Drugs

[CrackpotForeigner]

 

 

I've dabbled in my day (never having done LSD, heroin, meth)...and I actually think cocaine is as benign as cannabis if used in moderation. There is unwarranted hysteria over cocaine IMO.

 

I think the main argument against complete legalisation of cocaine is crack, which I believe is really easy to make from cocaine.

 

I had a druggy friend years ago (who incidentally rather lost his way. I think the drugs were the symptom rather than the cause though mostly). He told me about going to a bloke's house with a friend and them being given a big and a small rock to share. He reckoned that after sharing the big rock they were just about ready to kill each other for the second rock. Scary.

he is bullshitting. one rock of crack does not make you want to kill anyone, even a big one!

 

 

I meant that it sounds scarily more-ish, rather than that it turns you into a homicidal maniac

Edited June 19, 2013 by CrackpotForeigner

[tarjei]

Looking for a bit of advice... I ran into a guy today that I've been having ongoing discussion about starting a studio/creative collective with. His eyes were red and his pupils were tiny tiny. To such a degree that there is no way you could look at him and not notice. My first thought obviously was heavier drugs, muscle relaxant types (heroin), but any chance it could be caused by hash or some form of medication? He didn't have any other noticeable characteristics, voice or body language. I'm a bit puzzled as I have not noticed anything prior to this, although he does hang out with a few people that I know use heavier stuff. I have nothing against smokers and wouldn't object to anyone doing that, but I don't want to get financially involved with someone who has an expensive, all consuming habit.

[Xann]

Small pupils often mean opiates, but codeine is an opiate. There are other legit drugs that do it too.

[leemond2008]

Looking for a bit of advice... I ran into a guy today that I've been having ongoing discussion about starting a studio/creative collective with. His eyes were red and his pupils were tiny tiny. To such a degree that there is no way you could look at him and not notice. My first thought obviously was heavier drugs, muscle relaxant types (heroin), but any chance it could be caused by hash or some form of medication? He didn't have any other noticeable characteristics, voice or body language. I'm a bit puzzled as I have not noticed anything prior to this, although he does hang out with a few people that I know use heavier stuff. I have nothing against smokers and wouldn't object to anyone doing that, but I don't want to get financially involved with someone who has an expensive, all consuming habit.

 

Not being funny but why not just say that you would only get financially involved with someone who does not use drugs.

 

If he is on them and gets pissed off at you for asking then you have had a narrow escape

If he is on legitimate medication that causes him to look like that then he would probably understand why you would bring this up.

If he is on legitimate medicaton that causes him to look like that and he gets pissed off at you for asking then he is obviously a highly strung freak and you wouldn't want to get financially involved with someone like that anyway.

[BOF]

Diplomacy by hand grenade then Leemond?

[leemond2008]

well you know I'm not suggesting he say's ''excuse me sir but I would like you to know that I am not interested in this venture if you are a drug addled freak''

 

but it would may be handy to lay his cards on the table

...or he could just throw caution to the wind and get absolutely shit faced with the drug peddling motherf***er and have a party

[tarjei]

Makes sense, leemond. Now I wish I had just asked him what was up with his eyes. Normally I'm like that, but I think I got a bit perplexed. I'm bound to have a few meetings with him before anything concrete happens so maybe an opportunity will arise again.

[AVFCforever1991]

Maybe he just has pink eye (Conjunctivitis)

[chrisp65]

If this venture involves you stumping up the cash to buy a DC 4 and being the face of Tarjei International Trade Serices and him organising the warehousing and loading, I'd give it a swerve.

[tarjei]

Pink eye would explain the redness but not the tiny pupils (as in a few milimeters wide).

It will be less than one airplane for sure, but a small investment of money, lots of time and everything I own of monetary value (which is not that much to the average person, but would set me back immensely)

[villaguy]

Reading just a few of these statements makes me realise in the real world how little is understood. There's a huge difference to being a user and an addict. Addicts are people who in their personality traits want it more and more, these people sometimes get into drugs or other psychological turn ons and it wrecks their lives, be it alcohol, pornography, crack, smack or whatever. I've known people who in their teens used to get off their heads on recreational drugs more than the average but have had a very very good career. To me if people take things in moderation it's no big deal and shouldn't be criminalised, alcohol and the often supported cannabis is just as bad as any other drug in my opinion

[maqroll]

Sometimes I feel like moving to New Orleans, spending all my savings on a massive hard drugs stockpile, holing up in a French Quarter hotel and just get absolutely battered.

