Dean Smith

[Reivax_Villa]

My predictions is that Smith will be gone by next weekend.

Suso should be gone already but I’m assuming that we are looking for a replacement before sacking him.

[TRO]

18 minutes ago, A'Villan said:

Apologies hippo, you've made an engaging and thoughtful reply but it's my bedtime so I'm going to be brief.

Excellent questions, questions that have to be asked, and again, unfortunately, I don't have much in the way of reassurances regarding our future from here under Smith.

Let us also ask this, If we beat Crystal Palace and West Ham, hell, throw in a draw against one of Everton or Arsenal, and survive, ultimately, is it complete and utter failure?

Or is it that we have faced disappointment for so long that we have let our predictions become assumptions and the emotions that accompany influence our perspective.

I have read a snippet from Petrov's commentary as posted above, seems like he's campaigning for some leadership! Great! We bloody well need it.

However I also felt whilst reading his thoughts that it's easy to focus on the flaws of others and perhaps lack awareness of our own while doing so.

I think what Petrov had to say was great in some respects, truly, because for the first 25 minutes, we were asking questions of United's defense. After the penalty, disappointing.

Had we shown a bit more resolve and dug deep, then we might've got something out of the game. At the end of the day though, Petrov is just airing his feelings.

It's also true and fair to acknowledge that goals change games, and our initial spark was deflated, United suddenly hold the cards through no real skill or effort on their behalf.

For me personally though, going over the loss to United like people are inadequate not only in a playing sense but a leadership sense is more Petrov blowing his own horn than helping.

sorry for interjecting ........

we all have to remind ourselves....its all about opinons.

You make a claim that Petrov's campaigning for Leadership is something that appeals to you, then you say stay with Smith.....its a mixed message for me.

Petrov is just airing his feelings like us all....but he was in the industry, so has an insight to right or wrong.

We don't have to imitate the person who we speak to champion/criticise their qualities........I loved Wyatt Earp, but couldn't be like him........I couldn't do Deans Job, for the very reasons that i share some of his qualities, I too am too easy going and don't drive folk enough, despite me knowing I should, its not in me....I don't think its in Dean.

Goals do change games, and like punches in boxing it deflats the opponents belief......but we have done this all season ,failed to capitalise on the advantage and failed to secure the initiative....in my humble opinion it is due in the main to our poor approach to physicality, where we much prefer to stand off an opponent as opposed to get close and irritate and disrupt.....this allows the opponent to steal the initiative and the consequences therewith.

personally, I think Petrov is helping, he just wants what we all want a team to be proud of, no matter how small the success.

The future........We need a more hard nosed approach to our football is my view...thats playing and recruitment.

[nick76]

4 minutes ago, Reivax_Villa said:

My predictions is that Smith will be gone by next weekend.

Suso should be gone already but I’m assuming that we are looking for a replacement before sacking him.

They aren’t going to sack the manager with two games to go and one week left.  Nothing is happening now before the end of the season if anything at all.

[Vive_La_Villa]

Still a lot of posts on here. Surely most agree he has to go? He did his best but this jobs too big for him. We need a change.  Sack them all!!

[TRO]

33 minutes ago, Johnnyp said:

I agree with this. We won't be able to get shot of much of this bunch so the solution is a better manager, it's that simple. Successful businesses make ruthless decisions every day of the week. Sack Dean Smith. I'd air on the side of caution though when you go after a manager who's sales pitch to his potential employers is " I'll give you attacking football " Well, are you gonna give me winning football would be my reply. I keep harping back to Hassenhutl. Are they exciting, end to end, have you off your seat team ? No. Are they very well coached, honest of effort, extremely well prepped going into a game and tactically better month on month ? Yes. Are they boring to watch ? Absolutely not. That's what id want.

Its rare that winning football is not exciting....and even if it starts out not the ideal spectacle it usually morphs in to exciting.

I haven't seen a post from one soul that alludes to parking the bus as the answer to our woes....and I am certainly opposed to that.

having said that, I used to be marvelled at watching Paul McGrath and Laursen, Ugo etc Jimmer Rimmer and Mark Bosnich was great to watch.....even Shaun Teale and he wasn't technically gifted....its all part of the overall game.

Edited July 10, 2020 by TRO

[A'Villan]

9 minutes ago, TRO said:

sorry for interjecting ........

we all have to remind ourselves....its all about opinons.

You make a claim that Petrov's campaigning for Leadership is something that appeals to you, then you say stay with Smith.....its a mixed message for me.

Petrov is just airing his feelings like us all....but he was in the industry, so has an insight to right or wrong.

We don't have to imitate the person who we speak to champion/criticise their qualities........I loved Wyatt Earp, but couldn't be like him........I couldn't do Deans Job, for the very reasons that i share some of his qualities, I too am too easy going and don't drive folk enough, despite me knowing I should, its not in me....I don't think its in Dean.

Goals do change games, and like punches in boxing it deflats the opponents belief......but we have done this all season ,failed to capitalise on the advantage and failed to secure the initiative....in my humble opinion it is due in the main to our poor approach to physicality, where we much prefer to stand off an opponent as opposed to get close and irritate and disrupt.....this allows the opponent to steal the initiative and the consequences therewith.

personally, I think Petrov is helping, he just wants what we all want a team to be proud of, no matter how small the success.

