Horan86 Posted December 23, 2019 Share Posted December 23, 2019 You are right to a degree, I still don't think its the system though you should be more defensive against the better teams but you can do that still in a 433 I still think it's a personnel issue I think players have lost form and confidence the 3 goals against Southampton had nothing to do with the system all individual errors and same goes for Leicester game and Sheff utd game of more of a concern for me would be our defending from set pieces and the mistakes players are making rather than it being a 352 or a 442 or a 4231 whatever system is there unless you can defend set pieces and stop making errors that lead to goals you are going to be in trouble 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam2003 Posted December 23, 2019 Share Posted December 23, 2019 50 minutes ago, TRO said: Make no mistake.....If we signed Deeney, or a player similar but younger......there would be an inquest from the fan base. I'm sorry mate, many have delusions of grandeur. Wesley was Brazillian, thats all they needed to know, Chelmsley Wood, hasn't got the same ring to it....The fact Deeney runs through brick walls, like our own Andy Gray did and he scores goals, has no merit. We just want champagne players who show us eye candy. I like Deeney but Andy Gray is a bit of a stretch as a comparison TRO. That’s like saying Carles Gil has a cracking left foot just like Leo Messi Joking aside though I do like Deeney a lot. Actually reminds me a lot of Che Adams in the way that I see Adams coming good at the top level a few years from now. Which I think may well also be the case with Wesley but know few on here agree at the moment. I’ve just seen us bomb out too many young players who go on to be huge stars! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted December 23, 2019 Share Posted December 23, 2019 51 minutes ago, villabromsgrove said: Call it what you like, whether it be heart, passion, fight, belief .... what this Villa side lacks above all is GUTS! Heads drop, players stand off, movement becomes limited .... Suddenly an individual does something special and off we go for ten minutes, buzzing with energy and effort but no visible plan, and then when nothing happens heads begin to drop again .... and repeat. Every other team in the Premier League has much bigger balls and belief they we do. Our lack of bottle makes ordinary teams look like 'Barcelona' on a regular basis. Is Dean just too nice? you have been watching the games.....that's sneaky lol. and you know what your talking about,....... that's even sneakier.lol I think its all of much of the same thing.....but its clearly missing......and more worrying, very difficult to get back. Right now Dean doesn't seem to know whether he is drilled, bored or Countersunk.....for whatever reason,The players are not doing it for him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted December 23, 2019 Share Posted December 23, 2019 (edited) 11 minutes ago, Adam2003 said: I like Deeney but Andy Gray is a bit of a stretch as a comparison TRO. That’s like saying Carles Gil has a cracking left foot just like Leo Messi Joking aside though I do like Deeney a lot. Actually reminds me a lot of Che Adams in the way that I see Adams coming good at the top level a few years from now. Which I think may well also be the case with Wesley but know few on here agree at the moment. I’ve just seen us bomb out too many young players who go on to be huge stars! I was referring to grit & Audacity in the main, you interpreted the rest.....but the point was Many would not even consider a player like Deeney ( irrespective of his Blues connections) he is not "show biz "enough, too much grass roots.....the second bit is too many sherberts, me thinks. Huge Stars? who I think we have failed to get the best out of some, Albrighton- Traore-Stevens to name a few. Edited December 23, 2019 by TRO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveAV1 Posted December 23, 2019 Share Posted December 23, 2019 1 hour ago, TRO said: or the Defensive coach is being silenced and his suggestions are being ignored? I too have no idea, so we can all fall down on the side of one person or another.....but with no idea, its never helpful. The defence is doing badly so we must be ignoring the defensive coach? I know none of us really know but that’s a rather bizarre conclusion to come to. Or perhaps a rather obvious one if your mind is only open to the conclusion that the head coach isn’t up to the job? John Terry was an excellent player, but is as yet unproven as a coach. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted December 23, 2019 Share Posted December 23, 2019 (edited) 6 minutes ago, DaveAV1 said: The defence is doing badly so we must be ignoring the defensive coach? I know none of us really know but that’s a rather bizarre conclusion to come to. Or perhaps a rather obvious one if your mind is only open to the conclusion that the head coach isn’t up to the job? John Terry was an excellent player, but is as yet unproven as a coach. but it isn't a conclusion Dave, so it can't be bizarre either. I was merely making a suggestion.....If and I emphasis If JT is having his say, curtailed, or inhibited.... then its hard to blame him. We can't say one way or the other unless we know......I am not trying to be judge and jury, its just a forum to make suggestions. but I might add, the whole team can't defend, so he might be stretching his sphere of influence, beyond his pay grade....don't you think? Edited December 23, 2019 by TRO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villalad21 Posted December 23, 2019 Share Posted December 23, 2019 The formation isn't the issue. The shape and structure is the issue. The big gap between our midfield and defense. It's so easy to get past our midfield. Even a 10 man Brighton did it countless times and got into dangerous positions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tomaszk Posted December 23, 2019 Share Posted December 23, 2019 1 hour ago, TRO said: Make no mistake.....If we signed Deeney, or a player similar but younger......there would be an inquest from the fan base. I'm sorry mate, many have delusions of grandeur. Wesley was Brazillian, thats all they needed to know, Chelmsley Wood, hasn't got the same ring to it....The fact Deeney runs through brick walls, like our own Andy Gray did and he scores goals, has no merit. We just want champagne players who show us eye candy. On 02/11/2019 at 23:34, Tomaszk said: No chance we'd get Deeney. Club captain from a relegation rival. He's exactly what we need. If we can find a 22 year old Deeney with a 30 year old Deeney's attitude we'll be finishing 12th or higher with zero issues. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sheepyvillian Posted December 23, 2019 Share Posted December 23, 2019 2 hours ago, TRO said: just so sad, he is not wrong. I guess you could use that same adage for the way we are playing. So you want a change of manager, because if it's as deep as you surmise then crossing one's fingers is an exercise in futility. I want this manager to stay and to be given the chance to turn things around. Another new manager at this stage isn't going to be the answer. The players need to take the bull by it's horns. Hopefully the fans will be right behind them on Wednesday and that can give them the momentum to compete for what will be a very important victory. I refuse to believe the team is in demise. When things are this bad every mistake is magnified and it always seems worse than what it is. Yes, there are some concerning problems, but a Villa Park awash with negativity isn't going to solve them. Through thick and thin, let's get behind them and keep the faith. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
avfc1982am Posted December 23, 2019 Share Posted December 23, 2019 Don't shoot me down as I am unarmed and its just a slightly off topic suggestion, but....I wonder if bringing Konsa into the DM slot would add that bit of physicality and protection in front of the backline that we are missing? From what I gather he has played there before, albeit for Charlton. He's a unit, mobile, has pace, can crunch in the tackle and can pass the ball. He does seem the type of player that could be quite versatile. He'd also give us an aerial presence in midfield that we don't have and as mentioned provide cover in front of the backline rather than in a classic 3. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sheepyvillian Posted December 23, 2019 Share Posted December 23, 2019 2 minutes ago, avfc1982am said: Don't shoot me down as I am unarmed and its just a slightly off topic suggestion, but....I wonder if bringing Konsa into the DM slot would add that bit of physicality and protection in front of the backline that we are missing? From what I gather he has played there before, albeit for Charlton. He's a unit, mobile, has pace, can crunch in the tackle and can pass the ball. He does seem the type of player that could be quite versatile. He'd also give us an aerial presence in midfield that we don't have and as mentioned provide cover in front of the backline rather than in a classic 3. Certainly food for thought. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sheepyvillian Posted December 23, 2019 Share Posted December 23, 2019 38 minutes ago, Tomaszk said: He's a blue nose, remember how he celebrated at Villa Park when scoring for Watford? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vive_La_Villa Posted December 23, 2019 Share Posted December 23, 2019 4 minutes ago, avfc1982am said: Don't shoot me down as I am unarmed and its just a slightly off topic suggestion, but....I wonder if bringing Konsa into the DM slot would add that bit of physicality and protection in front of the backline that we are missing? From what I gather he has played there before, albeit for Charlton. He's a unit, mobile, has pace, can crunch in the tackle and can pass the ball. He does seem the type of player that could be quite versatile. He'd also give us an aerial presence in midfield that we don't have and as mentioned provide cover in front of the backline rather than in a classic 3. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
