Tomaszk Posted July 1, 2020 Share Posted July 1, 2020 (edited) 14 minutes ago, VillaChris said: Yes Brentford have nice model but they still don't forget to sign experience in key areas, 29 year old Pontus Jansson for instance. Oldest CB we signed was Mings at 26 and we know it's an area where you need one older head at least to calm things down. They know what they're doing everywhere yes. This year was however the first time ever they've decided to spend some serious money. They deserve success. Their signings of Jansson, Pinnock and Norgaard, has formed their new core of CB CB and DM. They were 28, 26 and 25. EDIT: Just to say as well, if we didn't go up we needed these three positions. What are the chances we'd have ended up with three players this good for £12m? Absolutely **** zero with Suso at the helm. Edited July 1, 2020 by Tomaszk 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VillaChris Posted July 1, 2020 Share Posted July 1, 2020 I think that's the thing people are missing with the club policy. When I say I want an experienced head or two I don't meant I suddenly want to fill the 11 with loads of over 30s as SB was doing at start of 17/18 signing likes of Whelan and John Terry to add to the ones we already had. A very short term approach and we were proper in the s*** after losing the play off final even without the financial implosion. Just get an experienced head at CB and at defensive midfield as those are two critical positions an we did that at championship level. Bizarre the club pretty much refused that bar leaking to the media we had Gary Cahill sort of under consideration but how serious that interest was we'll never know unless the player speaks about it. There's loads of those types of players playing in Germany, Italy and Spain. I genuinely thought this would be the market we'd be in last summer considering Suso was here, picking up decent squad players from likes of Valencia for instance or Atletico Madrid (Wolves signed Jonny and Diogo Jota from them). Needs to change and it will change next year but then needs to stay if we're straight back up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VillaChris Posted July 1, 2020 Share Posted July 1, 2020 3 hours ago, KenjiOgiwara said: He really really isn't. We spent around £ 127 million and while I have no idea which players he actually brought to the table, I think it's safe to say he did a poor job. Even though Wes Edens interview from a few months back basically gave a ringing endorsement of our transfer strategy last summer? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KenjiOgiwara Posted July 1, 2020 Share Posted July 1, 2020 2 minutes ago, VillaChris said: Even though Wes Edens interview from a few months back basically gave a ringing endorsement of our transfer strategy last summer? Giving endorsement to a general plan when it comes to building a new squad for limited funds is one thing. It's not like he gave an endorsement to signing dross. The quality of our scouting is something entirely different, and that's surely an area you have to put responsebility on Pitarch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
useless Posted July 1, 2020 Share Posted July 1, 2020 (edited) The quotes I saw from Edens suggested that he wasn't happy and was searching for a way to improve things... Aston Villa co-owner Wes Edens admits they'll be seeking to introduce a greater statistical approach to their transfer policy. In addition to Villa, Edens also co-owns NBA side Milwaukee Bucks and has enjoyed great success by identifying players through analytics. "You know I always tell people in our businesses great judgement, overrated, great information, underrated," Edens told interview.net. “Because truly if you have great information most of the decisions are pretty darn simple. Yeah and so I feel like in soccer they've got a long way to go in terms of analytics data. “And so I feel like there's a lot to be caught up to honestly and I believe in the end when you look there's a number of NBA owners and U.S. sports owners that have done tremendously well (in football). “You have Stan Kroenke at Arsenal, John Henry at Liverpool. Obviously they've got tremendous teams though and I've talked to both of them and others about their experiences. And I think that there are a lot more similarities than differences but there are some big differences for sure." Edens continued: “It's not merely the data but I do think the foundation of it should be data driven and I think that that's where we talk about underdogs and what not. “It's just that I have this very high motor to try to see things for what they are and that's what the data allows you to do if you just apply it properly. “But then you need good judgement at the end of course. But you know if it's balanced by this underpinning of data and information you're just likely to make much better decisions." Tribal Footall Edited July 1, 2020 by useless The very fact that we're reviewing our transfer policy shows that the owners aren't happy with it 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VillaChris Posted July 1, 2020 Share Posted July 1, 2020 Bigging up Arsenal transfer policy is reason enough to worry I think! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VillaChris Posted July 1, 2020 Share Posted July 1, 2020 1 hour ago, KenjiOgiwara said: Giving endorsement to a general plan when it comes to building a new squad for limited funds is one thing. It's not like he gave an endorsement to signing dross. The quality of our scouting is something entirely different, and that's surely an area you have to put responsebility on Pitarch. Given Suso's jobs before joining us I simply can't believe he didn't have a few targets at Valencia/Atletico Madrid lined up. I guess one problem was Purslow admitting in an interview due to FFP restrictions we simply can't pay out on wages like even a Brighton does so that will likely remain a problem even if we stay up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sharkyvilla Posted July 1, 2020 Share Posted July 1, 2020 Personally I don't see much point in ripping everything up and start again. The problem imo was the squad that got promoted and the sheer number of players that needed replacing in one window and that was a problem that Suso and Dean inherited. Could it have gone better, yes of course but I don't think it's as disastrous as being worth sacking either of them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Delphinho123 Posted July 1, 2020 Share Posted July 1, 2020 1 minute ago, sharkyvilla said: Personally I don't see much point in ripping everything up and start again. The problem imo was the squad that got promoted and the sheer number of players that needed replacing in one window and that was a problem that Suso and Dean inherited. Could it have gone better, yes of course but I don't think it's as disastrous as being worth sacking either of them. It absolutely is and I'm sure if it was your money you'd be asking serious questions. Agreed that we needed a lot of players and yes, not all of those players were going to be a success but to be in a position where so many of our signings have failed and haemorrhaged value is a disgrace. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AvfcTheObsession Posted July 1, 2020 Share Posted July 1, 2020 2 hours ago, Tomaszk said: They know what they're doing everywhere yes. This year was however the first time ever they've decided to spend some serious money. They deserve success. Their signings of Jansson, Pinnock and Norgaard, has formed their new core of CB CB and DM. They were 28, 26 and 25. EDIT: Just to say as well, if we didn't go up we needed these three positions. What are the chances we'd have ended up with three players this good for £12m? Absolutely **** zero with Suso at the helm. I've seen this myth a couple of times now. They did no different to any other year, sold star players (Konsa this time, previously Jota, Hogan, etc) and brought in a number of gems from abroad, and still ended up with a negative net spend. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
useless Posted July 1, 2020 Share Posted July 1, 2020 I don't think we're going rip everything up for the simple reason I'm not sure if there's much to rip up, at the moment I think it's pretty much just Suso and his contacts with agents and scouts, to be honest I think Suso was always meant to be more of a stopgap appointment, but when we came up quicker than expected that method was given more time than it might have otherwise been given, in a if it's not broke why fix it kind of way. I think we need someone coming in that's more than good at spotting players, but who can pretty much run all aspects of the footballing side of things and give the club a proper vision and a sense of directions, in other words a genuine DoF. We probably need more than a DoF to turn things around, but whoever the DoF happens to be will decide that and then make the necessary appointments. If we just part ways with Pitarch and replace him with someone with the only expectation being that be finds better players then I don't think that will work. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tomaszk Posted July 1, 2020 Share Posted July 1, 2020 21 minutes ago, AvfcTheObsession said: I've seen this myth a couple of times now. They did no different to any other year, sold star players (Konsa this time, previously Jota, Hogan, etc) and brought in a number of gems from abroad, and still ended up with a negative net spend. Myth? How have you come to that conclusion? Because you disagree? Are you saying this to try and reaffirm criticism of Smith out of interest? Just wondering. Outgoings on transfers for Brentford: 2016/17 £4.63m 2017/18 £5.4m 2018/19 £5.9m 2019/20 Over £31.5m Not a myth I'm afraid. Very much fact. This is the year they've gone for it. They didn't buy gems who could develop, the bought gems ready to go right into the team. Want to know when they signed their seven most expensive players ever? The summer of 2019. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dubbs Posted July 1, 2020 Share Posted July 1, 2020 2 hours ago, VillaChris said: Bigging up Arsenal transfer policy is reason enough to worry I think! Also mentioned liverpool's policy so I wouldn't worry too much. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tomaszk Posted July 1, 2020 Share Posted July 1, 2020 1 minute ago, dubbs said: Also mentioned liverpool's policy so I wouldn't worry too much. It really is all or nothing! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dubbs Posted July 1, 2020 Share Posted July 1, 2020 15 minutes ago, Tomaszk said: It really is all or nothing! My glass is currently half full! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikeyp102 Posted July 1, 2020 Share Posted July 1, 2020 7 hours ago, thabucks said: Hopefully they can persuade Michael Emenalo to join or Dan Ashworth but it is going to be difficult as a championship club to attract them. Wasn’t Ashworth’s main highlights the way he got the youth academy bringing through players ? We’ve taken the academy director from Albion already. Is he renowned for Scouting and transfers? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villalad21 Posted July 1, 2020 Share Posted July 1, 2020 (edited) The likes of Mings, Konsa, Engels, Jota, El Ghazi and Hause i'm pretty sure are all Smith signings. Possibly Targett as well Suso at fault for most of them not being good enough as well? They are all at fault in why we've failed this season. Exclusively placing the blame on Suso is too simple. Edited July 1, 2020 by villalad21 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VillaChris Posted July 1, 2020 Share Posted July 1, 2020 48 minutes ago, dubbs said: Also mentioned liverpool's policy so I wouldn't worry too much. Depends if it's the 2012-14 policy of Fabio Borini, Lazar Markovic, Lovren, Rickie Lambert and Mario Balotelli or the more recent one! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted July 1, 2020 Share Posted July 1, 2020 16 minutes ago, villalad21 said: The likes of Mings, Konsa, Engels, Jota, El Ghazi and Hause i'm pretty sure are all Smith signings. Possibly Targett as well Suso at fault for most of them not being good enough as well? They have all fault at why we've failed this season. Exclusively placing the blame on Suso is too simple. Maybe you should tell the club this since they are investigating him Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villalad21 Posted July 1, 2020 Share Posted July 1, 2020 1 minute ago, Zatman said: Maybe you should tell the club this since they are investigating him You make it sound like he is a criminal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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