Ratings & Reactions: Chelsea v Villa

[Teale's 'tache]

Worries about the high line are not new, in fact, we have a thread on here about it that was started at some point last season. There will always be worries as we continue to employ it, but the points we have won playing this way speak for themselves.

We did defend better yesterday, we were much less ragged and kept our shape better in general. However, I think if we could put pressure on the ball in midfield a bit quicker it would certainly leave that high line less exposed, this is where we miss Buendia I feel, and also to a lesser degree Ramsey. Last season with those two providing more pressure on the ball we looked a lot more comfortable and in control, with less pressure and without Mings we do seem a little more jumpy at the back. There's been a lot of upheaval in the team, not only in defence we also have 2 new players in our forward press in Diaby and Zaniolo, and a good forward press takes time and repetition, so I think it will improve.

Overall it's a good performance and very happy to get 3 points while we still have teething issues to resolve, and that's what good teams and good managers can do. Chelsea have their own problems that they weren't able to overcome.

 

[ozvillafan]

All in all a very good away performance against a London based team. Excellent.

Emi, Luiz, Kamara, Konsa and Torres all fantastic.

2 things I learned, 1 I already knew:

• Apparently extra time not played in the first half becomes extra time in the 2nd half. 11 minutes? You wot?
• Zaniollo will be immense once he beds in properly
• Queenslanders cannot count past 2.

[TRO]

1 hour ago, ferguson1 said:

I certainly wasn’t reminding you yesterday but just felt that we should all embrace the win in the immediate aftermath of the game. Winning is great, regardless of how it happens. It just felt a little downbeat in the post match chat.

Of course we all have our concerns about our defensive side of game. It’s clearly evident. Time to analyse and critique is not always best in the immediate aftermath when fans are boyant. Crikey just look at the Palace game if we hadn’t scored those two late goals?

Anyway, I certainly don’t disagree with your points, just that it felt a little labouring the point straight after a great win. Very much hope I didn’t offend you or anyone else. Onwards and upwards UTV

My comments were certainly not aimed at you....most of the time, we are on the same page....."and winning is great regardless".....maybe the context of what I was saying was lost, due to the win.

I understand the timing of my comments.....but if I made them after a defeat, that would be deemed ill timed too.....So I don't know when is the right time?

just a point.....Labouring a point can easily happen, in response to other posters.....and explaining ones stance, can drift that way.

anyway, Unai himself made brief references to "Struggling at times".........Look the result was Fab, long may it continue.

Edited September 25, 2023 by TRO

[sharkyvilla]

Yesterday was the first time I thought Konsa and Torres got close to nailing the high line.  The easy thing would have been to ditch it because of Mings but Emery trusted himself and the players to get it right quickly.  He goes for wins, not keeping it safe.

Edited September 25, 2023 by sharkyvilla

[StefanAVFC]

 

1 hour ago, TRO said:

My comments were certainly not aimed at you....most of the time, we are on the same page....."and winning is great regardless".....maybe the context of what I was saying was lost, due to the win.

I understand the timing of my comments.....but if I made them after a defeat, that would be deemed ill timed too.....So I don't know when is the right time?

just a point.....Labouring a point can easily happen, in response to other posters.....and explaining ones stance, can drift that way.

anyway, Unai himself made brief references to "Struggling at times".........Look the result was Fab, long may it continue.

It's just cyclical isn't it.

We lose and you criticise the high line. We win, with the high line working and you... criticise the high line.

The very nature of how we play means we will give chances away, and the high line plays into it. You will never be satisfied with us playing in this style based on your comments.

We get it. You don't like it. You prefer an old school 'mark your man' style of football. Win 1-0 at all costs and stop chances.

But that isn't how we play, and we never will under Emery. Either get used to it, or don't make the same complaints, win or lose.

Because it is working.

3rd most points in 2023. CL form.

The last time we didn't play this style, under your bestie Gerrard, we were looking to get relegated.

 

Edited September 25, 2023 by StefanAVFC

[TRO]

1 hour ago, sharkyvilla said:

Yesterday was the first time I thought Konsa and Torres got close to nailing the high line.  The easy thing would have been to ditch it because of Mings but Emery trusted himself and the players to get it right quickly.  He goes for wins, not keeping it safe.

They are not mutually exclusive.....Attention to both in a game is prudent.

The highline needs to have pressing to go with it.....so the player launching the long ball, gets closed down, as much as possible.

