fightoffyour Posted May 7 VT Supporter Share Posted May 7 The owners could be serious investors with big ambitions who’ve made some costly mistake already that they’ll rectify in order to push on, they could be complete charlatans like Xia, or it could be somewhere in the middle, but either way the fact that they have no players and probably no manager means they are much more likely to be relegated again than come straight back up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob182 Posted May 7 Share Posted May 7 3 hours ago, pas5898 said: I'm no financial expert. But losing 89 percent value off your stocks is a bad thing right? Financial genius! Source Tipranks No publicity is bad publicity! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StewieGriffin Posted May 7 Share Posted May 7 2 hours ago, GlobalVillan said: The likes of Reading, Bolton, Charlton, Wigan and Huddersfield are all similar sized clubs to SHA. Add to that the money Wrexham and Wycombe have and the notion that this basket case of a club will steamroller the division is absolutely ridiculous. They are deluded. They are on a downward trajectory with no manager, hardly any players, no experience of getting out of League 1 and with owners who have demonstrated not to know the first thing about running a football club. The rebuild will take time and will be overseen by a gobshite hedge fund manager. A bad one at that given its haemorrhaging money. They will be lucky to get Play Offs. No chance they are winning that league. Careful mate, you sound rattled mate 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VillaJ100 Posted May 7 Share Posted May 7 Swiss Ramble have published Blues accounts for last year. Not a financial expert but doesn't look good to me. https://swissramble.substack.com/p/birmingham-city-finances-202223 Quote Blues’ pre-tax loss slightly increased from £25.0m to £25.3m, as revenue rose £1.6m (9%) from £18.1m to £19.7m, while operating expenses were cut £2.4m (5%) from £49.4m to £47.0m. These improvements were largely offset by reductions in profit from player sales, down £1.1m from £3.2m to £2.1m, and other operating income, down £3.2m from £4.0m to £0.8m. Net interest payable was unchanged at £1.0m. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xela Posted May 7 Share Posted May 7 3 hours ago, VillaJ100 said: Was 87 a couple of weeks ago, SHA going down must have knocked a couple of % off the portfolio Quote Tom Wagner and Ara Cohen Knighthead Capital Management, LLC Hedge Fund Manager Ranked #450 out of 487 Hedge Fund Managers Relegation form. Mate. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CroVillan Posted May 7 Share Posted May 7 On 07/05/2024 at 02:37, Hank Scorpio said: As a miami fan it's only time I will appreciate anything he has said or done Fins up baby!! love it!! Pats caused us so much despair and heartbreak over the years. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VillaJ100 Posted May 7 Share Posted May 7 20 minutes ago, Xela said: Relegation form. Mate. That works out to like 21.2 out of 24, perfect alignment 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meregreen Posted May 7 Share Posted May 7 Looks like that Gypsy curse has jumped over to Knighthead. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strog Posted May 7 Share Posted May 7 3 hours ago, Jonesy7211 said: I'm not sure at all how hedge funds work, but won't any investors be getting nervous given the reported losses? And whilst KNOBHEAD’S hedge fund is valued at over $3billion, how much of this is available for investment into the club? And given the Blues' relegation, won't this make it less attractive for investors also? I may well be wrong, but the more I think about it the more I can't see where all the money is going to come from to achieve their ambitious aims. Manure's owners, until Ineos anyway, were able to generate the funds against the value of the club. I don't see how that can be replicated for a small club like Blues. Fixed that for you 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sidcow Posted May 7 VT Supporter Share Posted May 7 (edited) 5 hours ago, NeilS said: Like you, I can't see how this can work out well for them. Coventry City were also owned by a Hedge Fund Company, and they went through their lowest ebb under that ownership going down as low as League 2. Then you have the 777 Investment lot who were interested in Everton, who seem another company that don't seem to follow through with their grand plans and possibly putting everton in bigger problems with their proposes takeover. If a grand historic team like Everton are struggling to find decent owners, then what chance do sha have. The idea of a Hedge Fund is to take a distressed company, invest and improve it to make a profit later down the line. So far Knighthead have made the distressed company even more distressed . I do wonder, if they have a sticky season next year and don't obtain promotion back to the Championship, will any idea of investment in squad or infrastructure be put on hold for a little while longer or may never happen? The sacking and appointment of managers this season was a massive mistake, but we did similar replacing Deano with Gerrard before thankfully Nas and Wes sorted it out. I guess we will find out in the coming months and years whether their actions speak louder than their words, let's see who their next boss will be and who they can bring in during the summer months. All in all, this season has been amusing for us Villa fans, and makes my appreciation of NSWE even greater. Yes, the fans don't seem to realise that their owners don't actually have that money, that is just other people's money they have under management for them. It's not a million miles away from Tony Xia having bugger all of his own money and getting what money he did have from unknown sources. Whoever the people investing the actual money are, at some point they're going to start asking questions about what the **** is going on with their investment and why this club they promised would make them profits are in fact going backwards and miles away from The Golden Goose of The Premier League which they were undoubtedly promised. They may well ask for the remnants of their investment back and cut their losses. At which point they'll probably get sold to a nail bar owner from Malaysia. Edited May 7 by sidcow 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villa89 Posted May 7 Share Posted May 7 The assumption has to be that this hedge fund bought the club in order to acquire land and make a profit from the residential/ commercial development. But hopefully it's another Gillette and Hicks case of clueless American owners. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GlobalVillan Posted May 7 Share Posted May 7 I hope the fixture gods give Blues a league game v Crawley whilst we are at the Nou Camp. Either that or a Bristol Street Motors trip to Bromley. The sheer embarrassment of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strog Posted May 7 Share Posted May 7 41 minutes ago, sidcow said: Yes, the fans don't seem to realise that their owners don't actually have that money, that is just other people's money they have under management for them. It's not a million miles away from Tony Xia having bugger all of his own money and getting what money he did have from unknown sources. Whoever the people investing the actual money are, at some point they're going to start asking questions about what the **** is going on with their investment and why this club they promised would make them profits are in fact going backwards and miles away from The Golden Goose of The Premier League which they were undoubtedly promised. They may well ask for the remnants of their investment back and cut their losses. At which point they'll probably get sold to a nail bar owner from Malaysia. Here you go.. mate.. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HalfTimePost Posted May 7 Share Posted May 7 (edited) 4 hours ago, VillaJ100 said: Swiss Ramble have published Blues accounts for last year. Not a financial expert but doesn't look good to me. https://swissramble.substack.com/p/birmingham-city-finances-202223 They're lucky there's no FFP in League One. They'll have had a point deduction surely in the Championship? Though they're right up against it even if they come back up. A lot of their players will leave for free, they were already reducing Player Sales revenue... their matchday revenue will inevitably have decreased again this season and their broadcast TV revenue growth of £1.5m (to £7m total) will almost entirely disappear. They could be looking at a £30-35m loss next season, and they probably had a £25-30m loss this season. Though maybe the player exodus will allow them to drastically decrease their wagebill They've got a.big job to increase their commercial revenue again next season, in a lower league, reduced match going fans and reducing income from sales. Edited May 7 by HalfTimePost Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HalfTimePost Posted May 7 Share Posted May 7 (edited) For example, using Plymouth won League 1 last season, Broadcast Revenue: £3m (-£6m Vs Blues). Plymouths matchday Revenue was actually higher in League One than the year before and had been Similar to Blues. So it's likely Blues could also see a £900k increase by winning some games (and maybe having all their stands open) The real difference is in player wages. Blues are dropping YoY but still spending £20m a season more than Plymouth. That could be a real problem for them if they can't drastically reduce it. £29m Vs Plymouths League One spend of £9m. That's a huge percentage to drop, I'm sure there are relegation clauses and many players will leave, but they'll need to be replaced by somebody and Blues owners are on record saying they'll be the biggest spending club the Championship has ever seen, even if they aren't in it. I can't imagine it'll be easy to negotiate low wages for them Edited May 7 by HalfTimePost Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VillaChris Posted May 7 Share Posted May 7 (edited) Think they'll appoint someone like Alex Neil if Mowbray can't continue as rumoured. He's a steady enough manager and got Sunderland out of league one quickly compared to other managers. Failed at Stoke though so his stock won't be as high now with other championship teams. They certainly won't be going for another vanity appointment anytime soon after the Rooney disaster. Gareth Ainsworth probably another on the shortlist. Worked miracles at Wycombe before it all going badly wrong at QPR. Edited May 7 by VillaChris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheStagMan Posted May 7 Share Posted May 7 1 hour ago, GlobalVillan said: I hope the fixture gods give Blues a league game v Crawley whilst we are at the Nou Camp. Either that or a Bristol Street Motors trip to Bromley. The sheer embarrassment of it. Feck off. Don't want the Sty dwellers round here. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hank Scorpio Posted May 7 Share Posted May 7 I wonder what's up with Mowbray? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VillaJ100 Posted May 7 Share Posted May 7 I think the League One PSR is 60% wages/turnover, small heath are currently at like 140% but their version of parachute payments is contracts signed the summer before relegation are exempt from the 60% calculation. They can spend as much as they like on transfer fees but it's the weekly wages that will kill them. You have to expect there will be things like massive promotion bonuses etc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tinker Posted May 8 VT Supporter Share Posted May 8 Surely they should keep Rowett, if they can. These owners make shite decisions and that's the problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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