Christian Benteke

[TRO]

Just now, Mantis said:

That Benteke was phenomenal for us

But we still finished 17th so as nifty as he was it was one star in a galaxy.

and despite him being a real asset.....he wasn't phenomenal, certainly not in my eyes.

[Mantis]

3 hours ago, TRO said:

But we still finished 17th so as nifty as he was it was one star in a galaxy.

and despite him being a real asset.....he wasn't phenomenal, certainly not in my eyes.

We finished 17th because most of the rest of the team were terrible. Football is a team game you know and unfortunately having one very good player isn't enough, although he certainly did drag us up a little from where we would have otherwise been.

[TRO]

19 hours ago, Mantis said:

We finished 17th because most of the rest of the team were terrible. Football is a team game you know and unfortunately having one very good player isn't enough, although he certainly did drag us up a little from where we would have otherwise been.

He had quite a few blank Saturdays hence me baulking at .....Phenomenal.

I am quite aware that the rest of the team was some way short of his talent.....and since so many of my posts include my reference to TEAM I am well aware of that too.

However, Jurgen Klopp is not a subscriber to the hyperbole.

Edited August 9, 2016 by TRO

[tonyh29]

I was thinking he could thrive at Palace with Townsend putting crosses in fro him ... then I remembered having seen Townsend play

 

but Palace allegedly  spending £32m on striker is a show of intent and when you add that the top 6 and Everton's £2138483m (+ player sales ) spending spree  , our Dr Tony has gonna have a heck of a spend on his hands over the coming years to make us top 10 , yet alone world champions

[DCJonah]

Gutted 

[Mantis]

1 hour ago, TRO said:

He had quite a few blank Saturdays hence me baulking at .....Phenomenal.

I am quite aware that the rest of the team was some way short of his talent.....and since so many of my posts include my reference to TEAM I am well aware of that too.

However, Jurgen Klopp is not a subscriber to the hyperbole.

Quite a few of those he wasn't even properly fit. I seem to recall him playing through injury halfway through the 13/14 season and then coming back from injury for a chunk of the 14/15 season.

He had an almost 1 in 2 goal scoring record in a really poor team. And he created chances for other players too. If that isn't phenomenal I don't know what is. It's not as if I'm saying he's world class.

[TRO]

38 minutes ago, Mantis said:

Quite a few of those he wasn't even properly fit. I seem to recall him playing through injury halfway through the 13/14 season and then coming back from injury for a chunk of the 14/15 season.

He had an almost 1 in 2 goal scoring record in a really poor team. And he created chances for other players too. If that isn't phenomenal I don't know what is. It's not as if I'm saying he's world class.

You are absolutely entitled to your assessment.

Despite me being pleased should we be in a position to have him back.....I terms of goal scorers who have very good records and he has (granted) He was far from complete for me.

He went missing for periods of games particularly to wards the end of his tenure for us....his movement was questionable and like i say to be labelled higher in terms of talent he would need to score more consistently.....1 in 2 is fantastic, but it depends how it is made up, that sounds ungrateful.....but it could be acheived with lots of goals when you don't really need them.....meaning goals change games but the 3rd and Fourth don't really when you are 2-0 up and coasting.

He was not in Shearers class or even Dwight Yorke's.....He did not have the determination of Gray or Withe and did not have the stealth of Platt.

He was a good player for us and I agree kept us up, but he had too many flaws in his game for me to call him phenomenal.

 

[LakotaDakota]

2 hours ago, tonyh29 said:

but Palace allegedly  spending £32m on striker is a show of intent and when you add that the top 6 and Everton's £2138483m (+ player sales ) spending spree  , our Dr Tony has gonna have a heck of a spend on his hands over the coming years to make us top 10 , yet alone world champions

We are already miles away.

Man city have spent more signing Raheem Sterling & John Stones than our entire squad cost (including this seasons 4 signings)

[tonyh29]

23 minutes ago, TRO said:

You are absolutely entitled to your assessment.

Despite me being pleased should we be in a position to have him back.....I terms of goal scorers who have very good records and he has (granted) He was far from complete for me.

He went missing for periods of games particularly to wards the end of his tenure for us....his movement was questionable and like i say to be labelled higher in terms of talent he would need to score more consistently.....1 in 2 is fantastic, but it depends how it is made up, that sounds ungrateful.....but it could be acheived with lots of goals when you don't really need them.....meaning goals change games but the 3rd and Fourth don't really when you are 2-0 up and coasting.

He was not in Shearers class or even Dwight Yorke's.....He did not have the determination of Gray or Withe and did not have the stealth of Platt.

He was a good player for us and I agree kept us up, but he had too many flaws in his game for me to call him phenomenal.

 

technically he is as good as  all of those players

to see how good he was , look a the QPR game (hatrick) ..his first goal he deliberately waited for the defender to obscure the keepers view and then rolled it into the net  , that's before you look at his technique with overhead goals for us v Norwich ( his one last season  v Man U  was arguably goal of the season , certainly in the top 3 or 4 goals so he has that in his locker  )  ... and look at the Sunderland 6-1 and how high he leaps for those headers    ..... and that back heel at Anfield , I'll never get bored of seeing that , even Yorke in his prime never gave us one of them   

this isn't some number 9 donkey worthy of a spot at Crystal Palace , this is a class striker , who was ill advised by an agent and took a small leap forward to Liverpool , when he should have been going to one of the clubs that actually have a chance of winning something ( rem this was Rodgers Liverpool of average meh players )

maybe his attitude has let him down ...or maybe his agent has let him down , even Tim Sherwood could see he was destined to fail at Liverpool

 

 

Edited August 9, 2016 by tonyh29
better angle on the backheel

[Mantis]

19 minutes ago, TRO said:

You are absolutely entitled to your assessment.

Despite me being pleased should we be in a position to have him back.....I terms of goal scorers who have very good records and he has (granted) He was far from complete for me.

He went missing for periods of games particularly to wards the end of his tenure for us....his movement was questionable and like i say to be labelled higher in terms of talent he would need to score more consistently.....1 in 2 is fantastic, but it depends how it is made up, that sounds ungrateful.....but it could be acheived with lots of goals when you don't really need them.....meaning goals change games but the 3rd and Fourth don't really when you are 2-0 up and coasting.

He was not in Shearers class or even Dwight Yorke's.....He did not have the determination of Gray or Withe and did not have the stealth of Platt.

He was a good player for us and I agree kept us up, but he had too many flaws in his game for me to call him phenomenal.

Actually, quite a lot of his goals were absolutely crucial ones. Yes he went missing for periods in some games but even world class players (which Benteke isn't) do that. I just don't understand your gripe with him? I can't help but feel like if he did what he did 30 years ago you'd have a different view.

[tonyh29]

8 minutes ago, LakotaDakota said:

We are already miles away.

Man city have spent more signing Raheem Sterling & John Stones than our entire squad cost (including this seasons 4 signings)

it was in direct reference to our new owners comments  , not me thinking we were still close to them

 

[TRO]

2 hours ago, Mantis said:

Actually, quite a lot of his goals were absolutely crucial ones. Yes he went missing for periods in some games but even world class players (which Benteke isn't) do that. I just don't understand your gripe with him? I can't help but feel like if he did what he did 30 years ago you'd have a different view.

Excuse me ,Mantis

i never had a gripe with him.....you countered my post with "Phenomenal" in terms of describing Benteke......If you can remember that far back, you are so quick to be critical that you maybe forget what you wrote.

I think and always have that he is a good player......The Liverpool experience has naturally raised questions on his overall status.

My original post was trying to highlight the essence of a team as opposed to Individuals but you seemed to pick up on that and interpreted it that Benteke was our saviour which for a spell he was.....but my interpretation was you just fell over your bootlaces to try and prove me wrong.

I rate Benteke and always have done.....but I equally watched his play with interest and not trying to be derogatory was not the complete forward.

I just want a team.....not individual heroes

 

Edited August 9, 2016 by TRO

[TRO]

2 hours ago, tonyh29 said:

technically he is as good as  all of those players

to see how good he was , look a the QPR game (hatrick) ..his first goal he deliberately waited for the defender to obscure the keepers view and then rolled it into the net  , that's before you look at his technique with overhead goals for us v Norwich ( his one last season  v Man U  was arguably goal of the season , certainly in the top 3 or 4 goals so he has that in his locker  )  ... and look at the Sunderland 6-1 and how high he leaps for those headers    ..... and that back heel at Anfield , I'll never get bored of seeing that , even Yorke in his prime never gave us one of them   

this isn't some number 9 donkey worthy of a spot at Crystal Palace , this is a class striker , who was ill advised by an agent and took a small leap forward to Liverpool , when he should have been going to one of the clubs that actually have a chance of winning something ( rem this was Rodgers Liverpool of average meh players )

maybe his attitude has let him down ...or maybe his agent has let him down , even Tim Sherwood could see he was destined to fail at Liverpool

 

 

But unfortunately football is not all about technical ability.

whilst it plays a major part, there are also many other factors that are essential to contributing to a top class player.

[Zatman]

maybe both Ashley Young and Benteke at Crystal Palace next season 

why not just kill us by signing Barry and bring in Mellberg and Laursen as coaches

[Czechlad]

Benteke will do well at Palace. I think Pardew will get the best out of him. 

[thunderball]

That Benteke was phenomenal for us

[TrentVilla]

 

I'd be gutted to see him at Palace.

[HanoiVillan]

Just now, TrentVilla said:

 

I'd be gutted to see him at Palace.

Me too. He'd never come here, but he'd go to Palace 

Maybe he'd have come back if we'd finished towards the top of the bottom half. Like Sigurdsson did with Swansea. 

What I take from this is that Randy Lerner is a bell piece. 

[sexbelowsound]

Watching those goals made me sad.

[Mantis]

1 hour ago, TRO said:

Excuse me ,Mantis

i never had a gripe with him.....you countered my post with "Phenomenal" in terms of describing Benteke......If you can remember that far back, you are so quick to be critical that you maybe forget what you wrote.

I think and always have that he is a good player......The Liverpool experience has naturally raised questions on his overall status.

My original post was trying to highlight the essence of a team as opposed to Individuals but you seemed to pick up on that and interpreted it that Benteke was our saviour which for a spell he was.....but my interpretation was you just fell over your bootlaces to try and prove me wrong.

I rate Benteke and always have done.....but I equally watched his play with interest and not trying to be derogatory was not the complete forward.

I just want a team.....not individual heroes

I don't really see what point you're trying to make? Of course the team is more important than the individual - that's blatantly obvious. That still doesn't change how good he was for us though.