avfc1982am Posted December 23, 2019 Share Posted December 23, 2019 By the way I actually agree with you TRO. We don't defend as a unit. It's not a defender issue but a team issue. Positional, Spatial awareness, with and without the ball. Movement, marking, covering. The fundamentals are just not on point atm. I actually think the defence get a hard time because of our midfields inability to grip games by the scruff of the neck. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hippo Posted December 23, 2019 Share Posted December 23, 2019 1 hour ago, TRO said: but it isn't a conclusion Dave, so it can't be bizarre either. I was merely making a suggestion.....If and I emphasis If JT is having his say, curtailed, or inhibited.... then its hard to blame him. We can't say one way or the other unless we know......I am not trying to be judge and jury, its just a forum to make suggestions. but I might add, the whole team can't defend, so he might be stretching his sphere of influence, beyond his pay grade....don't you think? JT might be a great defensive coach - perhaps he just can't get much out of Guilbert, Target and co........and I don't think he would be alone in that TBH. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mykeyb Posted December 23, 2019 Share Posted December 23, 2019 1 hour ago, villalad21 said: The formation isn't the issue. The shape and structure is the issue. The big gap between our midfield and defense. It's so easy to get past our midfield. Even a 10 man Brighton did it countless times and got into dangerous positions. It's been that way for ages, why hasn't the manager made tweaks to the system? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nabby Posted December 23, 2019 Share Posted December 23, 2019 We seem to be playing a 4-3-3 the way Man City do , who themselves are very suspect at the back but for the most part get away with it as they are so dominate in possession..we are not which leads to teams exploiting the gaps left. I watched the MOTD highlights, both FBs were pushed up in line with each other which would seem to indicate they are they by instruction.This leaves space wide for any quick balls played there. MF is the issue untill we can control games there the defence will always be under pressure and the forwards won't see enough of the ball.Take Jack as an example , if he is the wide left attacker if he is dropping into his own half to get the ball something is going wrong somewhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laughable Chimp Posted December 23, 2019 Share Posted December 23, 2019 (edited) 8 minutes ago, mykeyb said: It's been that way for ages, why hasn't the manager made tweaks to the system? Because either he's out of his depth and doesn't know how to tweak the system, or the players he has at his disposal aren't good enough for him. The more I read about Smith the more I'm convinced that he's not a manager who can fit square pegs into round holes. He has a system that he knows is capable of working, and he will persist with it to the ends of the earth because its all he's got. The guy just isn't very versatile as a manager. That's not necessarily a bad thing provided he has the players to do it and he has the time to actually build the squad to his liking. The question is, do we gamble with Smith getting the right players in January and making sure they actually fit his system or do we get a manager who's more versatile in his approach and is better at getting the best out of our current group of players we do have? Edited December 23, 2019 by Laughable Chimp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tomaszk Posted December 23, 2019 Share Posted December 23, 2019 42 minutes ago, sheepyvillian said: He's a blue nose, remember how he celebrated at Villa Park when scoring for Watford? If we can find a 22 year old Deeney with a 30 year old Deeney's attitude we'll be finishing 12th or higher with zero issues. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villalad21 Posted December 23, 2019 Share Posted December 23, 2019 5 minutes ago, mykeyb said: It's been that way for ages, why hasn't the manager made tweaks to the system? Smith has not changed since Walsall. I think he is too stubborn with his system. But one thing is for sure. Something has to happen in January or we're going down 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts