Anwar El Ghazi

[Rightdm00]

7 hours ago, sidcow said:

Yes, it's not even about goals and assists.  He's a player who can deliver that but for much of the time, he's running into defenders or allowing attacks to break down in other ways.  Quiet for large periods of most games. 

I would rather a winger who scores a couple less goals but who is a pain in the arse for defenders, relentlessly running down the wings, taking players on and going round them. 

What we are talking about is the whole demeanour of the team, how it affects our general attacking play all round. 

As I said in the match thread I am totally sick of all these posts about El Ghazi haters, negative naysayers etc.

Why are people not allowed a middle ground in this?  It's always WHERE ARE THE HATERS NOW? 

It's perfectly OK to not be so keen on a player without hating him. To question a players worth to the team without giving him dogs abuse. 

I'm delighted for him and happy he's adding to his goal tally and hopefully his price tag. 

Our wingers are generally an issue.  We will need better if we are to progress.  One way to do this would be to sell Elghazi and/or Trezeguet and use those funds plus a few more million to buy another winger who can score those 7 - 8 goals, get a few assists AND terrorise defenders helping us to pour forward from all areas of the pitch. 

But he's also shown he can be a decent squad player.  I'm torn about which one but him or Trez need upgrading, and next year we'll be having the same discussions about Traore if we want to step up again. 

How can it not be about goals and assist though. From an offensive perspective that's the only thing the front 3 is there for. An attack that doesn't generate goals and assist is not a good attack no matter how many times they dribble past their marker.  

Currently El Ghazi has the best strike rate on the team per 90.  If we are to kick on up the table we need bench options like him going forward, especially on the LW if Jack is going to continue having issues. 

[MaVilla]

5 minutes ago, Rightdm00 said:

How can it not be about goals and assist though. From an offensive perspective that's the only thing the front 3 is there for. An attack that doesn't generate goals and assist is not a good attack no matter how many times they dribble past their marker.  

Currently El Ghazi has the best strike rate on the team per 90.  If we are to kick on up the table we need bench options like him going forward, especially on the LW if Jack is going to continue having issues. 

 

7 hours ago, sidcow said:

Yes, it's not even about goals and assists.  He's a player who can deliver that but for much of the time, he's running into defenders or allowing attacks to break down in other ways.  Quiet for large periods of most games. 

I would rather a winger who scores a couple less goals but who is a pain in the arse for defenders, relentlessly running down the wings, taking players on and going round them. 

What we are talking about is the whole demeanour of the team, how it affects our general attacking play all round. 

As I said in the match thread I am totally sick of all these posts about El Ghazi haters, negative naysayers etc.

Why are people not allowed a middle ground in this?  It's always WHERE ARE THE HATERS NOW? 

It's perfectly OK to not be so keen on a player without hating him. To question a players worth to the team without giving him dogs abuse. 

I'm delighted for him and happy he's adding to his goal tally and hopefully his price tag. 

Our wingers are generally an issue.  We will need better if we are to progress.  One way to do this would be to sell Elghazi and/or Trezeguet and use those funds plus a few more million to buy another winger who can score those 7 - 8 goals, get a few assists AND terrorise defenders helping us to pour forward from all areas of the pitch. 

But he's also shown he can be a decent squad player.  I'm torn about which one but him or Trez need upgrading, and next year we'll be having the same discussions about Traore if we want to step up again. 

i agree with Sidcow, yes Ghazi comes up with some belters etc, but his overall play is really poor.

We need a player who scores the odd belter AND offers something for the other 89 minutes.

Hopefully this summer we can purchase 2-3 players to take us to the next level.

[sidcow]

8 minutes ago, Rightdm00 said:

How can it not be about goals and assist though. From an offensive perspective that's the only thing the front 3 is there for. An attack that doesn't generate goals and assist is not a good attack no matter how many times they dribble past their marker.  

Currently El Ghazi has the best strike rate on the team per 90.  If we are to kick on up the table we need bench options like him going forward, especially on the LW if Jack is going to continue having issues. 

Because attacks break down a lot with Anwar (and Trezeguet) 

Maybe with wingers who don't lose the ball so much and keep the move flowing forwards Ollie would have 25 goals by now? And our midfielders would have scored more? 

I just feel that for all the great goals we lose a lot of momentum for too much of the game otherwise. 

