot see points coming from elsewhere. For what it is worth this is the first season I am genuinely concerned about relegation. The fans have known it for months now. It is just a shame it has took us dropping into the bottom three for our manager to realise it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
useless Posted February 11, 2015 Share Posted February 11, 2015 It wouldn't be, we'd lose all our half decent players and so would have to start all over again in terms of building a squad, this would set us back years. So even if we came straight back up we'd be in serious peril of going straight back down again. These half-decent players would have contributed to our relegation, so it is no great lost in the end. We are probably more likely to be sold in the Championship as they have relaxed the FFP rules so owners can invest more. I am sick and tired of the same old shite each season. It's not as if we'd be able to sign better once relegated. And players like Benteke, Delph, Guzan and a few others are people we can start to build something around. If we go down we lose that and have to start again. I think people might be surprised at some of the players who we'd lose. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jareth Posted February 11, 2015 VT Supporter Share Posted February 11, 2015 I get we'd see some changes if relegated but after all Delph came out with on signing his new contract - he would stay. Benteke would stay, on current form as nobody would buy him for an amount worth selling. We're also dropping some big wages from the bill this summer anyway. In fact, you have to ask why we would have to let anyone in contract leave? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BOF Posted February 11, 2015 Moderator Share Posted February 11, 2015 As a fan who obviously doesn't want us to go down, I am hoping that being in the bottom 3 will trigger something. The hope is that it lights a fire under us that isn't there while you have the luxury of looking down at the bottom 3. Or that we play freer knowing that whatever it is we've done to this point hasn't worked, so why not change it a bit.Obviously there is the possibility that being in the bottom 3 will make you play tighter. Make the players a bit more afraid to make a mistake and therefore a bit more afraid to receive a pass from a team-mate.We probably don't have the fight of the clubs around us and that's the biggest danger at the moment. But I think if we look at our immediate vicinity - even though they're not showing it at present - I think we just about have the quality over our relegation rivals.Somehow they need to start showing it and the only thing I can cling to right now is that somehow, for some reason, the mere act of becoming one of the bottom 3 will galvanise this side into thinking "**** this, we need to get it together".The other slim positive we have is that this has happened now after 24 games, and not after 34 games. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
useless Posted February 11, 2015 Share Posted February 11, 2015 (edited) I think we'd be at risk at losing all our players, who are in and around the first team squad. Even the ones we think aren't very good. Edited February 11, 2015 by useless Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevpants Posted February 11, 2015 Share Posted February 11, 2015 It wouldn't be, we'd lose all our half decent players and so would have to start all over again in terms of building a squad, this would set us back years. So even if we came straight back up we'd be in serious peril of going straight back down again. These half-decent players would have contributed to our relegation, so it is no great lost in the end. We are probably more likely to be sold in the Championship as they have relaxed the FFP rules so owners can invest more. I am sick and tired of the same old shite each season. It's not as if we'd be able to sign better once relegated. And players like Benteke, Delph, Guzan and a few others are people we can start to build something around. If we go down we lose that and have to start again. I think people might be surprised at some of the players who we'd lose. I think the players will get a nasty surprise as to the lack of interest in them if we go down. Benteke, Vlaar and Delph might think they'd have their pick of top flight contracts, well I'm sorry lads, the fans might be directing their ire at Lambert but other clubs will be a lot more pragmatic about who was to blame for this season. Benteke is an international striker who was the main goal threat in the team that set a new record for fewest goals scored in a season? What kinds of offers do you think will come in for him? Nothing the club couldn't easily turn down. Back in your box, take your relegation pay cut and show some pride for once. These players are getting off very easy. I've shown my dissatisfaction with the manager like others but to be fair he is taking 100% of the brunt of this. I hold the team 50% responsible too. Be men. Show something over the next 13 games that indicates you have a pair. Currently Ciaran Clark is the only member of this team that's done that, that late clearance at our dead ball line where he could have controlled and brought the ball out but instead decided to kick as hard as he could through gritted teeth showed how frustrated he is. He's embarrassed to be in this situation you can see it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GENTLEMAN Posted February 11, 2015 Share Posted February 11, 2015 (edited) Having reflected on it, maybe relegation will be a blessing in disguise for the club. No I don't like this train of thought. If we went down and came straight back up then maybe it would do us some good. But it's far from a guarantee that that would happen. Relegation is potentially an absolute disaster. It's very dangerous and I want to avoid it at all costs Being relegated would have been catastrophic under GH and AM, but I think our finances have been corrected to soften the blow. We would be competitive in that division. Obviously our high earners will leave, but I think the core squad will remain the same. Our youth players such as Robinson and Grealish would play a bigger part and be allowed to develop by playing games regularly. It will be far easier to implement a winning style of play in the Championship and attract the best players from that division given our stature. I actually think supporters will enjoy it more than they have in the last four seasons. Edited February 11, 2015 by GENTLEMAN Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BOF Posted February 11, 2015 Moderator Share Posted February 11, 2015 I think the players will get a nasty surprise as to the lack of interest in them if we go down. Benteke, Vlaar and Delph might think they'd have their pick of top flight contracts, well I'm sorry lads, the fans might be directing their ire at Lambert but other clubs will be a lot more pragmatic about who was to blame for this season. Benteke is an international striker who was the main goal threat in the team that set a new record for fewest goals scored in a season? What kinds of offers do you think will come in for him? Nothing the club couldn't easily turn down. Back in your box, take your