Like many things in football....one without the other can make the objective difficult....I accept injuries and new players have made it a "WIP"

Any system that is responsible for shipping goals needs revisiting and adjusting......Newcastle, Liverpool and Legia are examples of that.

UE will always do it his way, and so he should.....but I can assure myself, shipping sloppy goals is not part of his plan....no matter how much effort he affords to winning, he knows he can't always rely on just outscoring teams, with scant regard for resolute defending.

Personally.....I think 1-0 away from home, says much good about a teams character.

Edited September 25, 2023 by TRO

[Tom13]

Quote

Emiliano Martinez shines, Moussa Diaby stinks out Stamford Bridge - Aston Villa player ratings v Chelsea

https://www.astonvillanews.co.uk/2023/09/24/emiliano-martinez-shines-moussa-diaby-stinks-out-stamford-bridge-aston-villa-player-ratings-v-chelsea/

Someone please shut that website down. Those ratings are laughable!

Luiz 5 ffs.

[onmeedson]

The result was welcome and against 10 men you should be beating the opposition. The high line was given a great deal of help by the football brain dead forwards Chelsea put out, they had pace to burn but making the run has to be timed or we get into Liverpool and Newcastle games were the run's are effective. It's a Russian roulette system and can lead to injurie's as the defender tends to lunge in the chase back and do damage to himself overtime. Unai has been a bright light for this club only hope he can adapt his play more around the player's we have in the moment.

[Philosopher]

Defense is still a worry. We were cut open fairly easily at times. The high isn't a problem, it's part of the modern game. It enables us to compress the play and make it harder to play through us and facilitates our press.

Cash and Digne has problems with the Chelsea wingers, one on one they struggled. The offside trap worked well, but there were 2 or 3 occasions where it didn't. 

Thought it was a fairly even game until the sending off, after which we controlled the game until we scored. After we scored, we made it easier for them by failing to keep the.

Martinez and Kamara the clear stand outs. McGinn was a better, bit still a little below par. Diaby didn't really get into the game.

Generally an average display, defense kept a clean sheet which is much needed. Goormdn

[rubberman]

For all the worries about the highline, we've conceded the 6th fewest shots on target per game so far this season, despite the Liverpool and Newcastle games.  And tbh I think this is the same as when we first started playing it - it looked a bit shaky and took a fair few games for the defence (superbly marshalled by Mings) to stop being terrifying to watch. The new backline will get it under Unai as they get to know each other's games better and we'll look more solid as a result.

 

[fightoffyour]

5 hours ago, villan95 said:

I thought Chelsea had the better chances but I found it difficult to keep track of what chances were offside and which would have counted tbh. For what it's worth the xG for the game on the BBC was 1.35 to 1.04.

How does xG work for a chance that was allowed to go on but would've been given offside? Anyone know?

[CVByrne]

9 hours ago, TRO said:

Our defence was breached several times.....The clean sheet was a combination of they just failed to score and our Keeper was brilliant.....Good job it was Chelsea and not Newcastle.

The opposition are still gettting around the back of us, and breaching the lines with timely runs, this was still evident.....but the result was great.

If we want to sustain this points haul, we have to be more miserly at the back and stop the runners.

They had a few chances and they were close in terms of offside too. So if they scored from one of those chances it still had to go through a VAR check. Sterling chance the one that looked offside to me. 

We had them offside 10 times. They only had 1.4xg so we limited them in terms of chances. 

We need to accept the high line gets breached and that's how the system goes. It gives us offsides and easy turnover of possession with them. Which is a way we control games. We also draw lots of fouls which also allows us control the game.

What this does is gives us more possession and with it more chances to create goals for ourselves. The whole system is linked. We are creating a lot of chances in games because we have more control of them.

The whole defensive approach we had last season is not how we play now. 

[OutByEaster?]

 

Looking at this, on about 21 seconds, you can see that Carney Chukwuemeka thinks it's a dodgy challenge, and whoever the Chelsea player next to him is in yellow absolutely gives the game away!

 

[stewiek2]

I rewatched the full 108 minutes earlier.

McGinn was very very good. Did alot of that work that goes unnoticed. When I watched the game live I thought we gave the ball away too much and were weak in midfield. Rewatching, we were the opposite. Very controlled l.

Konsa was more vocal and organising, doing the Mings role.

Luiz and Kamara back to their best, after Kamara's sporadic start to the season.

Rewatching it, I thought we were great. They only really had one tactic, long balls over Digne and Cash. We controlled the ball. In a way it was similar to the Palace game, where we were much better first half without scoring. They were on top first ten of second half but the sending off stopped that.

Deserved three points.

Edited September 26, 2023 by stewiek2

[Marka Ragnos]

I usually find the digs at Sterling on his running style -- I mean, it's not a "style," per se, it's a physiological fact -- kind of puerile and weird.

What about his athleticism? I was so impressed by him. He's kind of an interesting figure, who has been around the sport for a few years now and had his ups and downs. Another player like Bailey with a powerful life story connected to Kingston.

He was a real pest last weekend, and if anyone seemed like they would have a hand in ruining our win, it was Sterling. What an incredible athlete! It's funny with all that expensive talent assembled, it was the "old" veteran (I mean, he's just 28) who carried his club's hopes. Glad we managed to hold him off.

Edited September 25, 2023 by Marka Ragnos

[AstonMartyn88]

Life comes at you fast (the third video is particularly schaudenfreudy): 

 

 

[TRO]

On 25/09/2023 at 18:06, CVByrne said:

They had a few chances and they were close in terms of offside too. So if they scored from one of those chances it still had to go through a VAR check. Sterling chance the one that looked offside to me. 

We had them offside 10 times. They only had 1.4xg so we limited them in terms of chances. 

We need to accept the high line gets breached and that's how the system goes. It gives us offsides and easy turnover of possession with them. Which is a way we control games. We also draw lots of fouls which also allows us control the game.

What this does is gives us more possession and with it more chances to create goals for ourselves. The whole system is linked. We are creating a lot of chances in games because we have more control of them.

The whole defensive approach we had last season is not how we play now. 

I accept Unai will play a style, that he wants, but I don't have to like it. However, if he keeps winning games, I will happily shelve my doubt and embrace it.

You talk about the trade off...but may I remind you, that we have a GD of +2.....so its a matter of opinion if its that much of a benefit...Brighton Have 10.

look, 12 points from 6 games is great and I am delighted.....but I fear around the corner is " you are only as strong as your weakest link"...and that for me is our defending, and I don't mean just the back four, pressing is defending too.

I will continue to go with the flow, but I am not convinced at present, that we as solid as some seem to think.

[TRO]

On 25/09/2023 at 18:40, OutByEaster? said:

 

Looking at this, on about 21 seconds, you can see that Carney Chukwuemeka thinks it's a dodgy challenge, and whoever the Chelsea player next to him is in yellow absolutely gives the game away!

 

It does seem to register to me that so many decisions given in our favour, end up, subject to controvesy....that could of course, be a coincidence, hmmmm

I also seem to remember one of our players being punished, not so long ago ( can't remember the game)when our player actually touched the ball first, but they said he was being punished, because it was a reckless challenge. The speed of the game has inevitably brought with it more subjectivity....but I feel sure, if that was the other way around, our player would have walked too.

It does seem uncanny, when we beat a traditional top team.....they work the oracle to find some sort of mitigation.

[TRO]

On 25/09/2023 at 19:47, stewiek2 said:

I rewatched the full 108 minutes earlier.

McGinn was very very good. Did alot of that work that goes unnoticed. When I watched the game live I thought we gave the ball away too much and were weak in midfield. Rewatching, we were the opposite. Very controlled l.

Konsa was more vocal and organising, doing the Mings role.

Luiz and Kamara back to their best, after Kamara's sporadic start to the season.

Rewatching it, I thought we were great. They only really had one tactic, long balls over Digne and Cash. We controlled the ball. In a way it was similar to the Palace game, where we were much better first half without scoring. They were on top first ten of second half but the sending off stopped that.

Deserved three points.

That has become a common tactic against us....the better teams make it count.....you only need one tactic in a game, if it works.

Man U ( carabao cup) last season, Liverpool, Newcastle, have all had success with breaching it.

We are working so hard to carve out openings, and score credible goals.....opponents are breaching us with the ease of peeling a Banana.

I hear the cries of the offside trap as a moat around our castle.....its ok while we are winning, long may that continue.

 

[TRO]

I thought Gareth ( tactics expert) on Villa park podcast did a good roundup on the Chelsea game the other night, billed talking tactics....well worth a watch.

Edited September 27, 2023 by TRO