Davkaus Posted June 6, 2020 Share Posted June 6, 2020 11 minutes ago, veloman said: Sounds like Ron Saunders !! Doesn't even rhyme, mate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Villan_of_oz Posted June 6, 2020 VT Supporter Share Posted June 6, 2020 15 hours ago, Follyfoot said: I see that the BLM march today has seen Churchill's statue being vandalised to chants of Churchill was a racist and a war mongerer Beggars beyond belief I hope you understand that this shouldn't define the cause, defacing anything at anytime is a wank act probably done by a small minority that revel in chaos. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HanoiVillan Posted June 6, 2020 Share Posted June 6, 2020 Over the last few days, there have been a million of these tweets from every brand imaginable. Here's a random example from some gummie bears: Lately, they have been getting increasingly absurd: A useful reminder that brands do not have values: 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo985 Posted June 7, 2020 VT Supporter Share Posted June 7, 2020 4 hours ago, HanoiVillan said: Over the last few days, there have been a million of these tweets from every brand imaginable. Here's a random example from some gummie bears: Lately, they have been getting increasingly absurd: A useful reminder that brands do not have values: It’s weird isn’t it?! I mean you can’t be angry at brands and companies posting in favour of BLM. but at the same time companies do stuff for money. Literally all of them. There might be a slight minority that do stuff for the right reason... but even companies posting for stuff you agree with like BLM, you can almost guarantee they’re doing it because it will make them money in the long run. im rambling 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Follyfoot Posted June 7, 2020 VT Supporter Share Posted June 7, 2020 6 hours ago, Villan_of_oz said: I hope you understand that this shouldn't define the cause, defacing anything at anytime is a wank act probably done by a small minority that revel in chaos. I was merely pointing out something that has happened for a second time in these protests. Unfortunately I do not see a small minority causing trouble,I was looking at the pictures outside Downing Street later yesterday It looked like a pretty much full scale riot With bottles and bricks being thrown at the police. The movement behind BLM should quickly distance themselves publicly from these acts and until then the message unfortunately will be very much diluted 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Follyfoot Posted June 7, 2020 VT Supporter Share Posted June 7, 2020 (edited) 3 hours ago, Stevo985 said: It’s weird isn’t it?! I mean you can’t be angry at brands and companies posting in favour of BLM. but at the same time companies do stuff for money. Literally all of them. There might be a slight minority that do stuff for the right reason... but even companies posting for stuff you agree with like BLM, you can almost guarantee they’re doing it because it will make them money in the long run. im rambling Follyfoot is fully committed to the eradication of racism in all forms. To show your support, I will be conducting a. car boot sale next Saturday morning at Lot 302 of the Lichfield booters club and urge you to buy an item or two to show solidarity with this worthwhile cause. Black Tony will be present with his baked potato stand for those who may feel angered and hungered at this time and for those who like foreign muck Naz will be selling some spicy stuff his Mrs has has knocked up Edited June 7, 2020 by Follyfoot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowychap Posted June 7, 2020 Share Posted June 7, 2020 18 hours ago, Follyfoot said: chants of Churchill was a racist I think they're on pretty sound ground there. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sne Posted June 7, 2020 Share Posted June 7, 2020 Been shockingly quiet about this. Quote The slaying of 32-year-old Iyad al-Halak in east Jerusalem on Saturday by Border Police, who shot him after a pursuit outside Jerusalem’s Old City, has sparked anger once again among Israel’s Arab community over police treatment of Arab citizens. The police have said the officers involved believed that Halak was holding a gun, although he was actually unarmed. A caretaker who was escorting Halak — who was autistic and on his way to a special needs institute — said she told the police numerous times that he was “disabled” before they shot him. The incident was the third of its kind in May, during which an Arab citizen was killed by police personnel or security guards, and the 15th incident in the last decade in which an Arab citizen has been killed by police. https://www.jpost.com/arab-israeli-conflict/iyad-al-halaks-killing-raises-concerns-over-police-behavior-towards-arabs-629960 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Follyfoot Posted June 7, 2020 VT Supporter Share Posted June 7, 2020 (edited) 6 minutes ago, sne said: Been shockingly quiet about this. Quote The slaying of 32-year-old Iyad al-Halak in east Jerusalem on Saturday by Border Police, who shot him after a pursuit outside Jerusalem’s Old City, has sparked anger once again among Israel’s Arab community over police treatment of Arab citizens. The police have said the officers involved believed that Halak was holding a gun, although he was actually unarmed. A caretaker who was escorting Halak — who was autistic and on his way to a special needs institute — said she told the police numerous times that he was “disabled” before they shot him. The incident was the third of its kind in May, during which an Arab citizen was killed by police personnel or security guards, and the 15th incident in the last decade in which an Arab citizen has been killed by police. https://www.jpost.com/arab-israeli-conflict/iyad-al-halaks-killing-raises-concerns-over-police-behavior-towards-arabs-629960 That is absolutely horrible. Edited June 7, 2020 by Follyfoot 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sne Posted June 7, 2020 Share Posted June 7, 2020 4 minutes ago, Follyfoot said: That is absolutely horrible. They shot him an extra 3 times in the back while he was laying on the ground. While his caretaker was pleading with them that he was autistic and unarmed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Follyfoot Posted June 7, 2020 VT Supporter Share Posted June 7, 2020 (edited) 2 minutes ago, sne said: They shot him an extra 3 times in the back while he was laying on the ground. While his caretaker was pleading with them that he was autistic and unarmed. I could hazard a guess as to why this has not been widely reported but this response could be classed as technically being racist itself by some so staying clear of it What it does demonstrate is the depravity That exists in every area of the world and every race Edited June 7, 2020 by Follyfoot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Demitri_C Posted June 7, 2020 Author Share Posted June 7, 2020 He has absolutely nothing to apologise for Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bickster Posted June 7, 2020 Moderator Share Posted June 7, 2020 18 hours ago, Follyfoot said: The irony is if he had not ‘mongered’ war Churchill was involved in more than one war you know, the warmonger bit isn't all about WWII, he did some bad stuff in the war, he did plenty of bad stuff before it too You know Saddam Hussain used to gas the Kurds? Well Churchill got that particular T-shirt many years before him All that talk about The Blitz and how those nasty Germans started the indescriminate bombing of civilian populations? Nah Churchill advocated that as far back as 1917 His racism, of course, is well documented these days He's also Boris Johnson's "hero", because he he had such a tenuous grip on facts as a journalist (and later in politics). The parallels between Johnson and Churchill in that respect (and the racism) are very clear, the traits they share is quite a compelling read. