snowychap Posted January 11, 2021 Share Posted January 11, 2021 (edited) 1 hour ago, darrenm said: I'm struggling to think of anyone who is exempt from wearing a mask who should be out shopping rather than having home delivery. You appear to be drawing a connection between those with no need to wear a face covering and people who may have been advised to be shielding that isn't there. This also appears to ignore the issues with getting home deliveries, having to go to a shop to get something urgently, &c. Edited January 11, 2021 by snowychap Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darrenm Posted January 11, 2021 Share Posted January 11, 2021 7 minutes ago, snowychap said: You appear to be drawing a connection between those with no need to wear a face covering and people who may have been advised to be shielding that isn't there. This also appears to ignore the issues with getting home deliveries, having to go to a shop to get something urgently, &c. You're right I'm doing both. I've never been comfortable demonising anyone not wearing a mask because they may be forced to be out buying things when they're genuinely unable to wear one. Anxiety, severe asthma, anything else? That's why I said I'm struggling to think of the exceptions. Anxiety, yeah obviously it's a real problem but people not wearing a mask due to anxiety are then potentially infecting others. Asthma severe enough that breathing is restricted by a mask? Should they be out as highly vulnerable people? I know it's not as simple as 'let them get a home delivery' but it's another potential option. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowychap Posted January 11, 2021 Share Posted January 11, 2021 (edited) 11 minutes ago, darrenm said: Anxiety, severe asthma, anything else? There are a number of specific reasons on the government's non-exhaustive list: Quote In settings where face coverings are required in England there are some circumstances where people may not be able to wear a face covering. Please be mindful and respectful of such circumstances. Some people are less able to wear face coverings, and the reasons for this may not be visible to others. This includes (but is not limited to): children under the age of 11 (Public Health England does not recommend face coverings for children under the age of 3 for health and safety reasons) people who cannot put on, wear or remove a face covering because of a physical or mental illness or impairment, or disability where putting on, wearing or removing a face covering will cause you severe distress if you are speaking to or providing assistance to someone who relies on lip reading, clear sound or facial expressions to communicate to avoid harm or injury, or the risk of harm or injury, to yourself or others ‒ including if it would negatively impact on your ability to exercise or participate in a strenuous activity police officers and other emergency workers, given that this may interfere with their ability to serve the public Obviously some of those probably don't apply to shoppers but they are wide-ranging and certainly go beyond just anxiety and severe asthma. 11 minutes ago, darrenm said: Should they be out as highly vulnerable people? Shielding is a choice based on advice given and not a requirement. 11 minutes ago, darrenm said: I know it's not as simple as 'let them get a home delivery' 'let them get a home delivery'? I don't think anyone is barred from getting a home delivery (for those things which are able to be delivered to home - some things, such as electric and gas prepayment top-ups, for example*) - practical issues may make them difficult or nigh on impossible. What you appear to be saying is not 'let them get a home delivery' but that they should be compelled to get a home delivery if they do not need to wear a face covering as per the legislation. *I think there is an option for some to top up online but it's not a widely-offered or used option. Edited January 11, 2021 by snowychap Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post limpid Posted January 11, 2021 Administrator Popular Post Share Posted January 11, 2021 My dad had his second dose of the vaccine roday. It's happening. 18 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sidcow Posted January 11, 2021 VT Supporter Share Posted January 11, 2021 BBC Midlands Today just reported that the biggest growth area of infections is in the 35-39 age group. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanVillan Posted January 11, 2021 Share Posted January 11, 2021 You guys seem to have the vaccines in order. We (Canada) waited until last minute to place orders. Good for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HanoiVillan Posted January 12, 2021 Share Posted January 12, 2021 9 hours ago, icouldtelltheworld said: The 'poverty premium' is over £1000 a year in Britain. The example of having to buy cheaper goods that need replacing more often is a good one, there's also the other costs associated with not being able to access credit, paying your gas and electric on a pre-pay card is by the most expensive way of doing so, someone who can afford to pay a monthly bill pays much less. Yes, most things are more expensive if paid in instalments rather than up-front. Another cost that needs to be mentioned is not financial, but health-related. Being poor is bad for your health, not just because of worse food or lifestyles, but because being poor is very stressful and stress is very harmful to a person's health. For anyone interested in this, there's a really interesting podcast with a guy called Robert Sapolsky where he talks about this, and the consequences for how we should think about public policy, here: https://www.stitcher.com/show/the-ezra-klein-show/episode/robert-sapolsky-on-the-toxic-intersection-of-poverty-and-stress-58359498 It really opened my eyes to the actual consequences of how we treat the worst off. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rugeley Villa Posted January 12, 2021 Share Posted January 12, 2021 (edited) The BBC have reported about a families loss of their daughter aged 25. They fail to mention she’s obese and you have to wait for a comment off her dad saying she had high blood pressure. A death is a death I know, but I’d say she was at much higher risk than the average joe. Better examples could be used to warn us of the dangers of coronavirus. Are there any statistics out there for how many people have died under the age of 60 that were known to have no underlying health issues? Edited January 12, 2021 by Rugeley Villa Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seat68 Posted January 12, 2021 Share Posted January 12, 2021 9 minutes ago, Rugeley Villa said: The BBC have reported about a families loss of their daughter aged 25. They fail to mention she’s obese and you have to wait for a comment off her dad saying she had high blood pressure. A death is a death I know, but I’d say she was at much higher risk than the average joe. Better examples could be used to warn us of the dangers of coronavirus. Are there any statistics out there for how many people have died under the age of 60 that were known to have no underlying health issues? This was discussed briefly a short time back. The underlying health issues contain something as innocuous as excema. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rugeley Villa Posted January 12, 2021 Share Posted January 12, 2021 2 minutes ago, Seat68 said: This was discussed briefly a short time back. The underlying health issues contain something as innocuous as excema. Really? People with Diabetes are at big risk and obviously cancer patients, lung disease, heart problems etc . Stuff like that I can totally understand why you’d be fighting for your life if you caught coronavirus. Are there any reasons stated why Excema would leave you more vulnerable? . If they are classing minor things as underlying health issues then you could say this is more deadlier to people than first thought. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rugeley Villa Posted January 12, 2021 Share Posted January 12, 2021 Just heard the news that one of the blokes who works at our place has lost his wife to the virus . She’s been in ICU for the past week or so fighting it. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomav84 Posted January 12, 2021 VT Supporter Share Posted January 12, 2021 (edited) 24 minutes ago, Rugeley Villa said: The BBC have reported about a families loss of their daughter aged 25. They fail to mention she’s obese and you have to wait for a comment off her dad saying she had high blood pressure. A death is a death I know, but I’d say she was at much higher risk than the average joe. Better examples could be used to warn us of the dangers of coronavirus. Are there any statistics out there for how many people have died under the age of 60 that were known to have no underlying health issues? you don't need to be that overweight to be considered obese. i'm 19st but otherwise healthy but i'd need to lose 3 stone before i can be considered 'overweight' rather than 'obese' my point being that you can be in fairly good health but technically have an underlying health condition. it's fair to say that the virus will take you either way Edited January 12, 2021 by tomav84 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darrenm Posted January 12, 2021 Share Posted January 12, 2021 I'm obese. I run or cycle every day and I'm pretty fit. If I died of COVID I wouldn't matter because I'd have underlying health issues. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genie Posted January 12, 2021 Share Posted January 12, 2021 32 minutes ago, Rugeley Villa said: Are there any statistics out there for how many people have died under the age of 60 that were known to have no underlying health issues? Not the same as what you asked for but Hancock said the other day that 88% of the Covid deaths are in the high risk catergory of people they are looking to vaccinate by mid-Feb. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rugeley Villa Posted January 12, 2021 Share Posted January 12, 2021 (edited) I’m overweight according to my BMI ,but I’m fit enough and healthy enough to fancy my chances. I find the BMI a bit frustrating. Muscle weights heavier than fat to start with . So the statistics for underlying health issues are very misleading then. Also take into account some of us might have issues we don’t know about. More mixed messages then . Edited January 12, 2021 by Rugeley Villa 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo985 Posted January 12, 2021 VT Supporter Share Posted January 12, 2021 I believe I'd be doubly counted as having underlying health conditions. A mental Health issue and technically obese because BMI is nonsense. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo985 Posted January 12, 2021 VT Supporter Share Posted January 12, 2021 It's a shame that wearing a mask has become such a weird symbol of rebellion that not wearing one becomes a badge of honour for some idiots and people who really are exempt for legitimate reasons get accidentally lumped in with them 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mottaloo Posted January 12, 2021 Share Posted January 12, 2021 (edited) 13 hours ago, darrenm said: You're right I'm doing both. I've never been comfortable demonising anyone not wearing a mask because they may be forced to be out buying things when they're genuinely unable to wear one. Anxiety, severe asthma, anything else? That's why I said I'm struggling to think of the exceptions. Anxiety, yeah obviously it's a real problem but people not wearing a mask due to anxiety are then potentially infecting others. Asthma severe enough that breathing is restricted by a mask? Should they be out as highly vulnerable people? I know it's not as simple as 'let them get a home delivery' but it's another potential option. When i see someone without a mask on (and they're not elderly) i assume they're of the "fck you, go on i dare you to challenge me !" brigade.....just looking for a row. One yoof told my brother in a petrol station that he didn't need to wear one as he was ",redempt". Moron....weed smoking moron as it turned out. However, i get more wound up by the ones who have their mask covering their chin only, leaving mouth and nose free. I mean, how effing dumb do you want to show everyone else you really are !? Edited January 12, 2021 by mottaloo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rugeley Villa Posted January 12, 2021 Share Posted January 12, 2021 35 minutes ago, Genie said: Not the same as what you asked for but Hancock said the other day that 88% of the Covid deaths are in the high risk catergory of people they are looking to vaccinate by mid-Feb. That’s a pretty strong statistic. You’ll have a small percentage of people who were otherwise fit and healthy, but just unlucky, which can be the case with a lot of viruses, infections where it kills the unexpected . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ender4 Posted January 12, 2021 Share Posted January 12, 2021 12 minutes ago, Rugeley Villa said: That’s a pretty strong statistic. You’ll have a small percentage of people who were otherwise fit and healthy, but just unlucky, which can be the case with a lot of viruses, infections where it kills the unexpected . and some of those 'fit and healthy' might have been undiagnosed but weren't actually fit and healthy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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