blandy Posted December 14, 2022 Moderator Share Posted December 14, 2022 1 hour ago, sidcow said: So if The USA instead sat back the World would just be at peace? Everyone rubbing along just fine? American foreign policy does leave a lot to be desired but I'm not at all convinced that we'd have more peace in a world left to its own devices. I would say reliance on fossil fuels is a big driver of world instability coupled with religion. That's certainly not what I was implying. From my perspective, the instability in the Middle East would still be there because of religious schisms and so on, but I think it's undeniable that the George W Bush and Project for a New world order or whatever they called themselves back then massively accelerated or amplified those fissures with their interventions - Gulf War 2. Aided by Blair and others. Similarly the US has got itself involved in all kinds of areas of the world that it shouldn't. South America and so on. Now many of those paces had/have corrupt government and awful human right and so on, but the US got involved for reasons of self interest and nothing more. Self appointed world policeman. The flip side is that there are other nations, China, Russia etc. who have done or would do exactly the same or worse and so there needs to be some kind of balancing force. Ideally, to go back to @TheAuthority's question, that should be the role of the UN - not the US, not Russia, not China, not any one nation, but the "international community". So on the one hand we have the US acting as self appointed world policeman and simultaneously self interested super power, and on the other we have "the west" (rest of) too weak to actually take control, or steer the US away from the more egregious over-steps its taken, kind of by default relying on the US to do good things (which it also does) and turning a blind eye to the bad things. It's all very imperfect, and no nation comes out of anything well, really. The world is a complicated place. I'd rather live under western or US style conditions than those in Russia, China, South America et. but that doesn't make the US any kind of solution, it's not. Fossil fuels, water (increasingly) and resources generally are the underlying drivers for much conflict and tension, and will be increasingly so, plus of course the undemocratic despots with grand visions like Putin and Xi. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MakemineVanilla Posted December 14, 2022 Share Posted December 14, 2022 8 hours ago, blandy said: Does it ****! a large chunk of the instability in the world is due to or a partial consequence of US imperialism. I tend to think that American foreign policy can be explained by a combination of Star Trek (the first series) and Chomsky. In Star Trek they used to try and solve ethnic tensions on a planet by arming each side equally to create a detente and an uneasy stability of sorts. Chomsky claimed that the USA determined a country's status as regards their friendliness or not to American financial interests, ie how open they were to investment. Their involvement in Ukraine, seems to be a combination of both of the above. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villakram Posted December 15, 2022 Share Posted December 15, 2022 16 hours ago, Vancvillan said: Mate we've got 76 active fighter jets sprawled across the second largest country on earth. We couldn't invade Seattle. I'm sure Tim Horton could chuck in a few cuppas for the patriotic cause! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villakram Posted December 15, 2022 Share Posted December 15, 2022 17 hours ago, sidcow said: What does that even mean? It's like talking to a riddler. You are using the idea of an implied Russian or Chinese invasion (because, what else would such evil types want to do other than smite those annoying freedom lovers) as a backing for a point of view. This is a strawman, in argument construction speak. Much like all of the things those lovely Tories want to do, because of the children, the rapist/murderer/fanatic foreigners etc., etc. Ah, the joys of virtual talking past each other. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blandy Posted December 15, 2022 Moderator Share Posted December 15, 2022 3 hours ago, villakram said: You are using the idea of an implied Russian or Chinese invasion (because, what else would such evil types want to do other than smite those annoying freedom lovers... Like Taiwan and Ukraine? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sne Posted December 15, 2022 Share Posted December 15, 2022 Trumplander? Mental state of a 10-year old. I know a secret and I'm gonna tell it. But tomorrow, not today. Bwa-bwa give me attention. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vancvillan Posted December 15, 2022 Share Posted December 15, 2022 4 hours ago, villakram said: I'm sure Tim Horton could chuck in a few cuppas for the patriotic cause! Tim's got bought out a couple of years ago by... the Americans. Vice (I know) did an article a while back on what a US invasion of Canada would look like. You can read the full article if you want but the following pretty much sums it up: "However, barring a Canadian insurgency, after that initial 24 hours, Canada would be conquered, surrender would be imminent and the US would quickly attempt to co-opt the Canadian military." https://www.vice.com/amp/en/article/9aa9az/what-would-happen-in-the-minutes-and-hours-after-the-us-invaded-canada 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sidcow Posted December 15, 2022 VT Supporter Share Posted December 15, 2022 6 hours ago, villakram said: You are using the idea of an implied Russian or Chinese invasion (because, what else would such evil types want to do other than smite those annoying freedom lovers) as a backing for a point of view. This is a strawman, in argument construction speak. Much like all of the things those lovely Tories want to do, because of the children, the rapist/murderer/fanatic foreigners etc., etc. Ah, the joys of virtual talking past each other. I'm not going to bother any more. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villakram Posted December 15, 2022 Share Posted December 15, 2022 10 hours ago, Vancvillan said: Tim's got bought out a couple of years ago by... the Americans. Vice (I know) did an article a while back on what a US invasion of Canada would look like. You can read the full article if you want but the following pretty much sums it up: "However, barring a Canadian insurgency, after that initial 24 hours, Canada would be conquered, surrender would be imminent and the US would quickly attempt to co-opt the Canadian military." https://www.vice.com/amp/en/article/9aa9az/what-would-happen-in-the-minutes-and-hours-after-the-us-invaded-canada They go straight for starbucks HQ... it's just business! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villakram Posted December 15, 2022 Share Posted December 15, 2022 12 hours ago, blandy said: Like Taiwan and Ukraine? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post theboyangel Posted December 15, 2022 Popular Post Share Posted December 15, 2022 12 hours ago, sne said: Trumplander? Mental state of a 10-year old. I know a secret and I'm gonna tell it. But tomorrow, not today. Bwa-bwa give me attention. Look.At.The.State.Of.It!!!!! he has sunk to unimaginable new depths 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
il_serpente Posted December 15, 2022 VT Supporter Share Posted December 15, 2022 10 hours ago, sidcow said: I'm not going to bother any more. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sne Posted December 15, 2022 Share Posted December 15, 2022 1 hour ago, theboyangel said: Look.At.The.State.Of.It!!!!! he has sunk to unimaginable new depths That's just fantastic. He does know the world is laughing at him right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theboyangel Posted December 15, 2022 Share Posted December 15, 2022 5 minutes ago, sne said: That's just fantastic. He does know the world is laughing at him right? His ego won’t allow that - he’ll think he’s the dogs bollards and/or knows he’s going to be ripping off his maga fanbase! this has to be his presidential aspirations over, surely? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bickster Posted December 15, 2022 Moderator Share Posted December 15, 2022 If any sane rational person doesnt see this as pure grift now then they deserve to lose all their money 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MakemineVanilla Posted December 15, 2022 Share Posted December 15, 2022 2 hours ago, theboyangel said: Look.At.The.State.Of.It!!!!! he has sunk to unimaginable new depths I guess if you can't get any FTX money then you have to pass the hat round. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheAuthority Posted December 15, 2022 VT Supporter Share Posted December 15, 2022 2 hours ago, theboyangel said: Look.At.The.State.Of.It!!!!! he has sunk to unimaginable new depths Amazing he's talking about bitcoin just as it's about to go out of existence! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AJ Posted December 15, 2022 Share Posted December 15, 2022 2 hours ago, theboyangel said: Look.At.The.State.Of.It!!!!! he has sunk to unimaginable new depths Surely, surely this can't be real. Someone is taking the piss, right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theboyangel Posted December 15, 2022 Share Posted December 15, 2022 1 minute ago, AJ said: Surely, surely this can't be real. Someone is taking the piss, right? I actually think he’s being very very serious (about ripping off his followers!) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villakram Posted December 16, 2022 Share Posted December 16, 2022 It's interesting all the posting here and elsewhere regarding the shiny things but nothing regarding his censorship/section 230 policy proposals/platform, which would actually matter. Less and less media org servers/corp would live in the US I suspect and who knows what sort of explicit segmenting of the internet would follow. Though, it's unclear that they would meaningfully impact the path the tech monopolies are taking us on anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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