Global Warming

[mjmooney]

Sadly, while I agree we should all do our bit with recycling, etc., it's ultimately a drop in the ocean (irony intended).

Drastic and immediate action is required at a supra-national level. Governments need to take concerted and radical policy decisions, which would override national self-interest, the short-term comfort of electorates, and the profit motives of global (and local) businesses. Even if such historically unprecedented co-operation were possible in a world continually in economic and military conflict with itself, it would be resisted tooth and nail by those who stand to make short- and long-term losses. 

It ain't gonna happen, folks. 

We're f*cked. 

[maqroll]

The waters around Florida are at 90F which is shocking. It likely means that the imminent hurricane season has the potential to produce multiple category 5 storms. Warming water along the eastern seaboard makes the entire coast more vulnerable, including New England. Cape Cod, Martha's Vineyard and Nantucket are sitting ducks.

[tomav84]

11 minutes ago, mjmooney said:

Sadly, while I agree we should all do our bit with recycling, etc., it's ultimately a drop in the ocean (irony intended).

Drastic and immediate action is required at a supra-national level. Governments need to take concerted and radical policy decisions, which would override national self-interest, the short-term comfort of electorates, and the profit motives of global (and local) businesses. Even if such historically unprecedented co-operation were possible in a world continually in economic and military conflict with itself, it would be resisted tooth and nail by those who stand to make short- and long-term losses. 

It ain't gonna happen, folks. 

We're f*cked. 

this is the problem. the current government are only concerned with remaining in power and labour are only interested in getting into power. something radical, for example, like the rationing of meat and/or petrol & diesel would cause such outcry that it would damage either party's election prospects...so they're not going to do it

it's the one argument i have for a dictatorship system..."this is what's happening, deal with it...our kids will thank us"

[CVByrne]

1 hour ago, mjmooney said:

Sadly, while I agree we should all do our bit with recycling, etc., it's ultimately a drop in the ocean (irony intended).

Drastic and immediate action is required at a supra-national level. Governments need to take concerted and radical policy decisions, which would override national self-interest, the short-term comfort of electorates, and the profit motives of global (and local) businesses. Even if such historically unprecedented co-operation were possible in a world continually in economic and military conflict with itself, it would be resisted tooth and nail by those who stand to make short- and long-term losses. 

It ain't gonna happen, folks. 

We're f*cked. 

This often what people propose as solutions. Which is essentially a fundamental change of western capitalism via more direct government control and a form of Marxism. 

It's based on a view that ties climate change to capitalism and frames the only solutions to the problem as essentially overthrowing capitalism.

So this solution to the problem is a far worse situation than the problem itself. That's not a solution. 

This is where the problem really is. We need to settle on the solution. Is the solution the decades long transition of our economies to green energy and net zero with technology advancements or is it ending capitalism and concepts like economic growth. 

[CVByrne]

1 hour ago, tomav84 said:

this is the problem. the current government are only concerned with remaining in power and labour are only interested in getting into power. something radical, for example, like the rationing of meat and/or petrol & diesel would cause such outcry that it would damage either party's election prospects...so they're not going to do it

it's the one argument i have for a dictatorship system..."this is what's happening, deal with it...our kids will thank us"

And it would put all the people who work in those industries out of work to make a miniscule impact to global carbon emissions. 

As you say it requires all the major economies to have Dictatorships in place and for those Dictators to decide that they'll take the steps required. They'll kill 60% of the earth population and the sterilisation of 30% more. 

Job done. World saved

[sidcow]

Capitalism is probably going to work harder at a lot of solutions than government. 

As soon as batteries are cheap enough and energy dense enough (next 4 years) oil and petrol will be decimated because they're too expensive. 

Renewable power generation is already cheaper than coal and gas so private capital is pouring in to new renewable energy schemes.

Private capital is driving battery innovation and will drive eg heat pump innovation 

As soon as they can make heat pumps cheap enough they'll ditch gas boilers like a stone. 

Private capital knows which way the winds blowing. 

Edited July 17, 2023 by sidcow

[CVByrne]

20 minutes ago, sidcow said:

Capitalism is probably going to work harder at a lot of solutions than government. 

As soon as batteries are cheap enough and energy dense enough (next 4 years) oil and petrol will be decimated because they're too expensive. 

Renewable power generation is already cheaper than coal and gas so private capital is pouring in to new renewable energy schemes.

