Stevo985 Posted October 5, 2012 VT Supporter Share Posted October 5, 2012 His first touch was absolute quality against Swansea. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morpheus Posted October 5, 2012 Share Posted October 5, 2012 But 7m for potential especially in our financial and league positions over the past two seasons. Is that not taking an unnecessary gamble rather than buying proven quality? I'm all for buying young players whether it be from the lower leagues or in Europe but there's a time and place to do that in and around more seasoned campaigners. Yes we have Bent, Ireland and so on but with the exception of Bent, our other seasoned campaigners haven't been doing it for the club on a consistent basis and i still feel the way to go for us is to replace those with better quality first giving more stability to the team and then introduce the younger more inexperienced players within that stability and before i get a slue of answers stating that we couldn't afford 'better quality' Lambert has said that the chairman made the funds available to buy more seasoned pros but he refused to do that. It just seems to me that Lambert is risking our Premiership status at a time (extra TV revenue) when we first must secure our Premiership safety. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morpheus Posted October 5, 2012 Share Posted October 5, 2012 His first touch was absolute quality against Swansea. Mmmm not so sure about that but his first touch generally has been poor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo985 Posted October 5, 2012 VT Supporter Share Posted October 5, 2012 It was superb against Swansea. Anything that got to him stuck like glue, their defenders stopped challenging him after a while when the ball came to him because he was taking it down and holding them off every time. I agree he hasn't been great since, but I saw enough in that 20 minutes to know the touch is there, even if it's inconsistent. (also, his warm up at half time showed his first touch is good. Not as good as Westwood's mind you. BUt they were both blowing my mind with their first touches ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SikhInTrinity Posted October 5, 2012 Share Posted October 5, 2012 Proven quality for 7Million, how much did Giroud or Podolski cost? Didn't we purchase Premier League proven players last season, or under MON, how did we end up with that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morpheus Posted October 5, 2012 Share Posted October 5, 2012 I sincerely hope your right 'Stevo985' and his poor touch is down to inconsistency rather than just being a poor player but we'll see if he progresses over the season and i'll admit i was wrong about him if he does improve to the extent that he needs to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morpheus Posted October 5, 2012 Share Posted October 5, 2012 Proven quality for 7Million, how much did Giroud or Podolski cost? Didn't we purchase Premier League proven players last season, or under MON, how did we end up with that? Read my post again. I clearly stated better quality than we have at the moment, i.e replacing MON's players with better more seasoned campaigners while introducing the younger players in and around that and you have been rather selective in your choice of player to suit your argument. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SikhInTrinity Posted October 5, 2012 Share Posted October 5, 2012 Which costs money Morpehous, not just fees but massive wages to attract them to VP. Take QPR for example have they not purchased quality? You state numerous times his first touch is awful, as Stevo says it's inconsistent but he will improve. Anyway I predict you will be changing your opinion on Benteke in the near future IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villan_007 Posted October 5, 2012 Share Posted October 5, 2012 But 7m for potential especially in our financial and league positions over the past two seasons. Is that not taking an unnecessary gamble rather than buying proven quality? I'm all for buying young players whether it be from the lower leagues or in Europe but there's a time and place to do that in and around more seasoned campaigners. Yes we have Bent, Ireland and so on but with the exception of Bent, our other seasoned campaigners haven't been doing it for the club on a consistent basis and i still feel the way to go for us is to replace those with better quality first giving more stability to the team and then introduce the younger more inexperienced players within that stability and before i get a slue of answers stating that we couldn't afford 'better quality' Lambert has said that the chairman made the funds available to buy more seasoned pros but he refused to do that. It just seems to me that Lambert is risking our Premiership status at a time (extra TV revenue) when we first must secure our Premiership safety. You seem convinced that if we had signed berbatov and Adam we'd be sitting in the top six now. I'm over the moon that we have ditched that approached and have started again sensibly. Is there nothing you've seen so far that pleases you or gives you any confidence about the future?? We potentially have Englands future RB and LB for one example. We are a new side and have a sprinkle of experience within that (no not prem - which means nothing) a manager and staff that are hungry to succeed. Benteke for me is a cracking signing - I fail to see how you cant see that. With youth comes mistakes, but you can see he's got it. I know that this season will be win a few loose a few whilst the team is building. I'm very content with that and have no fears of relegation. Im happy with the direction we are going in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Papillon Posted October 5, 2012 Share Posted October 5, 2012 Proven quality for 7Million, how much did Giroud or Podolski cost? Didn't we purchase Premier League proven players last season, or under MON, how did we end up with that? With MON? Consecutive top 6, challenging the top 4 and European nights. And blame the CFO and chairman who negotiates contracts, not the manager. The outlay we had was not THAT huge and a bare minimum if one wants to sustain a challenge. All in all it fell back to Lerner who decided he did not want to challenge any longer, something we are not going to do with this budget. Buy hey, it is not a godgiven right to play in Europe for a club like Aston Villa. My theory is that Lerner was baffled by the arrival of Man City and a reinvigorated Tottenham. Basically, making his dream impossible to reach. MON got to spend money, he was approved every penny by the board and any manager would spend that cash. Look at Sunderland (pre-MON) and QPR, they are spending money as well but not reaching the same level. I don't know, but I am tired of looking at all the posters behaving like educated economists and financiers, all in all we have just come out on the unlucky side of things in this league. We were going places, now we are kind of not. Wage-to-revenue ratios are all good at the moment, but it comes down to Lerner wanting it that way. If he was into it he would invest more over a couple of years to make it possible to even dream about Europa League. At the moment we are all dreading relegation at worst, and maybe 12th at best. What do you think will happen if one or two of our players go on to have a great season? They would be sold within a forthnight, and they would have a better bargaining position than Barry, Milner and Young had. But like I said, it