Dean Smith

[villalad21]

8 hours ago, Zatman said:

highest ranking English manager last season, people rave about Potter and Howe and didnt finish near Smith. Howe didnt even have a job

Just shows the state of English managers at the moment. 

If you think he deserved praise from the media for finishing 11th in the table I don't know what to say to you. 

If he ever get into Europe or win a trophy we may have a different conversation. 

By your same logic I didn't see any of you raving about Steve Bruce for finishing 13th in the 19/20 season when no one expected them to. 

Edited September 1, 2021 by villalad21

[Vive_La_Villa]

I doubt any manager has ever got promoted with only 2 players good enough for the first team and then kept them up. Regardless of what they had to spend. 

If you know the context of where we were when we came up you’d know Smith has done a great job. I don’t expect the media or fans of other teams to know the detail. All they will see is we have spent x amount and are mid table which is fine.  

However what I don’t understand is how fans of villa that know all the circumstances since promotion and why we’ve had to sign so many players still find it so difficult to give him any credit. 

On to this season I think the owners will expect improvement on last season. If at any stage this season we go on a long run of form and get dragged in to a relegation battle I could see his job under pressure. I don’t think that will happen though.   

[villalad21]

26 minutes ago, Vive_La_Villa said:

I doubt any manager has ever got promoted with only 2 players good enough for the first team and then kept them up. Regardless of what they had to spend. 

If you know the context of where we were when we came up you’d know Smith has done a great job. I don’t expect the media or fans of other teams to know the detail. All they will see is we have spent x amount and are mid table which is fine.  

However what I don’t understand is how fans of villa that know all the circumstances since promotion and why we’ve had to sign so many players still find it so difficult to give him any credit. 

On to this season I think the owners will expect improvement on last season. If at any stage this season we go on a long run of form and get dragged in to a relegation battle I could see his job under pressure. I don’t think that will happen though.   

Sean Dyche has done the exact same job. Actually he has done if for a lot more seasons and on a shoestring budget.

By your logic Sean Dyche must be off the top an elite world class manager then?

Don't see you complaining about Dyche not receiving a lot of media attention? Mid table is per definition mediocre. Sorry but you won't get any praise for that. It's a job done nothing more, nothing less.

[dont_do_it_doug.]

It is honestly astounding that we were heading for Europe last season before Mike Lubb's biscuit shins gave way, despite the fact we have the worst-midfield-ever™

Smith must be some gaffer eh.

[cb_82]

1 hour ago, villalad21 said:

Sean Dyche has done the exact same job. Actually he has done if for a lot more seasons and on a shoestring budget.

By your logic Sean Dyche must be off the top an elite world class manager then?

Don't see you complaining about Dyche not receiving a lot of media attention? Mid table is per definition mediocre. Sorry but you won't get any praise for that. It's a job done nothing more, nothing less.

For me personally its not about i want him to get or he deserves to get the praise its more there are sections of fans who just cant wait to criticise both Smith and the club. 

This is probably for a wider thread than the Dean Smith one but here you go.....I think for all the ambition is Europe BUT not on a Wolves type model of two seasons of 7th placed finishes and then drop off but more like when we get there we will be there to stay and alot of that is improving on and building on the mistakes of the past so that go forward there is an actual strategy in place.......

Investment in Youth - For both our gain and future financial gain, you only have to look at the Grealish sale to understand that and how 100m goes straight onto the books as an academy sale - Can you imagine if we can start having 2-3 sales a year at 10/15m as per Chelsea and Man City alongside the 2/3 that make it through to the squad?

A pathway for youth - Ramsey/Chuck/Bidace all with first team appearances, and more to come (Look at our squad last night winning in the JPT against ''Men'') there was a massive clamber for the Metz lad Sarr, hes 18? Why not give Carny that game time?

A transfer plan - We don't get who we want then we are patient and we look to buy at the right time & right value for what we need, we do not continue to stockpile players on big wages even if they provide a short term fix (Drinkwater/Sammatta being a prime example of that type of mistake)

People  - ROK/JT now gone and Shakespeare and A.N Other to come in - Again I think this appointment will be really interesting to how it links with the above and would be alongside a number of other positions we have recruited eg Lange/McKenzie

Its been said many times but were a complete mess and so close to going bust it was untrue however there really is a positive future....Is this with Smith for the whole journey? Im sure it wont as there will be better managers when we get to different points however this ''I want it now, sign the football manager stars (Amazes me how many of our fans watch French football) and get me Jose Winagame'' culture drives me mad, we haven't been in Europe for 10 plus years and won nothing since 96, Im sure we can have that bit of patience to enjoy where we are now in comfort and look forward to an exciting future

 

[cb_82]

8 minutes ago, cb_82 said:

For me personally its not about i want him to get or he deserves to get the praise its more there are sections of fans who just cant wait to criticise both Smith and the club. 

