ml1dch Posted June 5, 2020 Share Posted June 5, 2020 (edited) 25 minutes ago, HanoiVillan said: Yes, but as I say, there are real differences between the parties, that I think impact this. I'm not so sure. I think a huge number of Democratic voters would be just as susceptible to voting for a famous person based on their personality rather than a record of policy positions. I reckon that someone with cross-political appeal and a big enough name would run away with the nomination just as Trump did. The Rock, Tom Hanks, Oprah Winfrey, Bruce Springsteen. If any of those really fancied it then I reckon they'd get the nomination and would probably win the election as well. But then I approach this from a positon of usually being wrong as well. Edited June 5, 2020 by ml1dch 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ml1dch Posted June 5, 2020 Share Posted June 5, 2020 (edited) 16 minutes ago, villakram said: Pedant alert! The Republican party did not pick Trump. Trump forced the republican party to pick him via winning their primary process, democratically, to the horror of the republican party old-guard/elite. Pretty much ditto with Obama, where the establishment had very clearly anointed Clinton, though with less horror. It depends on how you are defining the party. If you want to define the party as the handful of people in charge of the operational machinery then sure, no disagreement with what you've said. If you want to define the party as the wider organisation encompassing its registered members and those who lean towards it enough to turn up and vote for its leader (as I'm choosing to) then I'm happy with my choice of words. Edited June 5, 2020 by ml1dch 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keyblade Posted June 5, 2020 Share Posted June 5, 2020 4 hours ago, HanoiVillan said: In 2008, when Bush lost, and people left his administration, there were people guilty of a wide range of actionable crimes, including authorising torture techniques and implementing secret warrantless wiretapping. Nobody got prosecuted, and there is no reason to think that anybody from the Trump administration will be prosecuted either, and certainly not the man himself. Biden - who is, after all, no radical - will conclude that for the benefit of 'healing', 'the country needs to move on' and absolutely nothing will happen to Trump. And inexplicably, Bush has had a complete rehabilitation of his reputation and has been eulogized lately in lieu of Trump. I can see Trump having a similar renaissance whenever the next monstrous fascist takes over following 4/8 years of completely ineffectual liberal policies from Joe Biden (or whoever they stick in there if he croaks). People have short memories. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keyblade Posted June 5, 2020 Share Posted June 5, 2020 1 hour ago, StefanAVFC said: Sacked? How about arrested on suspicion of GBH/assault? It isn't an employment issue. If roles were reversed, the old guy would be in a cell right now. Reminds me of a lyric from Big L touching on this issue: Quote One murdered my man like it was okay For the life he ended he got suspended with no pay But if a man woulda took the cop life, he woulda got life And never again see the street lights, and that's trife It's always just a matter of employment for cops, they have a different set of rules from the rest of us. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HanoiVillan Posted June 5, 2020 Share Posted June 5, 2020 5 minutes ago, Keyblade said: And inexplicably, Bush has had a complete rehabilitation of his reputation and has been eulogized lately in lieu of Trump. I can see Trump having a similar renaissance whenever the next monstrous fascist takes over following 4/8 years of completely ineffectual liberal policies from Joe Biden (or whoever they stick in there if he croaks). People have short memories. Agree on Bush. Think it might be harder for Trump because I doubt he has the self-discipline to remove himself from day-to-day politics for a while, which is the necessary first step on the path to being treated as an 'elder statesman'. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LondonLax Posted June 5, 2020 Share Posted June 5, 2020 45 minutes ago, ml1dch said: It depends on how you are defining the party. If you want to define the party as the handful of people in charge of the operational machinery then sure, no disagreement with what you've said. If you want to define the party as the wider organisation encompassing its registered members and those who lean towards it enough to turn up and vote for its leader (as I'm choosing to) then I'm happy with my choice of words. Trump emerged from the ‘Tea Party‘ movement. There was a war over the soul of the Republican Party between the Tea Party types and the establishment Republicans after their repeated drubbing by Obama. The Tea Party won out and now establishment Republicans are referred to as RINOs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nick76 Posted June 5, 2020 Share Posted June 5, 2020 That press conference was hard to watch....very repetitive, really trying hard to convince people, saying George Floyd will be looking down thinking the job numbers report is a great day(WTF).....some lackies butt kissing him....then no questions.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blandy Posted June 5, 2020 Moderator Share Posted June 5, 2020 4 hours ago, StefanAVFC said: Suspended, haha. And people wonder why the protests are happening. TBF, that's exactly how it should work. There are formal processes to be followed and that applies to both general police behaviour towards the public, and disciplinary matters. You'd hope that during suspension, and quickly, the evidence of misconduct would be reviewed, and then subsequent action should take place - arrest for assault, failure to attend to the victim and so on, and at that point trial, sacking, etc. But not until process has been followed. Anything else is making stuff up on the hoof, and likely to lead to the perpetrators getting away on a technicality. edit @Davkaus got there first. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HanoiVillan Posted June 5, 2020 Share Posted June 5, 2020 All four officers in the Floyd case, and both officers who pepper sprayed the students in the car in Atlanta, were all instantly dismissed, though possibly the difference is that charges were filed in all those cases? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genie Posted June 5, 2020 Share Posted June 5, 2020 I read that one of the 4 officers charged over the George Floyd killing was only on his 3rd day in the job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowychap Posted June 5, 2020 Share Posted June 5, 2020 (edited) Edit: Though murals should be on walls, surely? Edited June 5, 2020 by snowychap 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nick76 Posted June 5, 2020 Share Posted June 5, 2020 (edited) 11 minutes ago, Genie said: I read that one of the 4 officers charged over the George Floyd killing was only on his 3rd day in the job. Really, I heard it was his first day! Either way, it's incredible. edit: it was four day, third shift https://edition.cnn.com/2020/06/05/us/minneapolis-officers-background-george-floyd-trnd/index.html edit No.2: two of them were only on their fourth day! Two newbies........ Edited June 5, 2020 by nick76 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowychap Posted June 5, 2020 Share Posted June 5, 2020 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HanoiVillan Posted June 5, 2020 Share Posted June 5, 2020 15 minutes ago, nick76 said: Really, I heard it was his first day! Either way, it's incredible. edit: it was four day, third shift https://edition.cnn.com/2020/06/05/us/minneapolis-officers-background-george-floyd-trnd/index.html edit No.2: two of them were only on their fourth day! Two newbies........ Aha. I hadn't heard that at all. I guess that sheds some light on what might have happened - the other two were maybe showing off, in some kind of sick way, and they were too cowed by the situation to say anything. Not that that's any excuse, you have to be ready on day one, and this is an excellent example of why. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villakram Posted June 5, 2020 Share Posted June 5, 2020 6 minutes ago, HanoiVillan said: Aha. I hadn't heard that at all. I guess that sheds some light on what might have happened - the other two were maybe showing off, in some kind of sick way, and they were too cowed by the situation to say anything. Not that that's any excuse, you have to be ready on day one, and this is an excellent example of why. I think it was day 3/4 of being full police officers, after both had finished training and their 1st year on probation. So newbies, but not completely so. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LondonLax Posted June 5, 2020 Share Posted June 5, 2020 The Los Angeles Police Commission taking calls from the public 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sne Posted June 5, 2020 Share Posted June 5, 2020 Apparently they are burning crosses in Alabama (again) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maqroll Posted June 5, 2020 Author Share Posted June 5, 2020 (edited) Trump in Maine today to visit a swab manufacturer in a rural town way up north. Protesters and supporters both gathering outside. Edited June 5, 2020 by maqroll Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowychap Posted June 5, 2020 Share Posted June 5, 2020 24 minutes ago, sne said: Apparently they are burning crosses in Alabama (again) Did they ever stop? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maqroll Posted June 5, 2020 Author Share Posted June 5, 2020 This movement has real steam. Confederate statues falling moderate voters siding with the protests, global solidarity. Divestment from American corporations could be an effective way to keep pressure on, the way we crippled Botha. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts