tonyh29 Posted March 1, 2018 Share Posted March 1, 2018 21 minutes ago, Vive_La_Villa said: How do you fight? Vandalise a statue of Winston Churchill , smash up McDonalds then go home to mum and dad and ask if your allowance can be increased 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Stevo985 Posted March 1, 2018 VT Supporter Popular Post Share Posted March 1, 2018 44 minutes ago, Vive_La_Villa said: It was quite relevant to me trying to understand to what extent some of you are upset by Brexit. Clearly very upset. So not sure why you had to add that line in there. Because the implication is that if we really thought things were that bad then we’d leave. It’s quite a common line from pro-brexit people when they try to pretend that people don’t actually think things will be bad, they just like an argument. I dont think Brexit is going to be so bad that the country will fall to pieces and everyone will be forced to flee Britain. I do think it will effect us negatively and take us years to fully recover. 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chindie Posted March 1, 2018 VT Supporter Share Posted March 1, 2018 11 minutes ago, Stevo985 said: Because the implication is that if we really thought things were that bad then we’d leave. It’s quite a common line from pro-brexit people when they try to pretend that people don’t actually think things will be bad, they just like an argument. I dont think Brexit is going to be so bad that the country will fall to pieces and everyone will be forced to flee Britain. I do think it will effect us negatively and take us years to fully recover. Exactly this. The question is inevitably a gotcha. And whilst no Brexit isn't go to have us turn into a Wasteland (as much as Davis would love to be Immortan Joe) it is going to negatively effect the UK. The economic impact is likely to be significant (hence why pretty much every report by those watching on shows it to be some degree of crap, with no deal into lunacy stakes) and that is going to make life worse. And it will take years to recover. And bearing in mind whilst we recover everyone else is marching on... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vive_La_Villa Posted March 1, 2018 Share Posted March 1, 2018 21 minutes ago, Chindie said: The question is inevitably a gotcha. Listen if you don't like us leaving Europe then you should get out! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chindie Posted March 1, 2018 VT Supporter Share Posted March 1, 2018 I'm looking forward to the schadenfreude too much for that. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vive_La_Villa Posted March 1, 2018 Share Posted March 1, 2018 28 minutes ago, Chindie said: I'm looking forward to the schadenfreude too much for that. The majority of people that will feel the negative affects from Brexit (if at all) didn't have it so good before the vote anyway. In my opinion of course. Only time will tell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chindie Posted March 1, 2018 VT Supporter Share Posted March 1, 2018 I think some recent investigation actually showed that Brexit was won by the fairly well of - older white middle classes. Obviously that's a generalisation. My ward was known at school as a white ghetto and had one of the highest rates of Leave votes in the country. And you could tell queuing for the ballot box. They'll all get hurt, but the ones that seemingly saying swung it will sadly be hurt the least. Still I can hope it hurts their pensions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NurembergVillan Posted March 1, 2018 Moderator Share Posted March 1, 2018 5 hours ago, Vive_La_Villa said: Remain was very much stay in and nothing changes like everybody should be happy about that. The problem with that is many people were not happy with how things were for them and wanted change. That's what a general election is for. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chindie Posted March 1, 2018 VT Supporter Share Posted March 1, 2018 General elections are for voting for the same old party you always have, or for having your vote matter less than what I think of anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
a m ole Posted March 1, 2018 Share Posted March 1, 2018 Question Time - “what we need is a strong leader” Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chindie Posted March 1, 2018 VT Supporter Share Posted March 1, 2018 Question Time is a farmer's market that only sells gammon, ignorance and right on nonsense. The next time I watch it will be the time I know I want to die. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chindie Posted March 1, 2018 VT Supporter Share Posted March 1, 2018 Anyone looking forward to Let Me Be Clear's speech tomorrow? It's going to be a car crash of waffle of nonsense isn't it? Apparently she's laying out 5 tests for Brexit. I'm sure Barnier will listen with amusement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ml1dch Posted March 2, 2018 Share Posted March 2, 2018 7 hours ago, Chindie said: Anyone looking forward to Let Me Be Clear's speech tomorrow? It's going to be a car crash of waffle of nonsense isn't it? Apparently she's laying out 5 tests for Brexit. I'm sure Barnier will listen with amusement. That any deal must respect the referendum result That any deal must not break down That any deal must protect jobs and security That any deal must be "consistent with the kind of country we want to be" - modern, outward-looking and tolerant That any agreement must bring the country together There's that detail and clarity we've been looking for. What an embarrassment. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amsterdam_Neil_D Posted March 2, 2018 Share Posted March 2, 2018 8 hours ago, Chindie said: Let Me Be Clear's speech tomorrow? Hahaha Good one. There is a Spec Savers advert in here somewhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magnkarl Posted March 2, 2018 Share Posted March 2, 2018 I'm currently at a work assignment in Norway and it seems like the big thing in the news over here is the debate on whether or not Norway should join ACER (agency for the cooperation of energy regulators). The debates are around what the future development of ACER will lead to as Norway is afraid that EU wants to take their energy surplus to a point where they cannot supply their own industry with their own green energy. I'd be interested in knowing how them joining ACER or not would affect our (I think it's at around 32%) gas and energy delivery from Norway. From reading the subtitles during a debate between the 4 biggest parties yesterday there seems to be an awful lot of skepticism on whether it's a good idea. A lot of the leftish parties argued that the last time Norway agreed to something as big as this from the EU it ruined the work market as they adopted the Temporary Agency Work Directive. The amount of part time "loose labour" went drastically up and companies now use a very high margin of contract based workers as opposed to hiring them full time. Whereas I thought that in general the EU directives are there to help hold back companies exploiting workers it seems that it's done the absolute opposite in Norway. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fightoffyour Posted March 2, 2018 VT Supporter Share Posted March 2, 2018 1 hour ago, magnkarl said: I'm currently at a work assignment in Norway and it seems like the big thing in the news over here is the debate on whether or not Norway should join ACER (agency for the cooperation of energy regulators). The debates are around what the future development of ACER will lead to as Norway is afraid that EU wants to take their energy surplus to a point where they cannot supply their own industry with their own green energy. I'd be interested in knowing how them joining ACER or not would affect our (I think it's at around 32%) gas and energy delivery from Norway. From reading the subtitles during a debate between the 4 biggest parties yesterday there seems to be an awful lot of skepticism on whether it's a good idea. A lot of the leftish parties argued that the last time Norway agreed to something as big as this from the EU it ruined the work market as they adopted the Temporary Agency Work Directive. The amount of part time "loose labour" went drastically up and companies now use a very high margin of contract based workers as opposed to hiring them full time. Whereas I thought that in general the EU directives are there to help hold back companies exploiting workers it seems that it's done the absolute opposite in Norway. They should just agree to it, then analyse the pros and cons afterwards and it if it seems like a bad idea, just persist with it anyway. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowychap Posted March 2, 2018 Share Posted March 2, 2018 (edited) 1 hour ago, magnkarl said: I'm currently at a work assignment in Norway and it seems like the big thing in the news over here is the debate on whether or not Norway should join ACER (agency for the cooperation of energy regulators). The debates are around what the future development of ACER will lead to as Norway is afraid that EU wants to take their energy surplus to a point where they cannot supply their own industry with their own green energy. I'd be interested in knowing how them joining ACER or not would affect our (I think it's at around 32%) gas and energy delivery from Norway. From reading the subtitles during a debate between the 4 biggest parties yesterday there seems to be an awful lot of skepticism on whether it's a good idea. A lot of the leftish parties argued that the last time Norway agreed to something as big as this from the EU it ruined the work market as they adopted the Temporary Agency Work Directive. The amount of part time "loose labour" went drastically up and companies now use a very high margin of contract based workers as opposed to hiring them full time. Whereas I thought that in general the EU directives are there to help hold back companies exploiting workers it seems that it's done the absolute opposite in Norway. Has it ruined their labour market? What percentage of workers in Norway are temporary workers, how does that compare to before the adoption of the TAWD and how much of that increase is down to that adoption, i.e. what is this 'drastically up' and what is responsible for it? Is a potential counterfactual that there would have been a certain amount of increase in temporary workers anyway (as this appears to be a relatively universal phenomenon) and any such increase has been ascribed fully to an EU directive by skeptics looking for any evidence to confirm that skepticism? As far as I'm aware, the principle at the heart of the TAWD is equal treatment. It would imply, therefore, that the adoption of this directive is to be of benefit to temporary agency workers. Now this might mean that it lowers the benefits and terms for non temporary agency workers or that prospective workers feel that they are happier to be temporary agency workers as they have some sort of a guarantee of equal treatment (and therefore not exploitation) or that, in some cases, people have been forced in to inappropriate and fictitious subcontracting (though one thing I just read suggests that there isn't evidence of this). All of which doesn't mean that it can't have had a negative effect upon the Noregian labour market (or any other labour market that has adopted the directive - I think a few people on here know much more about these kinds of things than most of us like @TrentVilla perhaps?) but I'd take a debate about a topic amongst politicians on the TV as not the best starting point for a debate about the facts of any situation. As for the ACER, I don't know enough about its workings to give any comprehensive answer but given that its aims are as underneath, I don't know by what mechanism the Norwegian politicians would believe that joining this agency would interfere with their own domestic gas supply arrangements: Quote A more competitive, integrated market which offers consumers more choice; An efficient energy infrastructure guaranteeing the free movement of energy across borders and the transportation of new energy sources, thus enhancing security of supply for EU businesses and consumers; A monitored and transparent energy market guaranteeing consumers fair, cost-reflective prices and the deterrence of abusive practices I'd like to see some serious analysis on how and why joining the ACER would negatively affect gas supplies to the UK from Norway. The analysis could also include any potential negatives to UK gas supply if when we leave the ACER ourselves after Brexit. More importantly, what will the UK's access to the IEM (internal energy market) be after Brexit? Edited March 2, 2018 by snowychap Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markavfc40 Posted March 2, 2018 Share Posted March 2, 2018 11 hours ago, Chindie said: Apparently she's laying out 5 tests for Brexit. 1. Does it mean I am still PM 2. Does it keep the anti EU rabid loony tunes in the Tory party in line 3. Does it mean I am still PM 4. Does it keep the right wing rags on side 5. Does it mean I am still PM 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
a m ole Posted March 2, 2018 Share Posted March 2, 2018 4 hours ago, Amsterdam_Neil_D said: Hahaha Good one. There is a Spec Savers advert in here somewhere. She asks it as though someone’s not letting her. It would be nice if she followed through with the request. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowychap Posted March 2, 2018 Share Posted March 2, 2018 (edited) 14 hours ago, Chindie said: Anyone looking forward to Let Me Be Clear's speech tomorrow? I made it to about 30 seconds, i.e. the first line of the 'pledge' that she made in a previous speech. Isn't quoting from a previous piece of homework in the new piece of homework what one does when one needs to pad it out because one has nothing better/new to say? Didn't she spend half her time in the Florence speech referring to her Lancaster house one? Edited March 2, 2018 by snowychap 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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