This is probably for a wider thread than the Dean Smith one but here you go.....I think for all the ambition is Europe BUT not on a Wolves type model of two seasons of 7th placed finishes and then drop off but more like when we get there we will be there to stay and alot of that is improving on and building on the mistakes of the past so that go forward there is an actual strategy in place.......

Investment in Youth - For both our gain and future financial gain, you only have to look at the Grealish sale to understand that and how 100m goes straight onto the books as an academy sale - Can you imagine if we can start having 2-3 sales a year at 10/15m as per Chelsea and Man City alongside the 2/3 that make it through to the squad?

A pathway for youth - Ramsey/Chuck/Bidace all with first team appearances, and more to come (Look at our squad last night winning in the JPT against ''Men'') there was a massive clamber for the Metz lad Sarr, hes 18? Why not give Carny that game time?

A transfer plan - We don't get who we want then we are patient and we look to buy at the right time & right value for what we need, we do not continue to stockpile players on big wages even if they provide a short term fix (Drinkwater/Sammatta being a prime example of that type of mistake)

People  - ROK/JT now gone and Shakespeare and A.N Other to come in - Again I think this appointment will be really interesting to how it links with the above and would be alongside a number of other positions we have recruited eg Lange/McKenzie

Its been said many times but were a complete mess and so close to going bust it was untrue however there really is a positive future....Is this with Smith for the whole journey? Im sure it wont as there will be better managers when we get to different points however this ''I want it now, sign the football manager stars (Amazes me how many of our fans watch French football) and get me Jose Winagame'' culture drives me mad, we haven't been in Europe for 10 plus years and won nothing since 96, Im sure we can have that bit of patience to enjoy where we are now in comfort and look forward to an exciting future

 

Genuinely had not seen the Danks news when I wrote this but there you go.....It all links in !

[The Fun Factory]

I think we should give Deano some more love.

I like the fact that we were prepared to give a lower league manager who has earnt his dues a chance to coach his boyhood club.

Modern football is a cruel heartless bar steward of a sport but things like this make you want to believe in positive change.

Yes he has had a large budget to play with but a promotion, league cup final and now a mid table finish in the prem is really good progress.

I would like us to stick with Deano and see where it takes us.

[Big Salad]

Dean is not a perfect manager by any means; nobody is.

But I think he has done pretty damn well here tbh and it will take a lot for me at least, to jump on the let's sack him train.

Edited September 1, 2021 by Big Salad

[a m ole]

6 minutes ago, The Fun Factory said:

I think we should give Deano some more love.

I like the fact that we were prepared to give a lower league manager who has earnt his dues a chance to coach his boyhood club.

Modern football is a cruel heartless bar steward of a sport but things like this make you want to believe in positive change.

Yes he has had a large budget to play with but a promotion, league cup final and now a mid table finish in the prem is really good progress.

I would like us to stick with Deano and see where it takes us.

There’s a very small number of coaches I think might be achieving more at this moment in time, and we wouldn’t be able to get any of them.

[Vive_La_Villa]

2 hours ago, villalad21 said:

Sean Dyche has done the exact same job. Actually he has done if for a lot more seasons and on a shoestring budget.

By your logic Sean Dyche must be off the top an elite world class manager then?

Don't see you complaining about Dyche not receiving a lot of media attention? Mid table is per definition mediocre. Sorry but you won't get any praise for that. It's a job done nothing more, nothing less.

Firstly I never said Smith was an elite world class manager. Secondly I never said he should get media attention.  Thirdly I think Dyche is a very good manager and he does get lots of media attention for what he has achieved at Burnley!

I’m not going back several years to look at the team Sean Dyche got promoted with but I do remember he got relegated first season and then came straight back up. He actually had a team to keep up, didn’t have to build one from scratch. 
 

You’re never going to give Smith credit for anything so it’s pointless ever debating him with you.

You’re better off supporting a Man City or Chelsea if you cant handle ‘mediocrity’.

Edited September 1, 2021 by Vive_La_Villa

[weedman]

This debate is seemingly endless. People dont think the injuries etc that we've had this season are a good enough excuse for not winning every game because the teams we played were poor, but surely even the most negative, desperate for Smith to fail from day 1 poster can still see the mitigating circumstances so far this season?

I mean, if our first team was:

Martinez

Cash, Konsa, Tuanzebe, Targett

Luiz, Chukwuemeka, A Young

Buendia Ings El Ghazi

and then we went out on deadline day and signed Mings, Bailey, Watkins, McGinn, Sanson, Ramsey and Traore, do you not think that would improve us over the course of the season?