relegation pay cut and show some pride for once. These players are getting off very easy. I've shown my dissatisfaction with the manager like others but to be fair he is taking 100% of the brunt of this. I hold the team 50% responsible too. Be men. Show something over the next 13 games that indicates you have a pair. Currently Ciaran Clark is the only member of this team that's done that, that late clearance at our dead ball line where he could have controlled and brought the ball out but instead decided to kick as hard as he could through gritted teeth showed how frustrated he is. He's embarrassed to be in this situation you can see it. Nah, Benteke would be gone for big money. You're right that other clubs would be pragmatic. But that would amount to looking at Villa's midfield and thinking 'yeah the forward wasn't the problem there'. Granted, they'll all look for a bargain and they'll cite his meagre goal return but he'll be gone and the net result to us will be the same. We won't be using him in the Championship. Vlaar & Delph would be gone too. As for the rest. It was a self-fulfilling prophecy when Lerner started to pay Championship wages for Premier League players because we will become a Championship side, but at least our wage bill won't need much massaging. We would at least be in decent nick to make an immediate promotion. We'd probably have to replace Westwood, Sanchez, Hutton, Cissokho but being such a big fish down there, the quality from that league (required to come back up) would be tripping over itself to join us IMHO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jareth Posted February 11, 2015 VT Supporter Share Posted February 11, 2015 I think we'd be at risk at losing all our players, who are in and around the first team squad. Even the ones we think aren't very good. Just wondering what leverage they would have to force a move... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
useless Posted February 11, 2015 Share Posted February 11, 2015 I think there will be plenty of takers for Benteke, would be nice to be able to refuse all offers or better still for him himself to say that he want's to stay to help us get back up but both those scenarios seem doubtful to me. I think most of the players who are in and around our starting eleven would attract interest from Premier teams or clubs playing the top flight abroad. As a team they might have been a failure but as individuals in a new environment I think other clubs would take a punt on them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cliffy Biro Posted February 11, 2015 Share Posted February 11, 2015 I think we'd be at risk at losing all our players, who are in and around the first team squad. Even the ones we think aren't very good. Just wondering what leverage they would have to force a move... They wouldn't need any, make no mistake it'd be a mass exodus. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jareth Posted February 11, 2015 VT Supporter Share Posted February 11, 2015 But isn't it in our interests to keep them at the club? No one is on huge wages any more, no one would be too expensive to keep. I don't get how any player involved in relegating a team gets to demand a move away if it is not in the interests of the club. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo985 Posted February 11, 2015 VT Supporter Share Posted February 11, 2015 Having reflected on it, maybe relegation will be a blessing in disguise for the club. No I don't like this train of thought. If we went down and came straight back up then maybe it would do us some good. But it's far from a guarantee that that would happen. Relegation is potentially an absolute disaster. It's very dangerous and I want to avoid it at all costs Being relegated would have been catastrophic under GH and AM, but I think our finances have been corrected to soften the blow. We would be competitive in that division. Obviously our high earners will leave, but I think the core squad will remain the same. Our youth players such as Robinson and Grealish would play a bigger part and be allowed to develop by playing games regularly. It will be far easier to implement a winning style of play in the Championship and attract the best players from that division given our stature. I actually think supporters will enjoy it more than they have in the last four seasons. I THINK you're right too. But it's not a guarantee. I'd rather not risk it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coda Posted February 11, 2015 Share Posted February 11, 2015 He won't be sacked so he needs to drop the ineffectual soft passing style and get back to hoofing it to Benteke. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GENTLEMAN Posted February 11, 2015 Share Posted February 11, 2015 (edited) Don't get me wrong, I don't want us to be relegated. But I'm certainly not worrying about Championship football. Edited February 11, 2015 by GENTLEMAN Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BOF Posted February 11, 2015 Moderator Share Posted February 11, 2015 Don't get me wrong, I don't want us to be relegated. But I'm certainly not worrying about Championship football.Whilst I would agree with all of this, what I would be worried about would be the possible setback to the club of being a promoted side if that were to happen. Statistically it is far more likely that we either get stuck down there OR become a yoyo club than it would be to re-establish ourselves as a fixture in the Premier League upon promotion. Newcastle have managed it but they're almost an isolated incident. Southampton eventually managed it but not before another drop and years of pain. The odds of us having one season down there and coming back like nothing happened is highly unlikely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimzk5 Posted February 11, 2015 Share Posted February 11, 2015 When Newcastle went a large portion of the team stayed, I think only owen duff and viduka went & they appointed the right manager. If we drop I think we will also retain a chunk of the squad, Vlaar, benteke nzogbia would definitely go. Then its just about appointing the right manager - something Randy has no idea of doing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villa89 Posted February 11, 2015 Share Posted February 11, 2015 The odds of us having one season down there and coming back like nothing happened is highly unlikely. This. Going down would set the club back hugely and we could easily end up being a Nottingham Forest or Sheffield United. Villa belong in the top flight not down in the lower leagues with the filth like SHA. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Designer1 Posted February 11, 2015 VT Supporter Share Posted February 11, 2015 We have an owner who (seemingly) is doing very little to stop us from falling into the Championship, so I really can't see him putting in much effort to get us back out. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
useless Posted February 11, 2015 Share Posted February 11, 2015 Newcastle are just one example, plus Ashley has a lot more money than Randy, so would be in a better position to hang to some of there players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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