Dean Smith

[DCJonah]

Just now, VillanousOne said:

I agree that they have earned their shirts, to be honest I don't think Mings or Luiz should be dropped, yes I think we have better balance with Nakamba in the side, but McGinn and Barkley should be dropped ahead of Luiz.

But also Hause and Nakamba also deserve to be give a chance to prove themselves, last season was Nakamba's first in the Prem there is every chance he is settling in better now and improving I don't think he has more talent than Luiz or McGinn - just we look more balanced with him in the team. It's not always about playing all your best players it's about playing the best team, with players that balance and compliment each other, Barkley in my opinion unbalances the whole team even if I think he has exceptional talent.

Hause also has looked a lot better this season, but he's not better than Mings or Konsa, but no player should be undroppable.

I agree no player should be undroppable but I also don't think Luiz or Mings deserved to be dropped. Mings was suspended and Luiz was rested. 

I think Nakamba should come in for the next game but I also see him as that squad cover type of player.  

[DCJonah]

If we averaged a pt a game for the rest of the season, we'd still more thann likely finish in the top 10. 

Our attacking play has dipped but with our defence I'm convinced we will finish in a strong position.  

Edited February 14, 2021 by DCJonah

[avfc1982am]

I'd like to see him drop Barkley and McGinn and bring Jack into the centre, ghazi and Sanson to come in for a couple of games to, a) freshen the midfield, b) free Jack up, 

[Rightdm00]

42 minutes ago, VillanousOne said:

That seems to be an excuse being peddled out week in week out for who does or doesn't gets picked, I would argue that what the players do during a match is more important than what they do in training or at least 'equally as important'.

That's a fan centric view of the game. We only see the game so for evaluation purposes we put the emphasis there.

I never played for a coach who would watch me loaf in practice and then let me play in the match. Picking poor/lazy trainers for the match day squad would be the quickest way to spoil team chemistry. Something this team has in abundance right now. 

[Indigo]

Are we just saying we were fortunate against Arsenal because it suits a narrative? We scored early and then approached the game pragmatically which worked a treat. We limited them to next to no clear cut chances and if anything looked more likely to score than they did for the remainder of the game, I've not even seen Arsenal fans try to claim otherwise. Pretty objectively good performance if you ask me - especially considering how dangerous Arsenal have looked in each of their games either side of it - and isn't indicative at all of any drop in form we've had.

[Vive_La_Villa]

12 minutes ago, Indigo said:

Are we just saying we were fortunate against Arsenal because it suits a narrative? We scored early and then approached the game pragmatically which worked a treat. We limited them to next to no clear cut chances and if anything looked more likely to score than they did for the remainder of the game, I've not even seen Arsenal fans try to claim otherwise. Pretty objectively good performance if you ask me - especially considering how dangerous Arsenal have looked in each of their games either side of it - and isn't indicative at all of any drop in form we've had.

We played well against Arsenal and deserved the win. We just didn’t keep the ball as well as we can and should. 

[useless]

We can't drop out of the top eight now until next Sunday when Spurs play West Ham, and then if Spurs do get a result, we can still go back above them if we beat Leicester. Only team other than Tottenham that go above us next weekend is Arsenal, but they play Man City.

[Vive_La_Villa]

Leicester play Prague on Thursday. Be interesting to see what team they field in both games 

[VillanousOne]

2 hours ago, Rightdm00 said:

That's a fan centric view of the game. We only see the game so for evaluation purposes we put the emphasis there.

I never played for a coach who would watch me loaf in practice and then let me play in the match. Picking poor/lazy trainers for the match day squad would be the quickest way to spoil team chemistry. Something this team has in abundance right now. 

do you really think any of players are poor or lazy in training?

I just can't see it. Although your argument shoots itself in the foot if players are lazy or poor on the pitch but are fine in training is that ok?

 

[Rightdm00]

7 minutes ago, VillanousOne said:

do you really think any of players are poor or lazy in training?

I just can't see it. Although your argument shoots itself in the foot if players are lazy or poor on the pitch but are fine in training is that ok?

 

Many match performers don't put forth their best efforts forward in training.  Every team has a loafer or two in training.  Dele can't get a game with Spurs right now because he is poor trainer. I'm sure their are others all throughout the league. 

As far as match performance of course it factors into managers selection criteria. It just isn't the end all be all.  Any number of factors including the opponent, fitness, tactics, and probably a few more I'm missing. All of these are worked out on the training pitch. If a player isn't putting forth the requisite effort there then a manager is sending the absolute worst message if he continues to pick that player. 

[VillanousOne]

Just now, Rightdm00 said:

Many match performers don't put forth their best efforts forward in training.  Every team has a loafer or two in training.  Dele can't get a game with Spurs right now because he is poor trainer. I'm sure their are others all throughout the league. 

As far as match performance of course it factors into managers selection criteria. It just isn't the end all be all.  Any number of factors including the opponent, fitness, tactics, and probably a few more I'm missing. All of these are worked out on the training pitch. If a player isn't putting forth the requisite effort there then a manager is sending the absolute worst message if he continues to pick that player. 

yep i agree, as in performances on the pitch are as important as training ground effort. There are a lot of players who look like Messi on the training pitch but like Tonev on the match day pitch.

[HanoiVillan]

14 hours ago, DCJonah said:

Why wouldn't anyone be content with finishing 12th? An improvement on last season and another solid place to build on.

I would be disappointed if we finished 12th to be honest. Here is the middle of the table:

In practice, to finish 12th from here, we would likely need to finish behind one of Wolves (who can't score), Southampton (who have lost their last 5 matches) or Palace (who are on the beach already). I think that would be poor from here. Even 11th wouldn't be great - I kind of feel like we're in a mini-league of West Ham, Everton, Spurs, Arsenal and Leeds, so finishing 11th would suggest finishing bottom of that mini-league.

Of course I'm not going to be too sad about this season no matter what, but we would probably have to lose more than half of our remaining matches to finish 12th, and that's the sort of poor form that could really take a lot of the shine off the early part of the season.

[Tomaszk]

The standards seemingly being expected by some as a minimum are mental. We aren't going to win every game, and no sorry, we aren't going to play well every week either.

Players play badly sometimes. Man City and Liverpool losing one game in a season isn't normal. 10 wins in a row isn't normal. Form is temporary and just because we've seen some bloody good form in the last 26 months under Smith, it doesn't mean you'll get it every game.

We're in a slump. The manager said we were poor and he's right (nice to not have a manager lying to fans like our previous few). Remember now, we have played miles better than Saturday night this season and got 0 points. Swings and roundabouts.

Great points made in previous pages about how many points we've battled to in amongst these poor performances. I think that's an excellent sign of progress that we can earn points when looking very smelly indeed.

Oh, and everyone has had rona and we had 6 games in 18 days. Bet that's not fun.

Be interesting to see what selection decisions are made in the coming weeks.

[Tomaszk]

6 hours ago, Indigo said:

Are we just saying we were fortunate against Arsenal because it suits a narrative? We scored early and then approached the game pragmatically which worked a treat. We limited them to next to no clear cut chances and if anything looked more likely to score than they did for the remainder of the game, I've not even seen Arsenal fans try to claim otherwise. Pretty objectively good performance if you ask me - especially considering how dangerous Arsenal have looked in each of their games either side of it - and isn't indicative at all of any drop in form we've had.

Arsenal were not great against us. An expected three points.

Brighton are really good. A hard earned point we didn't deserve.

Four points from two poor performances. Lovely.

[Kiwivillan]

Does Manure drawing against Baggies, Everton losing to Fulham, Leeds going 4-0 down to Arsenal in 47 mins put things in perspective. Very odd season

[DCJonah]

6 hours ago, HanoiVillan said:

I would be disappointed if we finished 12th to be honest. Here is the middle of the table:

In practice, to finish 12th from here, we would likely need to finish behind one of Wolves (who can't score), Southampton (who have lost their last 5 matches) or Palace (who are on the beach already). I think that would be poor from here. Even 11th wouldn't be great - I kind of feel like we're in a mini-league of West Ham, Everton, Spurs, Arsenal and Leeds, so finishing 11th would suggest finishing bottom of that mini-league.

Of course I'm not going to be too sad about this season no matter what, but we would probably have to lose more than half of our remaining matches to finish 12th, and that's the sort of poor form that could really take a lot of the shine off the early part of the season.

I said previously that if we average a point a game for the rest of the season we should finish top 10. I think we will and like you say it would mean a poor run to drop to 12th. 

But there's no way I wouldn't be content with that if it happens. Still a solid season.  

[DCJonah]

2 hours ago, Kiwivillan said:

Does Manure drawing against Baggies, Everton losing to Fulham, Leeds going 4-0 down to Arsenal in 47 mins put things in perspective. Very odd season

Everton have spent fortunes, have a highly experienced manager and have 1 pt more than us. 

Spurs have spent fortunes, have a highly experienced manager, have played 1 more game than us and still are below us in the league. 

We're having our first spell of below average performances and we're still picking up points and right with these sorts of clubs. 

[romavillan]

The fact that some are saying 12th would be disappointing shows what a great season we're having. 45+ points this season was success, we got 35 last season.

[KenjiOgiwara]

In the big picture 12th would obviously be a great season for us. We almost got relegated last season ffs. 

But considering how excellent we've been this season and how unpredictable the season has been. How we are 8th in the table with 2 matches behind and could potentially end up 4th. I think we would lack ambition saying we wouldn't be hoping to finish top 8 when 22 of 38 matches has been played. We've quite obviously changed our goals mid season, and rightly so. 

Now it's just a matter of avoiding more injuries, suspensions, fatigue and find motivation and energy levels to finish the season how we started. 

[BleedClaretAndBlue]

West Brom have drawn with Chelsea, Man City, Liverpool & Man Utd. Literal proof that anyone can have off-days