If the above team is a "battle against relegation" team, then surely after adding all those players it would become a mid table or "challenging for Europe" team? Or do you think that we'll see no improvement when those players come into the team? The only way that you would consider our injuries and disrupted pre season not to be a valid excuse is if you already view Smith in a negaitve way and are looking for ways to "prove" your point. Either that or a troll (mentioning no names, but we all know who it is)

I accept that my opinon may not be right, but I just cant understand how else anyone can just dismiss the mitigating circumstances in order to proclaim Smith to be not getting the most out of the team

[omariqy]

2 hours ago, PussEKatt said:

Our team was/is good enough to beat 2 promoted teams.Why didnt we win both games ?!

Such a blanket statement without looking at the games in context. 

Watford - first home game for fans, newly promoted team, buzzing to be back. Worst time to play a promoted side. We were missing Bailey, Traore, Watkins plus our pre-season really impacted us. Even then the game goes on another 5 minutes and we draw it. 

Brentford - we were literally missing 5/6 first teamers. You do that to any team and you will struggle against any PL side. Regardless if they are promoted or not. Let’s take West Ham as an example. Take out Ogbonna, Rice, Fornals, Benrahma, Antonio. What are you left with?  A team that would struggle against any side. Do the same to Everton? Keane, Allan, Doucure, Richarlison, Calvert-Lewin - again they would struggle.

[Vive_La_Villa]

1 hour ago, villalad21 said:

Will there be an excuse for every game we lose? 

We should be beating teams like these. If we don't it puts more pressure to get results against the bigger teams. 

No excuse for Watford. Smith said it himself. But if you can’t understand why a draw against Brentford was a decent result then again no point discussing football with you.

[Vive_La_Villa]

it’s unforgivable that we only got 4 points from the first 3 games considering who we play next.  Even if the whole team was out with covid, we have to win games when have harder fixtures straight after.  

Now if we had some easier fixtures coming up it wouldn’t be too bad. But we haven’t so Dean Smith sucks as a manager. 
 

SMITH OUT! 

Edited September 1, 2021 by Vive_La_Villa

[KMitch]

7 hours ago, The Fun Factory said:

I think we should give Deano some more love.

I like the fact that we were prepared to give a lower league manager who has earnt his dues a chance to coach his boyhood club.

Modern football is a cruel heartless bar steward of a sport but things like this make you want to believe in positive change.

Yes he has had a large budget to play with but a promotion, league cup final and now a mid table finish in the prem is really good progress.

I would like us to stick with Deano and see where it takes us.

This.  Absolutely.  Don't forget about team culture and the dressing room mentality.  Our entire team WANTS to win, the players hold each other accountable, and everyone seems to get along well.  Compare that with the Lerner era with the "Bomb Squad".

[alreadyexists]

Honestly, pop them on the ignore list, don’t quote them… problem solved.

[Vive_La_Villa]

55 minutes ago, villalad21 said:

Here's a deal.

How about sticking to the topic, and not discussing posters in the Dean Smith thread.

Got any personal beef with me I'd be happy to receive a PM from either of you. Don't take it here. Stay on topic.

Fair enough. I’ll keep this in mind.

[string28]

You can see with the coaching staff we are now bringing in that dean know what we need and is making sure we are stronger this time great to see.

Edited September 1, 2021 by string28

[TheStagMan]

4 minutes ago, string28 said:

You can see with the coaching staff we are now bringing in that dean know what we need and is making sure we are stronger this time great to see.

He is indeed a very good manager and we are lucky to have him.

 

Haters are gonna hate, but so what?

[KentVillan]

29 minutes ago, string28 said:

You can see with the coaching staff we are now bringing in that dean know what we need and is making sure we are stronger this time great to see.

This is Smith’s best quality IMO. He’s trying to build the club as an organisation where every base is covered, not as a cult of personality which will need completely rebuilding when he leaves.

If you look at Alex Ferguson’s later career, a lot of his success was driven by figures like McLaren (seriously) and Queiroz. He changed his tactical philosophy by refreshing the coaching setup.

I see something similar happening with Smith, who has clearly become more receptive to counter attacking football and 4-4-2 since getting Shakespeare involved.

He has also talked about bringing in a European coach to give the coaching setup a more international feel - showing awareness for some shortcomings on that front. I just always get the impression that where there are weaknesses, he sees them. He might not have an immediate solution up his sleeve, but generally things always seem to move in the right direction.

How many other managers have achieved an improvement along same lines as 33rd -> 17th -> 11th in consecutive seasons?