Dean Smith

[Tomaszk]

No interest in replacing him with Terry. None at all.

[tomav84]

7 minutes ago, Tomaszk said:

No interest in replacing him with Terry. None at all.

same. but i fear were smith to go he'd be in the frame with these owners

[smg]

Smith out ? Saw a number of posts last week saying Potter was the answer well he royally f****d up today but if you want him go ahead. Brighton fans probably saying he has reached his ceiling, taken them as far as he can…………

 

while typing this the Terry idea appeared, if our owners go with that one we have sadly misjudged them. I don’t think (hope) they are not that daft.

[Peter Griffin]

30 minutes ago, tomav84 said:

same. but i fear were smith to go he'd be in the frame with these owners

I really don't think JT would be in the frame. I am not sure why, just a gut feel. I think we will be very considered with our next manager whenever that time arrives and I think it may somewhat surprise us. CP got it right sacking Bruce. CP got it right in getting Smith in as manager, I would have some confidence in him to get it right with Smith's replacement. 

Edited October 23, 2021 by Peter Griffin

[Peter Griffin]

1 minute ago, smg said:

Smith out ? Saw a number of posts last week saying Potter was the answer well he royally f****d up today but if you want him go ahead. Brighton fans probably saying he has reached his ceiling, taken them as far as he can…………

 

while typing this the Terry idea appeared, if our owners go with that one we have sadly misjudged them. I don’t think (hope) they are not that daft.

Potter didn't royally **** up today. It wasn't a good result but as many of the Smith protagonists say, have some perspective. They were playing Man City. I am not saying we should sack Smith and get Potter in as manager I am just trying to be realistic and honest about what is happening to us and what other managers are doing

[Peter Griffin]

Nick, 

Reading through your posts. You find a reason to say why Dean isn't at fault for absolutely everything. It is clearly not the case. He is not the Messiah, he is human and he is still learning the job. It would be naive to expect him not to be at fault for some of the things that are not going right. You lose all credibility when you find an excuse for everything 

[HanoiVillan]

15 hours ago, TrentVilla said:

It isn’t a couple of games it is a quarter of the season and I think it shows just how badly we have started, it isn’t like we’ve been unlucky.

We could be 15th by the end of the games this weekend.

Obviously it doesn’t necessarily follow we will continue as badly, although looking at our fixtures to come it easily could. I do though think a lot of people will be surprised at the stat because many don’t seem to think we have been that bad.

This point about where we were at the end of gameweek 9 in 19/20 is true, but it's a bit of a statistical quirk. That gameweek saw our highest position of the whole season (12th) and we then went on to win only 4 more games between the end of that gameweek and gameweek 35.

[nick76]

51 minutes ago, tomav84 said:

same. but i fear were smith to go he'd be in the frame with these owners

I know Thierry was before but I think the owners are a bit further down the line now and JT wouldn’t be in the frame now.

[sheepyvillian]

1 hour ago, Tomaszk said:

No interest in replacing him with Terry. None at all.

There's a reason why he hasn't had a manager's job yet.

[Peter Griffin]

11 minutes ago, smg said:

What other managers do you suggest then ?

All I did contradict your comment that Potter royally fcuked up today. I have not said we should sack Smith and nor have I said we should appoint Potter. People are just discussing Smith and different potential managers. The reason they are doing this is because we are playing crap these days and Smith is looking like he can't fix it. Potter and Smith are both good. Just because Brighton lost to Man City doesn't mean Potter fcuked up. 

[Tomaszk]

Just now, sheepyvillian said:

There's a reason why he hasn't had a manager's job yet.

Well, he might be brilliant, I don't know.

But I wouldn't want to take the gamble, and I'd be surprised if he's a big upgrade on Smith, which is all I'm after to be honest. Otherwise I think we stick with Deano. We don't want anything silly like an accidental relegation battle cropping up.

His only job inside top level football has been under Dean Smith so I'm not sure what added ideas he could bring. 

[nick76]

2 minutes ago, Tomaszk said:

Well, he might be brilliant, I don't know.

But I wouldn't want to take the gamble, and I'd be surprised if he's a big upgrade on Smith, which is all I'm after to be honest. Otherwise I think we stick with Deano. We don't want anything silly like an accidental relegation battle cropping up.