The future........We need a more hard nosed approach to our football is my view...thats playing and recruitment.

Please do TRO your input is always welcome from where I sit.

I remember in a season where Petrov was captain in the latter stages of the season we lost 1-3 to who else but Manchester United, and the loss put us in 16th position.

We had Ashley Young, Darren Bent, Stewart Downing, Marc Albrighton, NRC, Petrov, a solid back four and both Friedel and Guzan as understudy. Good squad.

Does captain Petrov need and appreciate a sermon on the lack of leadership from an arm chair pundit at that time? I honestly don't know.

Sorry mate, well and truly passed my bedtime, may be continued in the morning. Cheers.

[Sulberto21]

We got promoted too early. If that's the case we should have just forfeited the tie against West Bromwich. I've heard some absolute diamonds in my time but that's the best. 

[Stevo985]

2 hours ago, tom_avfc said:

I think the point about transfers is completely fair. Nobody has any idea as to how much involvement in any transfer dealings that he has but you'd like to think that he's at least consulted before we buy somebody.

With regards to the squad - I think they are exactly as shit as they look now. We set up OK with a decent plan and have generally looked pretty good for the first 20 minutes or so of games. We then concede (normally to poor individual mistakes but yesterday to a terrible decision) and completely lose it.

We don't really look like scoring and we have mistake after mistake in us. We've won seven games this season and I'd argue that more than one or two of those were pretty lucky undeserved victories. We looked better when we didn't have so many injuries at the start of the season. With each injury we have sustained we've in turn had to play Nyland, Davis, Hause and Taylor, none of whom were considered good enough to be first team regulars in the Championship.

We have one genuine quality player who since lockdown has been nowhere near as effective as pre-lockdown for whatever reason.

Our subs bench consists of players who weren't particularly good in the Championship and we have nobody who can make any impact when coming on (barring Elmo's goal against Newcastle).

I genuinely think its impossible to argue that we are not within the three worst squads in the league. We've looked OK since lockdown without ever really looking like scoring goals (I don't think we carry any real goal threat in the squad to be fair) and with silly mistakes thrown in as usual. We look on a par with Watford, West Ham and Bournemouth since the restart but their much better individual players will lead them to pick up more points from similar performances.

Then why did this squad look ten times netter earlier in the season?

 

And I don't agree that we've looked ok since the restart, I think we've been as bad as we've been all season. Certainly our attack has been the worst it's been since probably the Lambert era.

[Zatman]

5 minutes ago, Sulberto21 said:

We got promoted too early. If that's the case we should have just forfeited the tie against West Bromwich. I've heard some absolute diamonds in my time but that's the best. 

Its partially true. We didn't make the playoffs positions until April when teams have already drawn up a shortlist for summer and transfers done behind the scenes. Jota and Guilbert transfer for example were made for the Championship 

We pretty much had to go for rejects and punts

[DCJonah]

52 minutes ago, Mantis said:

So I have an anti-Smith "agenda" now because I point out how poor we were last season when Grealish was out injured?

I was talking about that period from around November/December to March, where Grealish was out with a long-term injury.

Yes clearly. You said you don't buy he's a good championship manager. Well Brentford fans rated him and he got us promoted with a record breaking winning streak. To dismiss his years in the championship shows your agenda. Its ridiculous. 

[Sulberto21]

1 minute ago, Zatman said:

Its partially true. We didn't make the playoffs positions until April when teams have already drawn up a shortlist for summer and transfers done behind the scenes. Jota and Guilbert transfer for example were made for the Championship 

We pretty much had to go for rejects and punts

With all due respect what was the target at the beginning of last season? I'm pretty sure it was Promotion. Regardless of how we got there it was Promotion. 

[TRO]

2 minutes ago, Sulberto21 said:

We got promoted too early. If that's the case we should have just forfeited the tie against West Bromwich. I've heard some absolute diamonds in my time but that's the best. 

There is some pearlers coming out.....I guess we have more to come, over the next 4 games.

The thing is....I have had reservations about Dean for most of the season, but when he was appointed, like all our new managers, I was behind him and looked to see what he could do.

The championship 3/4 of a season was mixed, but that great run was something, but my doubts started away at Leeds, they showed the more durable outfit and despite the poor nature displayed by Leeds, I thought the gift of the goal was a bit needy, I would have declined and raised the spirit of the team to right the wrong.....I was also in doubt at the Albion where the heroics of Steer and Tammy won the day, but their physicality got them back in the game.....Had Leeds beat Derby, I think we would have struggled at Wembley, but of course just my opinion.

We didn't get promoted too early.....we simply bought the wrong players. There are Oodles of reasons why that might be......but we did.

 

[Zatman]

2 minutes ago, Sulberto21 said:

With all due respect what was the target at the beginning of last season? I'm pretty sure it was Promotion. Regardless of how we got there it was Promotion. 

We were 12th in February and Purslow said on Smith unveiling in October that promotion next season was the target

If we strolled to promotion like Wolves did I guarantee we wouldn't have signed players like Trezeguet, Jota etc. 