[fruitvilla]

3 hours ago, sidcow said:

Because attacks break down a lot with Anwar (and Trezeguet) 

Quick question. What counts as a successful attack?

A shot?
A shot into the keeper's arms?
Off the woodwork?
A goal?

I wonder what percentage of ultimately unsuccessful (however they are defined) attacks can be attributed to each player? 

Footballers get dispossessed of the ball a lot the time. It's not newsworthy. It's what they do with it when they hold on to the ball, is what matters. I can't help thinking El Ghazi is a great asset on or off the bench. Then there is the softer side of the sport ... exposure to northern Africa and the Arab world.

Edited May 2, 2021 by fruitvilla

[Sulberto21]

9 hours ago, sidcow said:

Yes, it's not even about goals and assists.  He's a player who can deliver that but for much of the time, he's running into defenders or allowing attacks to break down in other ways.  Quiet for large periods of most games. 

I would rather a winger who scores a couple less goals but who is a pain in the arse for defenders, relentlessly running down the wings, taking players on and going round them. 

What we are talking about is the whole demeanour of the team, how it affects our general attacking play all round. 

As I said in the match thread I am totally sick of all these posts about El Ghazi haters, negative naysayers etc.

Why are people not allowed a middle ground in this?  It's always WHERE ARE THE HATERS NOW? 

It's perfectly OK to not be so keen on a player without hating him. To question a players worth to the team without giving him dogs abuse. 

I'm delighted for him and happy he's adding to his goal tally and hopefully his price tag. 

Our wingers are generally an issue.  We will need better if we are to progress.  One way to do this would be to sell Elghazi and/or Trezeguet and use those funds plus a few more million to buy another winger who can score those 7 - 8 goals, get a few assists AND terrorise defenders helping us to pour forward from all areas of the pitch. 

But he's also shown he can be a decent squad player.  I'm torn about which one but him or Trez need upgrading, and next year we'll be having the same discussions about Traore if we want to step up again. 

So one minute it's not about goals then it is then it isn't again. Then it is then it isn't again. So confusing.

And any left winger coming in will be a bench warmer. The reason is Jack Grealish. To improve on AEG will mean we need a winger who scores in the 10-15 a season range (goals win matches) this player will cost £30m + . Find me a player who costs that much that is willing to sit on the bench.

Or we can keep AEG for another season or two and improve the biggest problem area - midfield. Possibly right wing too. Much more important for next season. 

[WallisFrizz]

55 minutes ago, fruitvilla said:

I can't help thinking El Ghazi is a great asset on or off the bench. Then there is the softer side of the sport ... exposure to northern Africa and the Arab world.

Isn’t he Dutch?

[fruitvilla]

3 minutes ago, WallisFrizz said:

Isn’t he Dutch?

He is Dutch in the same way I am Canadian.

[Dave-R]

1 hour ago, Rightdm00 said:

How can it not be about goals and assist though. From an offensive perspective that's the only thing the front 3 is there for. An attack that doesn't generate goals and assist is not a good attack no matter how many times they dribble past their marker.  

Currently El Ghazi has the best strike rate on the team per 90.  If we are to kick on up the table we need bench options like him going forward, especially on the LW if Jack is going to continue having issues. 

Wingers are mainly there to also support a striker in getting balls to him, they have to deliver, cross, pass accurately, precisely. Wingers also have to be more these days than just an attacking players, there role involves the ball all down the wing from offensive to defensive. Wingers also may have to do some midfield duty that is closer to there Winger area of play. Wingers are there to also stretch a team out and create gaps and holes, this is why Jack does it brilliantly because defenses and players fear his capabilities, none fear our other Wingers which is why they do not pull two or three players at a time.

This whole notion that a winger is just goals and assists is wrong it's an old idea that's outdated. Wingers are more than that and if you watch other teams who use Wingers who are dominant at the winger game, you will soon see where our Wingers go completely wrong. Just watch Liverpool there wingers make use of every being talked about by Sidcow.

We need better Wingers apart from Jack and the more I think of it, the more I'd press the sell button on Ghazi and Trezegeut soon as possible. Upgrades are needed whether people want it or not. I'm certainly not going to keep thinking we can keep the same wingers or players season in season out because we can't, we just won't move anywhere in this league apart from backwards. Eventually the game changes and so will a team need to be changed to adapt. Any players that can't bring an A game and are inconsistent most of the season in this Villa team need to be sold, that's the truth.