[villaguy]

Yeah the sane world doesn't exactly make you feel sane, or does it? I'm confused, what is reality, do we really know? But in all honesty who knows....Yeah drugs are bad when they destruct a persons life but often they don't, should we get tax from the inevitable trade, how can we tell who can and can't take them. Pretty tough questions really

[AVFCforever1991]

[MikeMcKenna]

Having read many of the comments in this thread about the consequences of drug use, acceptability and whether it should be legalised, I thought I would throw my tuppence worth into the debate. I agree with the basic argument that drug use should be decrimalised, but my concern relates to the very long terms effects and how well they are understood..

When I was young in the early 70s drug availability and use was fairly rare except in certain sub cultures. However the use of drugs was highly prevalent on the Northern Soul scene, partly driven by the all nighters and up tempo dancing. Amphetamines (Speed) were the main drug of choice although a minority were also into opiates. The drugs used were often of a high quality as they were invariably nicked from Chemists although progressively dealers over the years started to sell junk.

Due to licensing hours back then was no alcohol at the nighters. Those that did drink earlier in the evening tended to stick to beer, which was a lot weaker than now.

Although I am not involved in the scene anymore, I am a member of a number of Northern Soul forums and websites and observe from afar. While my evidence is purely anecdotal and I cannot deny that other lifestyle issues maybe a factor, there does seem to be a disproportionate amount of ill health and deaths at a relatively young age (50s) among the core Northern Soul fraternity.

In terms of its overall impact on society I accept that alcohol is more damaging but I do wonder whether the use of certain drugs such as Cocaine, MDMA etc lead to big health problems in later life? I know that the same can be said of alcohol, but are the risks higher with seemingly moderate use of certain drugs?

[AVFCforever1991]

At least somebody is speaking sense. 

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-24320717

 

 

 

End war on drugs, says Durham police chief Mike Barton.

.

Class A drugs should be decriminalised and drug addicts "treated and cared for not criminalised", according to a senior UK police officer.

 

Writing in the Observer, Chief Constable Mike Barton of Durham Police said prohibition had put billions of pounds into the hands of criminals.

 

He called for an open debate on the problems caused by drugs.

 

The Home Office reiterated its stance and said drugs were illegal because they were dangerous.

 

Controlled

 

The chief constable - who is the intelligence lead for the Association of Chief Police Officers (Acpo) - said he believed decriminalisation of Class A drugs would take away the income of dealers, destroy their power, and that a "controlled environment" would be a more successful way of tackling the issue.

 

He said when faced with the "extremely damaging" impacts of alcohol, his argument to decriminalise drugs may appear weakened, but called for an open and honest debate on the matter.

 

A petition is calling on the government to follow the advice of the Home Affairs Committee and introduce a Royal Commission on drug law reform.

 

Mr Barton said: "If an addict were able to access drugs via the NHS or something similar, then they would not have to go out and buy illegal drugs.

 

"Buying or being treated with, say, diamorphine is cheap. It's cheap to produce it therapeutically.

 

Not all crime gangs raise income through selling drugs, but most of them do in my experience. So offering an alternative route of supply to users cuts their income stream off.

 

"What I am saying is that drugs should be controlled. They should not, of course, be freely available."

 

Mr Barton compared drugs prohibition to the ban on alcohol in the US in the 1920s which fuelled organised crime.

 

Mr Barton told the Observer: "Have we not learned the lessons of prohibition in history?"

 

"The Mob's sinister rise to prominence in the US was pretty much funded through its supply of a prohibited drug, alcohol. That's arguably what we are doing in the UK."

 

'Revenue for villains'

 

He said some young people saw drug dealers as glamorous gangsters and envied their wealth.

 

The officer said drug addicts must be treated and cared for and encouraged to break the cycle of addiction - they did not need to be criminalised.

 

He said: "I think addiction to anything - drugs, alcohol, gambling, etc - is not a good thing, but outright prohibition hands revenue streams to villains.

 

"Since 1971 [the Misuse of Drugs Act] prohibition has put billions into the hands of villains who sell adulterated drugs on the streets.

 

"If you started to give a heroin addict the drug therapeutically, then we would not have the scourge of hepatitis C and Aids spreading among needle users, for instance. I am calling for a controlled environment, not a free-for-all."

 

According to UK-wide figures released on Friday by Public Health England, 120 of 6,364 newly-diagnosed HIV cases in 2012 were said to have been acquired through injecting drugs.

New laws were announced in July by Home Secretary Theresa May to allow drug treatment providers the opportunity to offer addicts foil - used as a surface to heat up drugs like heroin - as part of efforts to get addicts into treatment, and to protect their health.

 

The number of heroin and crack cocaine users in England have fallen below 300,000 for the first time, according to figures by the National Treatment Agency for Substance Misuse.

 

The figure peaked at 332,090 in 2005-06 before dropping to 298,752 in 2010-11.

 

War on drugs

 

Mr Barton said if the "war on drugs" meant trying to reduce illicit supply then it had failed.