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Follyfoot Posted June 7, 2020 VT Supporter Share Posted June 7, 2020 (edited) 9 minutes ago, bickster said: Churchill was involved in more than one war you know, the warmonger bit isn't all about WWII, he did some bad stuff in the war, he did plenty of bad stuff before it too You know Saddam Hussain used to gas the Kurds? Well Churchill got that particular T-shirt many years before him All that talk about The Blitz and how those nasty Germans started the indescriminate bombing of civilian populations? Nah Churchill advocated that as far back as 1917 His racism, of course, is well documented these days He's also Boris Johnson's "hero", because he he had such a tenuous grip on facts as a journalist (and later in politics). The parallels between Johnson and Churchill in that respect (and the racism) are very clear, the traits they share is quite a compelling read. I’m well aware in the history of Churchill and also the history of the world wars and other wars. Having a retrospective view on things is very easy but the fact still remains he led us to victory against the biggest threat To our way of life this world has ever seen. I laugh at the fact that being patriotic is somehow seen as a racist trait these days And above all else Churchill was a patriot. The fact that he didn’t buckle and won through Is the reason we are able to debate this on an open forum today and these people defacing the statue should be arrested Edited June 7, 2020 by Follyfoot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisp65 Posted June 7, 2020 Share Posted June 7, 2020 9 minutes ago, Follyfoot said: above all else Churchill was a patriot. It’s rarely black and white. I’m utterly grateful to everyone and anyone that contributed to ending nazism and the horrific expansion of Germany and fascism across Europe. I think they fought for the democratic right to hold everyone up to scrutiny and not re write history or create false histories. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bickster Posted June 7, 2020 Moderator Share Posted June 7, 2020 7 minutes ago, Follyfoot said: Having a retrospective view on things is very easy It's not a retrospective view, Churchill was prety much a political pariah in the 1930's because of his very outspoken views on India in particular. His views on many things were considered extreme at the time. This is a man who shared with the Nazi's the idea that eugenics were a good thing. He long advocated for the sterilisation of people with mental illness Even with the civilian bombing, there was a tacit agreement between both sides not to do that in WWII before Churchill. Churchill became PM and straight away the gloves were off because Churchill made it quite clear, he had not truck with it. Yes, he was the man of the moment and it's probably true, without him, we may have lost and the world would be a different place now but we shouldn't ignore the fact, that he really was a man with extremely horrendous views. And that isn't revisionism, the opposition to his views was there at the time and that is there for all to see. His ideas weren't just reserved for foreign soil, you won't find anyone praising Churchill in Wales, even today 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Follyfoot Posted June 7, 2020 VT Supporter Share Posted June 7, 2020 (edited) 6 minutes ago, bickster said: It's not a retrospective view, Churchill was prety much a political pariah in the 1930's because of his very outspoken views on India in particular. His views on many things were considered extreme at the time. This is a man who shared with the Nazi's the idea that eugenics were a good thing. He long advocated for the sterilisation of people with mental illness Even with the civilian bombing, there was a tacit agreement between both sides not to do that in WWII before Churchill. Churchill became PM and straight away the gloves were off because Churchill made it quite clear, he had not truck with it. Yes, he was the man of the moment and it's probably true, without him, we may have lost and the world would be a different place now but we shouldn't ignore the fact, that he really was a man with extremely horrendous views. And that isn't revisionism, the opposition to his views was there at the time and that is there for all to see. His ideas weren't just reserved for foreign soil, you won't find anyone praising Churchill in Wales, even today Him on Thatcher are always going to be political marmite depending on your personal view And which area you live in I take on board all you say but the world was a very different place back then. The comment that we may have lost the war and the world would be a different place somewhat sugarcoats the situation as it would have been Or maybe Mr Hitler might of toned down His antics in victory. Thank you anyway for filling a rather boring Sunday morning waiting for my family to get up and have a good day Edited June 7, 2020 by Follyfoot 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davkaus Posted June 7, 2020 Share Posted June 7, 2020 (edited) 24 minutes ago, Follyfoot said: I laugh at the fact that being patriotic is somehow seen as a racist trait these days And above all else Churchill was a patriot. Can we just be very clear that Churchill's patriotism has absolutely nothing to do with the widespread acknowledgement that he was horrendously racist. Edited June 7, 2020 by Davkaus 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Chindie Posted June 7, 2020 VT Supporter Popular Post Share Posted June 7, 2020 It's possible to acknowledge Churchill was a great wartime leader whilst also acknowledging he was also a deeply flawed character, including being a massive racist. 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sharkyvilla Posted June 7, 2020 Share Posted June 7, 2020 1 minute ago, Chindie said: It's possible to acknowledge Churchill was a great wartime leader whilst also acknowledging he was also a deeply flawed character, including being a massive racist. Exactly. The people booted him out of office at the first opportunity too didn't they? I still think defacing a monument to him is out of order though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts