AndyM3000 Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 A player who didn't want to be a Villa-player in the first place is killing 6 or 12 month at VP. Not ideal, imho and not the sort of player, we should be pursuing. IMHO. I wouldn't mind if he came and signed a 4 year contract for 8m but he clearly didn't want to do that. He was holding out for better offers and in the end accepted coming here for a season on loan when he doesn't really want to or else he would have signed when we bid 8m. I presume we are paying Utd £2m for the season or something like that with another few million at the end with first option to buy. Cleverley will reject any contract we put in front of him as it won't be anywhere near what he wants and because he can walk away from our deal, walk away from Man Utd and go and sign at Spurs/Newcastle/QPR or whoever will offer him 80k+ because there will not be a transfer fee involved for them. I don't mind him but I don't like the situation that has come from it all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CVByrne Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 The 25-year-old England international, unwanted by new United boss Louis van Gaal, clinched the deal with just moments to spare of the transfer window after a day of confusion almost saw the midfielder sign for Everton. Sky sources understand Villa had a permanent deal set up for Cleverley to sign after he spent most of September 1 at the club's Bodymoor Heath training ground. But a late move from Everton caused Cleverley to travel to Merseyside, only for that potentially permanent deal to fall through because Manchester United's representatives were too busy with other late deals. Sky Sports believes the club were busy securing Radamel Falcao's loan move to Old Trafford from Monaco and Danny Welbeck's £16million transfer to Arsenal, as well as additional outgoings, to deal with Cleverley appropriately. However, Villa remained confident of landing Cleverley after outlining to the Premier League that they had reached an agreement long before the last moments of the deadline and submitted the document before the window closed at 11pm. http://www.football365.com/manchester-united/9453183/Transfer-News-Tom-Cleverley-joins-Aston-Villa-on-season-long-loan-from-Manchester-United Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oaks Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 I think one thing's for sure now. Joe Cole is not going to get a kick this season. I thought that when we signed him. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rodders Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 I really think it's a no lose situation for us really. Regardless of the situation of him coming down here, we have an extra player who wants to reignite his career, he either jots off back to United after helping us, fails, and jots off with minimal damage to us, or signs on after realising it ain't all bad after all and we have a good player. It's a rare instance where I do believe the loan is the better outcome for us all. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
westholmevillan Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 Welcome to VP Tom! Show us what you can do.....and sack your feckin agent! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Villain4Life Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 AndyM3000, my 'quote' doesn't work, but I agree with what you say. It's a loan deal with an irrelevant option-to-buy, as the player will reject the personal terms offered anyway. Hence the accepted bid now, but the deal a loan deal. One could argue it buys us some time to find a more 'permanent' option, which is of course a plus. And if Cleverley is using Villa as a shopping window, he'd be willing to put in the hard work. But I think there is very little chance Cleverley is a Villa-player 12 month from now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CVByrne Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 So our 8m bid was accepted and yet we end up getting him on loan. He doesn't want to move here permanently then I presume? He wanted the best deal he could get. So was negotiating with Villa, then Everton came in for him and he had to hear them out, they are currently a much better team than us based on recent form. Who wouldn't go hear them out. It seems it was United who messed up as they were too busy to deal with Everton. I imagine the sticking point around a Villa deal was he wanted more money than we wanted to offer him right now. The knock on effects on Delph and Vlaar contract talks would have been stark. With the loan deal it means he can go earn the higher contract wage he wants by impressing on the pitch and we don't have to worry about his contract until after we've sorted out Vlaars and Delphs. What is irritating is the mis information and opinions far too many on here hold based on no information at all. How on earth you can pass judgement on him is baffllng. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CVByrne Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 AndyM3000, my 'quote' doesn't work, but I agree with what you say. It's a loan deal with an irrelevant option-to-buy, as the player will reject the personal terms offered anyway. Hence the accepted bid now, but the deal a loan deal. One could argue it buys us some time to find a more 'permanent' option, which is of course a plus. And if Cleverley is using Villa as a shopping window, he'd be willing to put in the hard work. But I think there is very little chance Cleverley is a Villa-player 12 month from now. Case in point. See this is all based on utterly zero information and is becoming rather annoying. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VillanousOne Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 But I think there is very little chance Cleverley is a Villa-player 12 month from now. he be Villa player long time 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raymond Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 AndyM3000, my 'quote' doesn't work, but I agree with what you say. It's a loan deal with an irrelevant option-to-buy, as the player will reject the personal terms offered anyway. Hence the accepted bid now, but the deal a loan deal. One could argue it buys us some time to find a more 'permanent' option, which is of course a plus. And if Cleverley is using Villa as a shopping window, he'd be willing to put in the hard work. But I think there is very little chance Cleverley is a Villa-player 12 month from now. Case in point. See this is all based on utterly zero information and is becoming rather annoying. As opposed to your post that was filled with factual statements like "I imagine" and "Who wouldn't want to." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dont_do_it_doug. Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 AndyM3000, my 'quote' doesn't work, but I agree with what you say. It's a loan deal with an irrelevant option-to-buy, as the player will reject the personal terms offered anyway. Hence the accepted bid now, but the deal a loan deal. One could argue it buys us some time to find a more 'permanent' option, which is of course a plus. And if Cleverley is using Villa as a shopping window, he'd be willing to put in the hard work. But I think there is very little chance Cleverley is a Villa-player 12 month from now. Case in point. See this is all based on utterly zero information and is becoming rather annoying. This. Debate him as a player if you like, I think he has potential to be very good but the doubts are large enough to warrant debate. But all this uninformed nonsense about what happened last night, what is going on in his head, the intricate details of this deal, it's utterly pointless, tedious and it is detracting from the main subject. How does he improve us as a team? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PieFacE Posted September 2, 2014 VT Supporter Share Posted September 2, 2014 I really think it's a no lose situation for us really. Regardless of the situation of him coming down here, we have an extra player who wants to reignite his career, he either jots off back to United after helping us, fails, and jots off with minimal damage to us, or signs on after realising it ain't all bad after all and we have a good player. It's a rare instance where I do believe the loan is the better outcome for us all. Yup, I'm much happier with the loan rather than spending £8m on him. It's currently a no lose situation like you said. We can only gain from this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oaks Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 But I think there is very little chance Cleverley is a Villa-player 12 month from now. he be Villa player long time From what I've been told it's a done deal, he will move on the 1st of January. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neil Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 So if the paper stories are to be believed it went pretty much like, he spent a whole day at bodymoor heath deliberating whether or not to sign for Villa. Everton came in with a deal and he was on the first bus down there, man-u were too busy pissing about and the (permanent?) Everton deal wasn't done before the window closed. So then Villa went cup in hand to the premier league saying "well we already had the deal in place before the window shut" and then with no other option, he agreed to come along after the premier league ratified it. Someone remind me what's actually the shocking part of this story, it just about sums up the typical footballer and club affair of today. I'm just waiting for the "Villa are a massive club who deserve to be up there with the top with their history, as soon as the deal was on the table I made no hesitation to sign and I look forward to taking Villa back to where they deserve to be" quotes. It's a funny old game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
avfcwills10 Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 So if the paper stories are to be believed it went pretty much like, he spent a whole day at bodymoor heath deliberating whether or not to sign for Villa. Everton came in with a deal and he was on the first bus down there, man-u were too busy pissing about and the (permanent?) Everton deal wasn't done before the window closed. So then Villa went cup in hand to the premier league saying "well we already had the deal in place before the window shut" and then with no other option, he agreed to come along after the premier league ratified it. Someone remind me what's actually the shocking part of this story, it just about sums up the typical footballer and club affair of today. I'm just waiting for the "Villa are a massive club who deserve to be up there with the top with their history, as soon as the deal was on the table I made no hesitation to sign and I look forward to taking Villa back to where they deserve to be" quotes. It's a funny old game. Bang on Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dont_do_it_doug. Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 AndyM3000, my 'quote' doesn't work, but I agree with what you say. It's a loan deal with an irrelevant option-to-buy, as the player will reject the personal terms offered anyway. Hence the accepted bid now, but the deal a loan deal. One could argue it buys us some time to find a more 'permanent' option, which is of course a plus. And if Cleverley is using Villa as a shopping window, he'd be willing to put in the hard work. But I think there is very little chance Cleverley is a Villa-player 12 month from now. Case in point. See this is all based on utterly zero information and is becoming rather annoying. As opposed to your post that was filled with factual statements like "I imagine" and "Who wouldn't want to." Which he has at least tried to build around the things we do know (that he spent a long while negotiating with the club, was ready to join, then left to go talk to Everton) rather than the things we don't (what the lad is thinking in his head). 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VillanousOne Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 as soon as he puts the shirt on and gives 100% for us people will forget anything that went before... probably 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob182 Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 Cleverley refused to sign because he (or his agent) wanted big bucks. There's every chance that if we sign him for free, we'll offer a decent signing on fee to make up for the drop in wages. He could be a Villa player next summer. You never know. A player who didn't want to be a Villa-player in the first place is killing 6 or 12 month at VP. Not ideal, imho and not the sort of player, we should be pursuing. IMHO.I think this argument is stupid. He's not a Villa fan, he doesn't have some links to us and he just waited until late in the window incase better clubs came in for him. As it happens a 'better' club DID come in for him. No matter what we think right now, Everton are a much better team, they have a better manager and they play better football. They're understandably a better option. Had he simply said "Even though I've heard Martinez wants me, forget them, I want to play in a half-empty Villa Park!" I would question his sanity tbh. Maybe we can offer him more playing time, but if he has confidence in his own ability, then maybe he thought he could get just as many games at Everton. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neil Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 as soon as he puts the shirt on and gives 100% for us people will forget anything that went before... probably Few good shifts and they'll be singing his name from the rafters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CVByrne Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 AndyM3000, my 'quote' doesn't work, but I agree with what you say. It's a loan deal with an irrelevant option-to-buy, as the player will reject the personal terms offered anyway. Hence the accepted bid now, but the deal a loan deal. One could argue it buys us some time to find a more 'permanent' option, which is of course a plus. And if Cleverley is using Villa as a shopping window, he'd be willing to put in the hard work. But I think there is very little chance Cleverley is a Villa-player 12 month from now. Case in point. See this is all based on utterly zero information and is becoming rather annoying. As opposed to your post that was filled with factual statements like "I imagine" and "Who wouldn't want to." I'm not the one trying to judge the guy, saying he'll reject terms and so buy out clause is useless and all other nonsense. I'm saying we don't know (hence my qualifying statements of non fact like I imagine etc..) anything bar he didn't join Everton he joined us. Supposedly they wanted him on loan, yet he never joined them. He came here. But obviously some had passed judgement, got all pissed off at Cleverly last night and rather than accept they didn't have a clue about what was going on and be happy we got our man they did what many people do. Do not backtrack, continue on the path of he was using villa, he's still a greedy mercenary etc.. he has to have an angle that is not good for villa... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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