 

There were 43 organised crime groups on their radar in the Durham Constabulary area alone, he added.

 

Mr Barton is among a small number of top police officers in the UK who have called for a major review of drugs policy.

 

Durham's police and crime commissioner, Ron Hogg, said he agreed with Mr Barton's stance.

 

"Mike and I are totally at one on this," he said.

 

"We've had a number of discussions about drugs and whether we should decriminalise and take control. Our current view is quite simple: that the current drugs strategy legislation has not succeeded."

 

Mr Hogg said Mr Barton was taking a responsible position, and added: "Crime will decrease if we can actually legalise or decriminalise drugs usage and treat the offender rather than deal with the symptoms thereafter, and that's what we really have to focus on."

 

Chief Constable Andy Bliss, who is Acpo's lead on drug-related crime, said it was up to MPs to decide whether to legalise drugs.

 

He said: "Government policy on drugs enforcement is very clear and unambiguous and our job as police officers is to enforce the law.

 

"Clearly, a senior colleague like Mike Barton is entitled to his views and he has added his contribution to the national debate, but it would be Acpo's position that these are matters for parliament to decide."

 

Danny Kushlick, of Transform Drug Policy Foundation, said the group was delighted to see a serving chief constable willing to stand up and "tell the truth ", that prohibition does not work.

A Home Office spokesman said: "Drugs are illegal because they are dangerous. They destroy lives and blight communities.

 

"The UK's approach on drugs remains clear, we must help individuals who are dependent by treatment, while ensuring law enforcement protects society by stopping the supply and tackling the organised crime that is associated with the drugs trade."

Edited October 1, 2013 by AVFCforever1991

[PieFacE]

I was drunk the other night and got offered some LSD at 3am. Me being the idiot I am thought "hey why not, what's the worst that can happen?"...

 

For the first couple of hours it was a really good laugh, but then turned into the scariest and worst experience of my life. I actually thought I was going to die. Had absolutely no idea what I was doing, had no idea of my surroundings, in my mind I went to a different universe but somehow I managed to get home at 9am (no idea how). Then spent the whole day lay in bed, heart racing, clinging onto my phone in case I needed to contact someone to help. It was so surreal, all rational thinking goes completely out the window and I felt like I was forgetting to breath which brought on more panic.

 

No idea how people can do that for fun. Never again for me. It's amazing what a tiny piece of paper can do to the human mind. Scary stuff.

 

However, I'm glad for the experience. Learnt a few things about myself which was well needed. Lesson learnt that night.

Edited October 1, 2013 by PieFacE

[CarewsEyebrowDesigner]

Lock them all up for doing things to their own bodies, I say.

[AVFCforever1991]

I was drunk the other night and got offered some LSD at 3am. Me being the idiot I am thought "hey why not, what's the worst that can happen?"...

 

For the first couple of hours it was a really good laugh, but then turned into the scariest and worst experience of my life. I actually thought I was going to die. Had absolutely no idea what I was doing, had no idea of my surroundings, in my mind I went to a different universe but somehow I managed to get home at 9am (no idea how). Then spent the whole day lay in bed, heart racing, clinging onto my phone in case I needed to contact someone to help. It was so surreal, all rational thinking goes completely out the window and I felt like I was forgetting to breath which brought on more panic.

 

No idea how people can do that for fun. Never again for me. It's amazing what a tiny piece of paper can do to the human mind. Scary stuff.

 

However, I'm glad for the experience. Learnt a few things about myself which was well needed. Lesson learnt that night.

 

Yeah that sounds like a horrible setting for a trip. 

[PieFacE]

 

I was drunk the other night and got offered some LSD at 3am. Me being the idiot I am thought "hey why not, what's the worst that can happen?"...

 

For the first couple of hours it was a really good laugh, but then turned into the scariest and worst experience of my life. I actually thought I was going to die. Had absolutely no idea what I was doing, had no idea of my surroundings, in my mind I went to a different universe but somehow I managed to get home at 9am (no idea how). Then spent the whole day lay in bed, heart racing, clinging onto my phone in case I needed to contact someone to help. It was so surreal, all rational thinking goes completely out the window and I felt like I was forgetting to breath which brought on more panic.

 

No idea how people can do that for fun. Never again for me. It's amazing what a tiny piece of paper can do to the human mind. Scary stuff.

 

However, I'm glad for the experience. Learnt a few things about myself which was well needed. Lesson learnt that night.

 

Yeah that sounds like a horrible setting for a trip. 

 

Yeah it was. Maybe doing it whilst sat in a field on a sunny day at a festival where everyone is having a good time would be completely different.

 

But doing it in a dark living room with a couple of people early hours was just horrible.