is not a godgiven right to be spending millions and having a great budget every window. That is life after all. I just hope that we never relegate and I will cherish every win we have, even though it will seldom reach above 10 during a season. I have been a supporter since I was 5 years old (Scandinavian btw), and I am used to Villa losing once in a while Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SikhInTrinity Posted October 5, 2012 Share Posted October 5, 2012 Papillon, have a look at the accounts, We could have easily gone down the route of Pompey if as you say Randy wanted to challenge. You blame Randy for the wages, that's fair enough but signing players such as Habib Beye, Curtis Davies, NRC and not playing them, is MON's fault. If we did not reign our spending we would have been in dire straights and possibly have no club to support. MON walked when he tried to buy more overpaid dross, have you forgotten some of the outlays, I am one glad that he did actually sign a few decent ones with re-sale values because if he didn't we'd be financially screwed. Anyway this is not the debate, this is about Benteke, We are using a different route to success rather than the throw money at it, I don't mind selling players, as long as we replace them, do Everton fans complain when players are sold, no as they trust the manager to replace them with better players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roadoftrinity Posted October 5, 2012 Share Posted October 5, 2012 I'm not saying he's a poor player but comparing him to Drogba is silly. Agree completely, same way it is silly to compare him to Carlton Cole. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
omariqy Posted October 5, 2012 Share Posted October 5, 2012 His touch is brilliant and you can see he is a good footballer. Think he needs to work on his decision making and also not go missing. We already have Bent for that. He will get better though and I think he is a great signing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Papillon Posted October 5, 2012 Share Posted October 5, 2012 Papillon, have a look at the accounts, We could have easily gone down the route of Pompey if as you say Randy wanted to challenge. You blame Randy for the wages, that's fair enough but signing players such as Habib Beye, Curtis Davies, NRC and not playing them, is MON's fault. If we did not reign our spending we would have been in dire straights and possibly have no club to support. MON walked when he tried to buy more overpaid dross, have you forgotten some of the outlays, I am one glad that he did actually sign a few decent ones with re-sale values because if he didn't we'd be financially screwed. Anyway this is not the debate, this is about Benteke, We are using a different route to success rather than the throw money at it, I don't mind selling players, as long as we replace them, do Everton fans complain when players are sold, no as they trust the manager to replace them with better players. We could and would have gone down the route of Pompey if Lerner had spent out of his mind and then abandoned the club, like every club would do if that happened to them. But like I said, it was a question for Randy Lerner alone and not hobby accountants on VillaTalk. MON did sign some crappy players I completely agree, but every manager does. But thinking back, basically everone on here were happy with the signings of Reo-Coker, Davies and Beye. However, signing players like Heskey kind of told the story about what was going to happen next. I have grown accustomed to our situation. We are not challenging anymore or in the immediate future. It is about surviving and fighting for our spot in the Premier League as well as hoping to do an Everton if possible. I just hope people realize that what Everton have done is the extreme side of this approach, and not many if any have come close to it since the Premier League started. Arsenal to a degree, but they always had the financial strength when it really mattered and have signed expensive players in the 10-15M bracket. Arsenal is all about Wenger though, the only manager in the world to create gems out of cheap outlays over that period since he arrived. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
macandally Posted October 5, 2012 Share Posted October 5, 2012 Blimey doesnt take long does it........ We have been missing this type of player since Carew left, big and strong. When Gabby plays defences sit deep and Benteke can now sit on the last man and bring the midfield into play. Lambert is bulding a team which is stronger than the individual parts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lexicon Posted October 6, 2012 Share Posted October 6, 2012 New forum.. cool. This Benteke criticism is nothing new but disappointing to see all the same - he should be getting support rather than derision at this point of his career. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheltenham_villa Posted October 6, 2012 Share Posted October 6, 2012 New forum.. cool. This Benteke criticism is nothing new but disappointing to see all the same - he should be getting support rather than derision at this point of his career. to be fair its a forum for opinions. If everyone agreed then this place would have no reason to exist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
avfc1982 Posted October 6, 2012 Share Posted October 6, 2012 Proven quality for 7Million, how much did Giroud or Podolski cost? Didn't we purchase Premier League proven players last season, or under MON, how did we end up with that? He's nowhere near proven, yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morpheus Posted October 6, 2012 Share Posted October 6, 2012 You seem convinced that if we had signed berbatov and Adam we'd be sitting in the top six now. I'm over the moon that we have ditched that approached and have started again sensibly. Is there nothing you've seen so far that pleases you or gives you any confidence about the future?? We potentially have Englands future RB and LB for one example. We are a new side and have a sprinkle of experience within that (no not prem - which means nothing) a manager and staff that are hungry to succeed. Benteke for me is a cracking signing - I fail to see how you cant see that. With youth comes mistakes, but you can see he's got it. I know that this season will be win a few loose a few whilst the team is building. I'm very content with that and have no fears of relegation. Im happy with the direction we are going in. Firstly i have never stated that signing those players would put us in the top six! I have however stated that those signings would have given better stability to the team and i still maintain that. To state 'we potentially have England's future RB and LB' is more than a little premature although it would be nice. To date i have seen nothing in Benteke to suggest that he is a 'cracking signing.' I think we're slightly better ball retention wise but still lack a cutting edge going forward and the balance of the side isn't yet right. That may come but at the moment i'm still not quite sure about Lambert? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheltenham_villa Posted October 6, 2012 Share Posted October 6, 2012 Agree completely, same way it is silly to compare him to Carlton Cole. I dont see why, both big blokes, decent in the air, reasonably quick, poor first touch, Cole was a promising youngster, played for his country, big money move. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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