[TRO]

7 minutes ago, Zatman said:

Its partially true. We didn't make the playoffs positions until April when teams have already drawn up a shortlist for summer and transfers done behind the scenes. Jota and Guilbert transfer for example were made for the Championship 

We pretty much had to go for rejects and punts

what £140 mill worth.

Edited July 10, 2020 by TRO

[DCJonah]

26 minutes ago, Stevo985 said:

Then why did this squad look ten times netter earlier in the season?

 

And I don't agree that we've looked ok since the restart, I think we've been as bad as we've been all season. Certainly our attack has been the worst it's been since probably the Lambert era.

I think part of the reason we looked better is we had everyone fit and still had the positivity and confidence from promotion. 

I think a lot of teams playing with 3rd choice keepers and back up attackers would start to look a lot worse. Losing a midfield player like mcginn when back up options are atrocious is also going to have a knock on effect. 

I don't think we were so good earlier on in the season that it looked like everything would be OK. 

We seem to ignore the poor games we had at the start. The Bournemouth game was terrible. The draw with 10 man west ham was poor, the loss to Palace was awful, the defeats at home to Southampton and away to Watford were dreadful. The win at Everton was good but we relied on Walcott missing a sitter to survive the pressure they were putting us under. Mcginn and Wesley played big parts against arsenal and Norwich. 

We had some moments but now injuries and confidence are rock bottom its easy to see why those moments have disappeared. 

Another massive reason for a difference is the form of our best player. 

Edited July 10, 2020 by DCJonah

[DCJonah]

2 hours ago, tom_avfc said:

I think the point about transfers is completely fair. Nobody has any idea as to how much involvement in any transfer dealings that he has but you'd like to think that he's at least consulted before we buy somebody.

With regards to the squad - I think they are exactly as shit as they look now. We set up OK with a decent plan and have generally looked pretty good for the first 20 minutes or so of games. We then concede (normally to poor individual mistakes but yesterday to a terrible decision) and completely lose it.

We don't really look like scoring and we have mistake after mistake in us. We've won seven games this season and I'd argue that more than one or two of those were pretty lucky undeserved victories. We looked better when we didn't have so many injuries at the start of the season. With each injury we have sustained we've in turn had to play Nyland, Davis, Hause and Taylor, none of whom were considered good enough to be first team regulars in the Championship.

We have one genuine quality player who since lockdown has been nowhere near as effective as pre-lockdown for whatever reason.

Our subs bench consists of players who weren't particularly good in the Championship and we have nobody who can make any impact when coming on (barring Elmo's goal against Newcastle).

I genuinely think its impossible to argue that we are not within the three worst squads in the league. We've looked OK since lockdown without ever really looking like scoring goals (I don't think we carry any real goal threat in the squad to be fair) and with silly mistakes thrown in as usual. We look on a par with Watford, West Ham and Bournemouth since the restart but their much better individual players will lead them to pick up more points from similar performances.

Absolutely. I'm yet to see anyone highly critical of Smith be able to really dispute this. 

[Zatman]

7 minutes ago, TRO said:

what £140 mill worth.

for 12 players yes because the previous manager build an unbalanced squad. If that manager build a proper squad we wouldnt have needed so much surgery

[Johnnyp]

33 minutes ago, TRO said:

Its rare that winning football is not exciting....and even if it starts out not the ideal spectacle it usually morphs in to exciting.

I haven't seen a post from one soul that alludes to parking the bus as the answer to our woes....and I am certainly opposed to that.

having said that, I used to be marvelled at watching Paul McGrath and Laursen, Ugo etc Jimmer Rimmer and Mark Bosnich was great to watch.....even Shaun Teale and he wasn't technically gifted....its all part of the overall game.

I remember when Euro 2000 was on. I was 16 at the time. QF Holland V Italy. I distinctly remember my summary of the game was roughly " holland battered them, Italy got lucky " Watched it again recently and whilst Holland were wasteful at times it had to be one of the best defensive displays ive ever seen that started with Albertini in midfield. They're awareness of where they are, shape. Italians attack the ball also, love it. My younger self had no appreciation of this.

[Mantis]

19 minutes ago, DCJonah said:

Yes clearly. You said you don't buy he's a good championship manager. Well Brentford fans rated him and he got us promoted with a record breaking winning streak. To dismiss his years in the championship shows your agenda. Its ridiculous. 

And what agenda is this? Just because I disagree with you on him doesn't mean I have some sort of rabid anti-Smith agenda. Do you realise how ridiculous that sounds?

[danceoftheshamen]

For me we spent 140m replacing older players who's legs would not be up to Premier League levels any more (Whelan, Hutton, Jedinak, Adomah) with bang average unproven and worse players. Then we lost two of our best players from the promotion push, Tuanzebe who was a rock in our defence with Mings & Hutton & crucially Abraham. Our leading scorer was replaced by Wesley...enough said! No wonder we have struggled really as i can't actually see a single player there who has come in and been better than the one they replaced aside from maybe Heaton who we lost months ago! No surprise our disgusting run started when he got injured.