sharkyvilla Posted February 18, 2016 Share Posted February 18, 2016 1 hour ago, a m ole said: I'm personally trying to separate what I see as an impossible task on the pitch with the other indicators of a good manager - what he says about matches, his players, how he disciplines them and rewards or punishes performance, press conferences, temper... I don't know, everything else I see I am impressed with and I understand that it doesn't mean it will translate into results if he was allowed to sign a couple of players. I think it's been so long since we had someone with the right attitude off the pitch I think it would be such a shame to not give him the chance in the longer term when allowed to assemble a bit more of a squad. I can understand the line of thought that if he won't get a bit of backing we may as well get a turd-polishing manager instead, but they're just two awful situations I don't even want to contemplate. That's where I sit as well, but added to the fact that I feel since Cissokho came back, up until Sunday Remi had managed to produce a back 5 that was working despite some pretty ropey players being in it. 8 goals in 8 games, half of which were against City. Of course I'm picking and choosing sample sizes but it's enough for me to make my mind up along with those things you mention that Remi is crucial if this club isn't going to keep falling to some even more desperate places. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marka Ragnos Posted February 18, 2016 VT Supporter Share Posted February 18, 2016 4 hours ago, sharkyvilla said: I think certain posters like to post something designed exactly to start the arguments all over again. Losing matches helps as it kind of legitimises it. No, no, no. The problem is people resisting the fact that Sherwood was the greatest manager this club has ever had ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HanoiVillan Posted February 18, 2016 Share Posted February 18, 2016 2 hours ago, a m ole said: I'm personally trying to separate what I see as an impossible task on the pitch with the other indicators of a good manager - what he says about matches, his players, how he disciplines them and rewards or punishes performance, press conferences, temper... I don't know, everything else I see I am impressed with and I understand that it doesn't mean it will translate into results if he was allowed to sign a couple of players. I think it's been so long since we had someone with the right attitude off the pitch I think it would be such a shame to not give him the chance in the longer term when allowed to assemble a bit more of a squad. I can understand the line of thought that if he won't get a bit of backing we may as well get a turd-polishing manager instead, but they're just two awful situations I don't even want to contemplate. About where I am too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HanoiVillan Posted February 18, 2016 Share Posted February 18, 2016 30 minutes ago, Marka Ragnos said: No, no, no. The problem is people resisting the fact that Sherwood was the greatest manager this club has ever had ... 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dn1982 Posted February 18, 2016 Share Posted February 18, 2016 2 hours ago, AntrimBlack said: There are facts, and there are opinions, and both of those are valid. Repeating something that has no basis in fact can easily lead people to believe it, unless it is challenged. Sticking in `apparently' means nothing So we can't discuss anything then unless we have quotes from the horses mouth?? Fact is Garde wanted Debuchy as I explained so what happened? And there's quotes to that affect. Are we only allowed to believe reports we like? A national paper reported it so that's why I put apparently. You've challenged it without nothing to prove the article wrong. I'm challenging your post of view because as you say people may believe it unless challenge. It's interesting out of a whole post you're more interested in the fact there's no quotes and 100% proof when there's enough evidence the transfer committee didn't do its job!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post bobzy Posted February 19, 2016 Popular Post Share Posted February 19, 2016 13 hours ago, DCJonah said: And this is why I don't understand why anyone has full faith in him or why anyone has decided he's no good for us. He's got such a limited managerial career so far and he's come into such a unique scenario that it's difficult to judge either way how he will go. I can't think of many managers who have come into a situation as bad as ours and joined a club as bad as ours. He doesn't get a free pass because of this but then to be fair to him it's a difficult place for him to show many positive things. I think there's a fairly huge difference between having faith in the unknown and thinking the manager is a good manager. If you're thinking of the confliction between people saying he is good and others saying he is bad, then I completely agree with you - I can't see how anyone can have made up their mind this quickly (FWIW, my personal standpoint is that he will be a good manager. Whether that's for us or not, who knows). However, I think it's much easier to have faith in Garde - mainly for the reasons I mentioned before. I like that he comes across articulate and answers questions honestly. I like that he's dropped underperforming players. I like that he's semi-targetted the board in interviews. I like that he has a plan on the pitch. I like that he's quite obviously up for a challenge (why would he have taken the job otherwise?!). Therefore, for me, it's really easy to have faith in the guy. I hope he comes good for us but, moreso, I hope we don't give up on him as easily as some people seem to want. 8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AntrimBlack Posted February 19, 2016 Share Posted February 19, 2016 10 hours ago, dn1982 said: So we can't discuss anything then unless we have quotes from the horses mouth?? Fact is Garde wanted Debuchy as I explained so what happened? And there's quotes to that affect. Are we only allowed to believe reports we like? A national paper reported it so that's why I put apparently. You've challenged it without nothing to prove the article wrong. I'm challenging your post of view because as you say people may believe it unless challenge. It's interesting out of a whole post you're more interested in the fact there's no quotes and 100% proof when there's enough evidence the transfer committee didn't do its job!!! We have discussions on VT all the time based on opinions. You were putting forward a newspaper article not substantiated by any quotes. My problem is that quite often on VT a post of that sort a couple of pages later becomes a fact unless challenged. