lexicon Posted August 4, 2022 Share Posted August 4, 2022 57 minutes ago, JAMAICAN-VILLAN said: It's a good and valid question. However in the same breath we could ask, would we have had a chance in hell of getting Coutinho, Carlos, or Kamara if it wasn't for SG? Would we have gotten Ollie or Buendia without Smith? McGinn without Bruce? There are both positives and negatives to having " relationships ". For the most part it's a good thing having a good relationship with people you're employing and/trusting with your " life " People getting a " boost " due to knowing someone has been a thing from the beginning of time and will always be a thing. I'm sure Purslow has relationships with other Managers he would never consider bringing here also. We need to give the bloke the benefit of the doubt in a sense as he is no fool. Doesn't mean he won't get some things wrong, but I can't foresee him intentionally doing anything to the detriment of Aston Villa and to himself as a byproduct. Mourinho for example has signed Matic something like 3 times aint he? Would be easy for someone to say there are much better CM's he could sign, and is only signing Matic as he's his mate etc, but it's obs because he both trusts him AND feels he can do the job. Of course - I don't think there's anyone who'd argue that Gerrard isn't a pull for players and has enabled us to sign players who we might not have done otherwise. @TRO too as this relates to your point as well. Relationships in business and life are, of course important too - no argument from me. I've had plenty of work and got jobs because of people I know, same as most people on the planet. Just because I think Gerrard would've been lower on the list doesn't mean that I think he was 100% unqualified for the job and Purslow's just hired his mate, I'm not saying that, but that relationship definitely played a big part. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VillaChris Posted August 4, 2022 Share Posted August 4, 2022 7 hours ago, Vive_La_Villa said: Gerrard and Smiths 14th. We were 9-10th after beating Everton away I think. Then came back after that break and blew 3-1 Leeds lead and lost to Watford and Newcastle. Then won at Leeds in early March and again were pretty much top half. We could've easily finished higher than 14th but last two months of season were very poor really bar a good win at Burnley who were in excellent form at the time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VillaChris Posted August 4, 2022 Share Posted August 4, 2022 I think biggest problem for DS last year is it just never looked convincing post Grealish. We had that poor run of form as soon as he got injured otherwise I think we could've well finished 6th or 7th. Then bar a nice win at Old Trafford our results were pretty mediocre at start of season before hitting the five game losing streak. Stuff like switching suddenly to 3-5-2 just to shoehorn Ings and Watkins in when he's always been a 4-2-3-1 manager hint at him not being able to adapt after losing our best player so I do think he hit his ceiling here. Gerrard has already made the same mistakes though and results remained largely indifferent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mantis Posted August 4, 2022 Share Posted August 4, 2022 3 minutes ago, ciggiesnbeer said: Nah no chance. But I think Deano would have taken us down. Or had us in a full blown relegation battle at least. Gerrard's initial remit was to come in and keep us out of danger and he did that. Obviously whether he can push us on further is another matter, but I really do think a lot on here overrate Smith (and I say this as somebody who recognises that he was our best manager of the 21st century so far). 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vive_La_Villa Posted August 4, 2022 Share Posted August 4, 2022 (edited) 6 minutes ago, VillaChris said: We were 9-10th after beating Everton away I think. Then came back after that break and blew 3-1 Leeds lead and lost to Watford and Newcastle. Then won at Leeds in early March and again were pretty much top half. We could've easily finished higher than 14th but last two months of season were very poor really bar a good win at Burnley who were in excellent form at the time. Yes but the 14th was still over a season so it wasn’t Gerrard 14th as you put it. Wherever we finish next season will be all his. Edited August 4, 2022 by Vive_La_Villa 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AntrimBlack Posted August 4, 2022 Share Posted August 4, 2022 15 minutes ago, lexicon said: Of course - I don't think there's anyone who'd argue that Gerrard isn't a pull for players and has enabled us to sign players who we might not have done otherwise. @TRO too as this relates to your point as well. Relationships in business and life are, of course important too - no argument from me. I've had plenty of work and got jobs because of people I know, same as most people on the planet. Just because I think Gerrard would've been lower on the list doesn't mean that I think he was 100% unqualified for the job and Purslow's just hired his mate, I'm not saying that, but that relationship definitely played a big part. There are two sides to it, of course. Purslow may have hired Gerrard because of their relationship, but Gerrard equally may have decided to join us because of his relationship with Purslow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lexicon Posted August 4, 2022 Share Posted August 4, 2022 3 minutes ago, AntrimBlack said: There are two sides to it, of course. Purslow may have hired Gerrard because of their relationship, but Gerrard equally may have decided to join us because of his relationship with Purslow. I'm 100% sure Gerrard would've jumped at the chance of getting this job regardless of Purslow - Gerrard wasn't a coup for us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Condimentalist Posted August 4, 2022 Share Posted August 4, 2022 10 minutes ago, Mantis said: Or had us in a full blown relegation battle at least. Gerrard's initial remit was to come in and keep us out of danger and he did that. Obviously whether he can push us on further is another matter, but I really do think a lot on here overrate Smith (and I say this as somebody who recognises that he was our best manager of the 21st century so far). I don't think we can really say what would have happened if he'd stayed on. There were a lot of external factors as to why we started poorly last year and most of them not his fault. Pre season was a total mess for so many reasons. Some of those issues (player fitness, coaching time, new players bedding in) should have improved as we moved forward and I don't think it's unreasonable to think that he would have turned things around - I personally believe he would and that he deserved more rope - but I can see why others might think otherwise. In the end Gerrard came in and has been a real mixed bag but unlike Deano he's now had a fabulous pre-season in terms of landing targets early and having a full pre-season with the players. I question some of Gerrard's decision making but I'm cautiously optimistic that, if we can start well and get some momentum then we can go on to have a good season (top 8). For sure there are no excuses now. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted August 4, 2022 Share Posted August 4, 2022 2 minutes ago, lexicon said: I'm 100% sure Gerrard would've jumped at the chance of getting this job regardless of Purslow - Gerrard wasn't a coup for us. In fairness he had turned down Newcastle a few weeks before. I imagine he knew we wereabout to dump Smith and waited 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vive_La_Villa Posted August 4, 2022 Share Posted August 4, 2022 7 minutes ago, Zatman said: In fairness he had turned down Newcastle a few weeks before. I imagine he knew we wereabout to dump Smith and waited Turned down Newcastle with Saudi war chest ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted August 4, 2022 Share Posted August 4, 2022 2 minutes ago, Vive_La_Villa said: Turned down Newcastle with Saudi war chest ? Pretty sure he said he wanted to move closer to Liverpool was one of the reasons he rejected it 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tomaszk Posted August 4, 2022 Share Posted August 4, 2022 3 hours ago, Zatman said: Pretty sure he said he wanted to move closer to Liverpool was one of the reasons he rejected it What! Gerrard? Didn't know that. Sliding doors. He wouldn't have fitted in well there as they probably wouldn't have let him change the transfer policy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jas10 Posted August 5, 2022 Share Posted August 5, 2022 4 hours ago, DCJonah said: People forget the issues we had in pre season and the start of that season. No one can say for sure but I don’t think we would’ve ended up in severe trouble, there just seemed to be a lot of pressure on us to do better than the previous season too. That really raised expectations! With time and inured players returning and new ones being integrated… things would have improved somewhat… You’re completely correct about the issues we had and we had probably the worst Covid “outbreaks” within PL squads on more than one occasion. Beforehand too, lasting effects… Preseason was an absolute disaster and I didn’t get a feel that anyone at the club was taking it seriously enough. Seemed quite unprofessional despite the disruptions and the JG saga. Too many missing/injured players and we had to integrate new players and change our ways from relying on one player so heavily beforehand. Embarrassing how “off it” we were in that first game vs Watford… should never have happened… The appointments of Danks and McPhee seemed detrimental and I doubt Dean had much to do with that. It is something that still irks me… really not keen on these guys…or the appointments… CP responsible? O’Kelly and JT left quite suddenly… Dean was left in a fair bit of limbo really… But I think Dean shot himself in the foot with forcing us to play with 5 defenders (undoing much of the previous good work) just to accommodate Ings. That bleeding formation, relying on Cash and Targett to create Personally, I miss how entertaining we were at times under Deano and how we used to “attack” the “big teams” and be aggressive. We don’t press like that anymore and lack that intensity/tenacity… I have fond memories of the Covid/lockdown season and refuse to forget the 7-2 thrashing of Liverpool . It doesn’t get enough notice, attention or coverage. What an amazing experience. We really put in some excellent performances and got some great results against “top sides”. That season is why I will remain a fan of Traore too, he provided many of the highlights for me… Anyway, that’s all in the past and I just hope to see us improve and do well this season… SG has had his preseason and got to bring his own players in (hopefully one or two more yet). Really hope we can be an exciting and entertaining team and be a “danger” or “disruptor” this time… previous season was poor, no getting around that…. Hoping for much, much better and I’m trying to be positive and optimistic. We have such a good squad, need to get a lot more/better out of these players. I can’t lie though, so far I have greater doubts over the management and coaching team than I do over the players. I hope they can win us sceptics over… it’s in all our best interests… 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jas10 Posted August 5, 2022 Share Posted August 5, 2022 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
briny_ear Posted August 5, 2022 Share Posted August 5, 2022 22 hours ago, Vive_La_Villa said: Gerrard and Smiths 14th. To deconstruct a little, Smith’s 16th, Gerrard’s 9th 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted August 5, 2022 Share Posted August 5, 2022 1 minute ago, briny_ear said: To deconstruct a little, Smith’s 16th, Gerrard’s 9th One managed 11 games and One managed 27 games Both got us 14th 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
briny_ear Posted August 5, 2022 Share Posted August 5, 2022 (edited) 7 minutes ago, Zatman said: One managed 11 games and One managed 27 games Both got us 14th Well I suppose that is a step forward from the earlier description of “Gerrard’s 14th”. Edited August 5, 2022 by briny_ear Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted August 5, 2022 Share Posted August 5, 2022 10 minutes ago, briny_ear said: Well I suppose that is a step forward from the earlier description of “Gerrard’s 14th”. Still no defence for him ending us 14th when we were within touching distance of top 8 in March Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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Anything11 Posted August 5, 2022 Share Posted August 5, 2022 (edited) 24 minutes ago, Zatman said: Still no defence for him ending us 14th when we were within touching distance of top 8 in March We were only within touching distance because of him. Your point stinks. Edited August 5, 2022 by Anything11 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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