His only job inside top level football has been under Dean Smith so I'm not sure what added ideas he could bring. 

Isn’t he on a learning trip where he’s learning from different clubs before he looks to move into management anyway.  I remember (I think) he said that’s what he was going to do this year to broaden his knowledge. Still wouldn’t want us to consider him although I don’t think Smith is going anyway

Edited October 23, 2021 by nick76

[Tomaszk]

Experience as a top level player ≠ success/ability as a top level manager.

Giving Terry the job is putting some big faith that his ability as a player transfers to management. History would show it's an incredibly mixed bag.

I don't think he's equipped to be honest. We want a head coach. Mark Delaney is more qualified. Aaron Danks is more qualified.

[VillaChris]

Terry would be a strange old move. I mean if he really thought we'd struggle he'd have hung around. For him to leave and not get a job and us offer him it would be a bit illogical as surely he's got to at least try something in championship as Lampard did for one season.

If something happens in next few weeks then Shakespeare would be put in charge for a few weeks while we shop around. He actually did o.k at Leicester when they put him in after Ranieri left (less so when he got it permanently) so I imagine we'd pick up the odd win to keep mid table.

It's important if we let DS go we have exactly in our mind who we want as too many times in the past we've sacked a manager and then been scrambling around with little idea who to get in.

For example when we appointed Remi Garde I'm pretty sure we were looking at Christophe Gaultier first but he didn't want to leave the French club he was at. When we sacked Di Matteo I heard we wanted Dyche or David Wagner but timing wasn't right for either so Bruce got it.

[nick76]

4 minutes ago, VillaChris said:

Terry would be a strange old move. I mean if he really thought we'd struggle he'd have hung around. For him to leave and not get a job and us offer him it would be a bit illogical as surely he's got to at least try something in championship as Lampard did for one season.

If something happens in next few weeks then Shakespeare would be put in charge for a few weeks while we shop around. He actually did o.k at Leicester when they put him in after Ranieri left (less so when he got it permanently) so I imagine we'd pick up the odd win to keep mid table.

It's important if we let DS go we have exactly in our mind who we want as too many times in the past we've sacked a manager and then been scrambling around with little idea who to get in.

For example when we appointed Remi Garde I'm pretty sure we were looking at Christophe Gaultier first but he didn't want to leave the French club he was at. When we sacked Di Matteo I heard we wanted Dyche or David Wagner but timing wasn't right for either so Bruce got it.

Well Spurs got Nuno as their 6th choice and Newcastle are rumoured close to Fonseca so looks like it’s difficult to attract anybody decent and there isn’t much success rate so I wouldn’t hold your hopes if DS is punted.  Doubt it’s an issue in the near future anyway.

[Indigo]

Despite all the doom and gloom, it's been good to see some constructive discussion around us at the moment once you can pick through the drama. Nobody has to agree and our situation is complicated and thus there's no simple answers, but it feels like there's been less (though granted there still is) absolute borebags giving it their condescending, lazy "sorry I forgot I'm not allowed to criticise" line and the defensive response that comes in response to that. Sans wider social media obviously which is an utter cesspit. We'll get it right eventually anyway, however that may come. I'd love that to be with Deano but there's no doubting he's in a different kind of sticky patch at the moment where he has to prove himself again.

[OutByEaster?]

2 hours ago, Zhan_Zhuang said:

But we still hear things, it's not completely tight...

Smith was practically gone before lockdown and we were hearing it weeks before, we seem to be in a similar situation yet again.

Or Smith was never remotely under threat and the board are happy with progress on a long term project - we have no idea how the club felt about Smith before lockdown, no matter how many times we repeat whatever a bloke on twitter said.

There are rumours for everything, you're picking the ones you like and running with them.

Every Premier league manager is maybe six games from the sack - that's the nature of the job. Every person that says a manager will go will be right eventually; they last not much more than a season on average - but there's nothing to suggest that Dean Smith is on the verge of being relieved of his duties - if he loses the next three I'm sure he'll be worried, but today? Or after the West Ham game? No. 

The combination of the Wolves collapse which came with a huge emotional hit, and the first half no show against Arsenal has got elements of the fanbase is in a terrible state. After the Wolves game, Villa fans called for leadership, for courage, for calm heads, for character and for grit - then almost immediately cried that the manager needed to go, the captain should be dropped, the record signing was shit, we should dump last season's top scorer and the formation should be changed as we were clearly on a death slide to relegation. If the fans were a 20's movie starlet, a man in a bow tie would have shaken our shoulders and slapped us by now.

It's nonsense. No one else in the football world, or in so far as I can see at the football club, sees this as an earth shattering crisis - we've had a run of three defeats, a couple of which have come with painful passages of play. It's not good and it needs to be addressed by the manager - but sacking him, at this point? We'd be a laughing stock.

 

 

[bose]

6 minutes ago, OutByEaster? said:

Or Smith was never remotely under threat and the board are happy with progress on a long term project - we have no idea how the club felt about Smith before lockdown, no matter how many times we repeat whatever a bloke on twitter said.

There are rumours for everything, you're picking the ones you like and running with them.

Every Premier league manager is maybe six games from the sack - that's the nature of the job. Every person that says a manager will go will be right eventually; they last not much more than a season on average - but there's nothing to suggest that Dean Smith is on the verge of being relieved of his duties - if he loses the next three I'm sure he'll be worried, but today? Or after the West Ham game? No. 

The combination of the Wolves collapse which came with a huge emotional hit, and the first half no show against Arsenal has got elements of the fanbase is in a terrible state. After the Wolves game, Villa fans called for leadership, for courage, for calm heads, for character and for grit - then almost immediately cried that the manager needed to go, the captain should be dropped, the record signing was shit, we should dump last season's top scorer and the formation should be changed as we were clearly on a death slide to relegation. If the fans were a 20's movie starlet, a man in a bow tie would have shaken our shoulders and slapped us by now.

It's nonsense. No one else in the football world, or in so far as I can see at the football club, sees this as an earth shattering crisis - we've had a run of three defeats, a couple of which have come with painful passages of play. It's not good and it needs to be addressed by the manager - but sacking him, at this point? We'd be a laughing stock.

 

 

Fans are discussing whether Smith has hit his ceiling and should go, Buendia has been for the most part poor (albeit being played out of position, but again that’s on the manager), Watkins again looks like a completely different player from last season and changing the formation is now nonsense? 

Perfectly reasonable discussions and conclusions. Just the body language from the start against Arsenal was off as well, I think there is much more going on behind the scenes.

[Peter Griffin]

7 minutes ago, OutByEaster? said:

Or Smith was never remotely under threat and the board are happy with progress on a long term project - we have no idea how the club felt about Smith before lockdown, no matter how many times we repeat whatever a bloke on twitter said.

There are rumours for everything, you're picking the ones you like and running with them.

Every Premier league manager is maybe six games from the sack - that's the nature of the job. Every person that says a manager will go will be right eventually; they last not much more than a season on average - but there's nothing to suggest that Dean Smith is on the verge of being relieved of his duties - if he loses the next three I'm sure he'll be worried, but today? Or after the West Ham game? No. 

The combination of the Wolves collapse which came with a huge emotional hit, and the first half no show against Arsenal has got elements of the fanbase is in a terrible state. After the Wolves game, Villa fans called for leadership, for courage, for calm heads, for character and for grit - then almost immediately cried that the manager needed to go, the captain should be dropped, the record signing was shit, we should dump last season's top scorer and the formation should be changed as we were clearly on a death slide to relegation. If the fans were a 20's movie starlet, a man in a bow tie would have shaken our shoulders and slapped us by now.

It's nonsense. No one else in the football world, or in so far as I can see at the football club, sees this as an earth shattering crisis - we've had a run of three defeats, a couple of which have come with painful passages of play. It's not good and it needs to be addressed by the manager - but sacking him, at this point? We'd be a laughing stock.

 

 

I agree with a lot of what u say but nobody, at least on VT, is saying it is an earth shattering crisis. You said yourself, 'every Premier League manager is maybe 6 games from the sack', Smith has lost the last 3. That would suggest the next 3 are very important for him. We are not only not playing well, we are playing we no cohesion. Smith needs to fix this ASAP or the nightmare scenario of having to replace our manager mid season will come true

[HanoiVillan]

FWIW if we lose the mext three I would expect he will be sacked, not least because we will probably be in the bottom 3 at that point.