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCJonah Posted February 19, 2016 Share Posted February 19, 2016 1 hour ago, bobzy said: I think there's a fairly huge difference between having faith in the unknown and thinking the manager is a good manager. If you're thinking of the confliction between people saying he is good and others saying he is bad, then I completely agree with you - I can't see how anyone can have made up their mind this quickly (FWIW, my personal standpoint is that he will be a good manager. Whether that's for us or not, who knows). However, I think it's much easier to have faith in Garde - mainly for the reasons I mentioned before. I like that he comes across articulate and answers questions honestly. I like that he's dropped underperforming players. I like that he's semi-targetted the board in interviews. I like that he has a plan on the pitch. I like that he's quite obviously up for a challenge (why would he have taken the job otherwise?!). Therefore, for me, it's really easy to have faith in the guy. I hope he comes good for us but, moreso, I hope we don't give up on him as easily as some people seem to want. Fair enough, I guess different people will put their faith in different aspects that they see. While I like all the things you've mentioned for me they don't give me faith that he's the right man for the future, well not just yet. I've seen some things that do give me faith, I like the fight and desire we've shown at times. I like how on the whole we've become slightly harder to beat and usually I agree with a lot of his selections. But I've also seen things that don't give me faith for the future, I think he's been too negative at times. I think he's been reluctant to use attacking subs, some selections have been a bit crazy and he's failed to make a real positive impact at the moment. We all hope he's the right man, we need it because shit managers working for the worst owner in the league is damaging the club year after year. I hope come the summer he's shown even more that we should have faith in him to rebuild this team. But the jury is still out, especially after that last defeat. Be interesting to see his next selection and the attitude and performance he gets in response from that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted February 19, 2016 Share Posted February 19, 2016 (edited) On 2/18/2016 at 10:02, markavfc40 said: I think only Swindon and Wolves have done that. Others have eventually dropped again but not back to back relegations. Mark, Didn't Northampton drop through all the divisions and come back up through all four, many moons ago .....think the manager was ex Man U player memory is going. think it was Dave Bowen Edited February 19, 2016 by TRO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
briny_ear Posted February 20, 2016 Share Posted February 20, 2016 1 hour ago, TRO said: Mark, Didn't Northampton drop through all the divisions and come back up through all four, many moons ago .....think the manager was ex Man U player memory is going. think it was Dave Bowen Yes, they went from 4th Division to 1st in 5 seasons. Spent the 1965/6 season in the 1st Division, then sank back to 4th in 5 seasons. Yes, it was Dave Bowen who marched them up and then down again. I think they sacked him on the way from 2nd to 3rd. You forget to mention that, while in the 1st Division, they managed the double against only one club, 2-1 in each tie. Guess who? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mykeyb Posted February 20, 2016 Share Posted February 20, 2016 Is everyone happy for Garde to continue till the end of the season if he then going to resign 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KHV Posted February 20, 2016 Share Posted February 20, 2016 15 minutes ago, mykeyb said: Is everyone happy for Garde to continue till the end of the season if he then going to resign Even though I don't think he is very good, I'm not bothered if he continues or not to be honest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tinker Posted February 20, 2016 VT Supporter Share Posted February 20, 2016 Not getting Garde's first choice coaches in after he had signed for us let him down. He was on his back foot straight away. He then had to interview a coach who had been selected for him by the football committee we now have, it all adds up to pretty poor situation for Remi from the start . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post OutByEaster? Posted February 20, 2016 Moderator Popular Post Share Posted February 20, 2016 At some point in the future, I'd like us to have a manager I don't feel a little bit sorry for. 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dodgyknees Posted February 20, 2016 Share Posted February 20, 2016 10 minutes ago, OutByEaster? said: At some point in the future, I'd like us to have a manager I don't feel a little bit sorry for. We will need a new chairman then! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jareth Posted February 20, 2016 Share Posted February 20, 2016 The end is nigh. Which is good because it means we can get started again. The more I think about it, having heard that players are laughing and joking after games (from that bird who got sacked) the more I want an authoritarian thug to come in, get us playing direct football and get us back in the prem. Then when we return to the prem, sack the thug, employ Remi again and give him some money to make us good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
briny_ear Posted February 20, 2016 Share Posted February 20, 2016 Let's face it, Rémi hasn't been up to much as a manager so far, but his main asset is that he seems determined to stay. Not sure many managers worth their salt would be willing to take us on in our current state. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dodgyknees Posted February 20, 2016 Share Posted February 20, 2016 3 minutes ago, Jareth said: The end is nigh. Which is good because it means we can get started again. The more I think about it, having heard that players are laughing and joking after games (from that bird who got sacked) the more I want an authoritarian thug to come in, get us playing direct football and get us back in the prem. Then when we return to the prem, sack the thug, employ Remi again and give him some money to make us good. I don't think we've hit rock bottom yet. I don't think those in charge know how to stop the drop. They might think that relegation means rebuilding, but they badly underestimate that league. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jareth Posted February 20, 2016 Share Posted February 20, 2016 Just now, DK82 said: I don't think we've hit rock bottom yet. I don't think those in charge know how to stop the drop. They might think that relegation means rebuilding, but they badly underestimate that league. No, I have no faith in them either. But, should next Jan things look fishy, Hollis will be more comfortable shelling out 1 or 2 mill per new player. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foreveryoung Posted February 20, 2016 Share Posted February 20, 2016 Wake up. With proof from the Liverpool game. Its not the manager. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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