Pimlico_Villa Posted December 16, 2018 Share Posted December 16, 2018 Only concern is that he likes Whelan. Watched in isolation, Whelan is a tidy and industrious player that is usually difficult to fault. However, having in the team desecates our attacking capacity. Because he sits far too deep, he forces us deep as a unit and the gap between our MF and Forwards is too much. I said before yesterday’s game when I saw the team sheet that we’d struggle to get anything. Whelan just kills us. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave J Posted December 16, 2018 Share Posted December 16, 2018 1 minute ago, Pimlico_Villa said: Only concern is that he likes Whelan. Watched in isolation, Whelan is a tidy and industrious player that is usually difficult to fault. However, having in the team desecates our attacking capacity. Because he sits far too deep, he forces us deep as a unit and the gap between our MF and Forwards is too much. I said before yesterday’s game when I saw the team sheet that we’d struggle to get anything. Whelan just kills us. Maybe Dean thought the prospect of him playing against his former club would have a beneficial factor for the team ? That said I do agree with you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Spoony Posted December 16, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted December 16, 2018 For me Whelan isn’t an issue. He’s decent enough at breaking up play. It’s our defence. We don’t have a single decent defender except maybe Tuanzebe. Gutted Chester has just crumbled as I really liked him but something is just not right there. Either he’s seriously low on confidence or he’s a bang average player who just prospered under Bruceball. 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo985 Posted December 17, 2018 VT Supporter Share Posted December 17, 2018 On 15/12/2018 at 22:10, bobzy said: If you didn't lambast Bruce at every opportunity and blame him for absolutely everything bad in life, you were automatically a "defender of" and "fan of" Bruce. Them were the rules. Yep, and seemingly you have to caveat every negative we experience now with the assurance that it would have been even worse under Bruce, just in case people have forgotten how much you dislike him. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo985 Posted December 17, 2018 VT Supporter Share Posted December 17, 2018 (edited) 19 hours ago, Pimlico_Villa said: Only concern is that he likes Whelan. Watched in isolation, Whelan is a tidy and industrious player that is usually difficult to fault. However, having in the team desecates our attacking capacity. Because he sits far too deep, he forces us deep as a unit and the gap between our MF and Forwards is too much. I said before yesterday’s game when I saw the team sheet that we’d struggle to get anything. Whelan just kills us. Outside of the first choice midfield 3 of Grealish, McGinn and Hourihane; Whelan is our best midfielder. Unless we sign someone else in January then he'll continue to get gametime. FWIW I think he's absolutely fine and it was the absence of Grealish rather than the addition of Whelan that hurt us on Saturday, coupled with Rowett's very defensive style. Against a different team that midfield combination would do well. Edited December 17, 2018 by Stevo985 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KenjiOgiwara Posted December 17, 2018 Share Posted December 17, 2018 I am no big Whelan fan, but he is very good defensively. And the question for me is why 5 other attacking players can't handle the offensive aspect without him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AvfcRigo82 Posted December 17, 2018 Share Posted December 17, 2018 SSN doing a feature on Villa today with players donating presents etc. out their own wages. Live every hour throughout the day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villalad21 Posted December 17, 2018 Share Posted December 17, 2018 5 hours ago, KenjiOgiwara said: I am no big Whelan fan, but he is very good defensively. And the question for me is why 5 other attacking players can't handle the offensive aspect without him. We didn't look any better defensively with him in the starting 11 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted December 17, 2018 Share Posted December 17, 2018 (edited) On 16/12/2018 at 12:21, Zatman said: 23 goals in 10 games is mighty impressive and some of these games we could have scored more and conceded 12 , just over a goal a game.....If we can address that, we will be on our way. 11 in 4 games.....3 at Home. Blues Forest Albion Stoke Most of them were well, well stoppable....in the main not picking up and not tracking the man. Edited December 17, 2018 by TRO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted December 17, 2018 Share Posted December 17, 2018 On 16/12/2018 at 13:28, Pimlico_Villa said: Only concern is that he likes Whelan. Watched in isolation, Whelan is a tidy and industrious player that is usually difficult to fault. However, having in the team desecates our attacking capacity. Because he sits far too deep, he forces us deep as a unit and the gap between our MF and Forwards is too much. I said before yesterday’s game when I saw the team sheet that we’d struggle to get anything. Whelan just kills us. I am not a whelan fan. But I think its a question of watching the team/play with the ball v with out the ball. All the claims anti - Whelan fans make are not wrong....He is too slow etc,etc.....but his positioning when he hasn't got the ball, leaves others wanting. If we can manage with 70-80% possession, we don't need him....but in the main we can't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted December 17, 2018 Share Posted December 17, 2018 (edited) On 15/12/2018 at 20:22, VillaChris said: I think he was pretty worried Stoke's 3 man midfield would've gobbled up our two if we'd gone for that particularly with Ryan Woods starting who DS knows so well. As it happens Joe Allen was superb in the box to box role and they dominated our three anyway. I'd have started with Kodjia tbh as Stoke's back 4 is weak and they'd have struggled to handle four out and out attacking players. Certainly should've put him on earlier than 65 minutes. I agree we we were below par and moved the ball too slowly on the counter attack (Grealish not being around obvious miss here). Difference is a poor performance under DS still has us scoring two while we'd have struggled to get two shots on target with a similar level under Steve Bruce. Shawcross Williams Pieters Martina and Butland thrown in for good measure. Tell me who the strong ones are ,Chris? Edited December 17, 2018 by TRO 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted December 17, 2018 Share Posted December 17, 2018 2 hours ago, villalad21 said: We didn't look any better defensively with him in the starting 11 but we might have lost. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave J Posted December 17, 2018 Share Posted December 17, 2018 2 hours ago, villalad21 said: We didn't look any better defensively with him in the starting 11 Agreed - it seems fashionable on here to " big him up " for whatever reason this might be by a very tiny few. The guy is an average footballer - he tries his hardest and makes the most of his limitations and for this alone he deserves credit - but you can't steer away from him being average - this is who he is. He will do a job from time to time in this division and I suspect he is a good pro to have around the place - but Stoke didn't let him leave for no reason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VillaChris Posted December 17, 2018 Share Posted December 17, 2018 3 hours ago, TRO said: Shawcross Williams Pieters Martina and Butland thrown in for good measure. Tell me who the strong ones are ,Chris? Stoke have conceded loads of goals this season. A few of their results: Leeds 3-1 Stoke Preston 2-2 Stoke Stoke 0-3 Wigan Sheff Wed 2-2 Stoke Stoke 2-3 Blackburn Rotherham 2-2 Stoke Stoke 2-2 QPR Reading 2-2 Stoke Probably adds to my theory no one in this league can really defend so our own poor back 4 won't be as detrimental to our hopes as made out. As for those you've mentioned I think Butland is a bit overrated (reminds me of Shay Given), Shawcross and Willams used to be solid defenders but Shawcross had loads of back injuries so he's really slow now and Williams was terrible at Everton and no one on their oatcake forum rates Cuco Martina. He just watched Kodjia score the header if you see the second goal again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikeyp102 Posted December 17, 2018 Share Posted December 17, 2018 3 hours ago, Dave J said: Agreed - it seems fashionable on here to " big him up " for whatever reason this might be by a very tiny few. The guy is an average footballer - he tries his hardest and makes the most of his limitations and for this alone he deserves credit - but you can't steer away from him being average - this is who he is. He will do a job from time to time in this division and I suspect he is a good pro to have around the place - but Stoke didn't let him leave for no reason. It really doesn’t seem that at all.. if anything it goes the other way, both here and at the ground. Some people have an irrational hatred for him no matter how he plays. I’ve never seen anyone argue that he’s above average, just that average at times is better than others (I’m looking at Conor here). 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave J Posted December 17, 2018 Share Posted December 17, 2018 21 minutes ago, mikeyp102 said: It really doesn’t seem that at all.. if anything it goes the other way, both here and at the ground. Some people have an irrational hatred for him no matter how he plays. I’ve never seen anyone argue that he’s above average, just that average at times is better than others (I’m looking at Conor here). You'll note I said a tiny few - this is precisely what I mean. No more no less. And I don't think hate is the correct phrase - some may have a very strong dislike of his footballing abilities - I doubt very much anyone would dislike him as a person - he seems a genuine pro to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thunderball Posted December 17, 2018 Share Posted December 17, 2018 4 hours ago, TRO said: Shawcross Williams Pieters Martina You are way off here, no way JGP is scouting American serial killer Arthur Shawcross. And I can’t see Serena, Navratilova nor Belgian golfing giant Thomas Pieters adding anything to our defence unless of course Smith plays them in goal? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tomaszk Posted December 17, 2018 Share Posted December 17, 2018 1 hour ago, VillaChris said: Stoke have conceded loads of goals this season. A few of their results: Leeds 3-1 Stoke Preston 2-2 Stoke Stoke 0-3 Wigan Sheff Wed 2-2 Stoke Stoke 2-3 Blackburn Rotherham 2-2 Stoke Stoke 2-2 QPR Reading 2-2 Stoke Surprised at some of those! They have come into form similar to us as well in the last 6 games. I thought they were the best team we've played this season. That midfield three is so strong. Comparing them to West Brom and Norwich who I've seen, Stoke are miles ahead, purely on just those three bombing round midfield. Rowett defensive football is the only thing that will stop them getting into the play-offs. The only team I'd be worried about meeting on what I've seen so far. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted December 17, 2018 Share Posted December 17, 2018 5 hours ago, TRO said: Shawcross Williams Pieters Martina and Butland thrown in for good measure. Tell me who the strong ones are ,Chris? thats a good back 4 in 2013 except Martina who has always been poor and Williams is in semi-retirement and looked overweight last season Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tomaszk Posted December 17, 2018 Share Posted December 17, 2018 5 hours ago, TRO said: Shawcross Williams Pieters Martina and Butland thrown in for good measure. Tell me who the strong ones are ,Chris? I think that's very strong for the Championship. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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