Private capital is driving battery innovation and will drive eg heat pump innovation 

As soon as they can make heat pumps cheap enough they'll ditch gas boilers like a stone. 

Private capital knows which way the winds blowing. 

This. All the innovations that will solve our problems will come from companies and people who will benefit from the value they've added to the global economy. 

[Davkaus]

31 minutes ago, sidcow said:

Capitalism is probably going to work harder at a lot of solutions than government. 

 

Only when they're given sufficient motivation by government regulation, of course.

How many decades has the oil spent pumping billions into fighting against green energy, and pushing the blame onto anybody but themselves? Amuse yourself by recalling that BP popularised the term "carbon footprint".

The free market will aim for maximum profit for minimum effort, humanity be damned. Which takes us back to the original problem really; most governments for decades have been willing to play a game of chicken, with their lightweight regulation, kicking environment concerns into the long grass for generations, chasing a buck today.

Edited July 17, 2023 by Davkaus

[LondonLax]

4 hours ago, CVByrne said:

How much does convincing those who remain skeptical matter? What does taking it seriously even mean? Let's say 60-70% of the UK population totally agree it's a serious key issue we need to tackle. Government need to create national policy and work with global partners on long term solutions. 

We're at that stage, climate change deniers are a minority. The discussion is really around what we do. Not if we need to do something.

I’m not so sure that is true. Click through the following tweet from a US politician and read through the responses. Are we sure the Democrats are going to be in power in 12 months time or could it even be representatives from the climate change denial party regaining power instead? 

 

 

 

 

[mjmooney]

2 hours ago, CVByrne said:

This often what people propose as solutions. Which is essentially a fundamental change of western capitalism via more direct government control and a form of Marxism. 

Yes, it is. And that's obviously not going to happen. So we're down to hoping that warring national governments and greedy capitalists will sort it out for the good of us all. 

Which is why I'm convinced we're f*cked. 

[Lichfield Dean]

52 minutes ago, LondonLax said:

I’m not so sure that is true. Click through the following tweet from a US politician and read through the responses. Are we sure the Democrats are going to be in power in 12 months time or could it even be representatives from the climate change denial party regaining power instead? 

 

 

 

 

I really shouldn't have looked at the replies to that ...

Edited July 17, 2023 by Lichfield Dean

[tomav84]

1 hour ago, LondonLax said:

I’m not so sure that is true. Click through the following tweet from a US politician and read through the responses. Are we sure the Democrats are going to be in power in 12 months time or could it even be representatives from the climate change denial party regaining power instead? 

 

 

 

 

i feel for people who have had children, i really do because this is just going to get worse. the US really aren't going to do anything if the republicans regain power.

[Genie]

China recorded 52.2 degrees yesterday, wow. 

[villa89]

14 minutes ago, Genie said:

China recorded 52.2 degrees yesterday, wow. 

Yet China will continue to pump out emissions in record numbers and keep burning coal as long as possible. Pollution is the national sport. 

[Lichfield Dean]

5 minutes ago, villa89 said:

Yet China will continue to pump out emissions in record numbers and keep burning coal as long as possible. Pollution is the national sport. 

And yet....

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/jun/29/china-wind-solar-power-global-renewable-energy-leader

"China is shoring up its position as the world leader in renewable power and potentially outpacing its own ambitious energy targets, a report has found.

China is set to double its capacity and produce 1,200 gigawatts of energy through wind and solar power by 2025, reaching its 2030 goal five years ahead of time, according to the report by Global Energy Monitor, a San Francisco-based NGO that tracks operating utility-scale wind and solar farms as well as future projects in the country."

[The Fun Factory]

I think Seb Coe has already said it but global warming is going to be a problem for all outdoor summer sporting competitions. Could you imagine if this heatwave happens next year in Paris? Spectators could actually die, unless it is played in the mornings or the middle of the night,.

[PaulC]

One question is that is there a finite amount of lithium and once that runs out what do we do?

[villa89]

1 minute ago, PaulC said:

One question is that is there a finite amount of lithium and once that runs out what do we do?

We figure out how to recycle batteries more efficiently. 

[PaulC]

4 minutes ago, villa89 said:

We figure out how to recycle batteries more efficiently. 

Yes the demand for it is going to increase dramatically. Anyway we are getting to the stage its going to be too late to do much  about saving our planet. I fear for future generations. 

[Chindie]

We need to find something better than lithium for batteries.