I'm sure people in this forum just want to keep our worst players till they end up in Birmingham museum. I'm not saying Ghazi is the worst he's not but he's along the lines of a player who doesn't bring the performances often enough for the club that they may push the button to find a better more consistent player in his place.

Edited May 2, 2021 by Dave-R

[Dave-R]

18 minutes ago, Sulberto21 said:

So one minute it's not about goals then it is then it isn't again. Then it is then it isn't again. So confusing.

And any left winger coming in will be a bench warmer. The reason is Jack Grealish. To improve on AEG will mean we need a winger who scores in the 10-15 a season range (goals win matches) this player will cost £30m + . Find me a player who costs that much that is willing to sit on the bench.

Or we can keep AEG for another season or two and improve the biggest problem area - midfield. Possibly right wing too. Much more important for next season. 

Well with that many it is and it isnt's I'm not surprised your confused.

[Shay]

Personally, i feel that attacking players should be judged on their attacking outputs, and for me, Anwar has definitely delivered satisfying numbers but im also not blind in a sense that i can see that his overall play has been hot and cold since he’s signed for us. I am happy to keep his as back up LW next season. I dont think the manager would sell him knowing his qualities. He is a valuable squad player i feel. Keep for at least another season. 

[Dave-R]

35 minutes ago, Shay said:

Personally, i feel that attacking players should be judged on their attacking outputs, and for me, Anwar has definitely delivered satisfying numbers but im also not blind in a sense that i can see that his overall play has been hot and cold since he’s signed for us. I am happy to keep his as back up LW next season. I dont think the manager would sell him knowing his qualities. He is a valuable squad player i feel. Keep for at least another season. 

Well last night he didn't need 20 shots a game unlike many other games he's had, yet he did still do what Ghazi does best and at close range managed to hit the bar. He has often done that Ghazi has gets near the 6 yard box let's rip and misses or hits a post or bar, last season I thought he were going for some kind of record.

Attacking Players should be judged on everything they have to do in there role. With the current system we have our Wingers should be doing more than just shooting a ball at goal and scoring.

We can't keep operating with the way we are, goals for a winger is a small piece of the pie that a winger can bring to his game. I've said alot of what a winger needs, so has Sidcow and others but one thing Ghazi particularly fails at is intercepting balls down the wing, retaining it and then making something of that ball.

One player I would like to highlight and he's not a winger and he's not Grealish is Target. Target manages to work all down the wing and he covers an awful lot of area. Target is a player who has excelled under Smith despite when he came in many were saying he wouldn't be here next season that he'd fade away. Target has improved so much in what he now offers, now you put Ghazi in that same light and the fact Ghazi has had longer at Villa than Target is the reason why we can now honestly say that Ghazi is not improving as a player. Ghazi is not going to get any better or he would of done already. Villa want to improve and it's these players who won't improve, are not good enough for what's ahead that we must sell for the good of the club and the future or Villa will end up a nothing club again, it won't be quick it will be another slow painful death and something tells me no one wants that so why even collect a load of players who are not good enough for our future.

If we can upgrade... To those against selling Ghazi or any player who is our weakest/one of our weakest, would you want those players to remain when there is an upgrade on them available? 

If the answer is yes to keeping any weaker player, I would severely question what planet are you on and do you really want this club to move on and win trophys. I think many fans are still in the old ways of the past twenty years because your so used to keeping players and getting inconsistent results and have not understood what having new Owners with ambitions mean. Times are changing and it means now we have Owners who can back serious signings and they will. We also have people in charge who will give chances but when there are weak links in the side and upgrades available in Windows then players will be moved on, you only have to look at Sammata to see what will happen eventually. The Owners want things to happen, they want to bring glory and pride back to Villa (it won't happen if we don't upgrade) and that means cutting the fat where and when it's needed. Ghazi, Trezegeut will only work for us for so much longer and as Sidcow said once we have upgraded them we will be saying that about Traore and he's right. Maybe a season or few but that times comes eventually and change will happen.

Edited May 2, 2021 by Dave-R

[thunderball]

Played his part in our recent history, scoring a few important goals, for the cost he is certainly good value and I like his attitude, he gives the impression that Villa is his club and he plays for the badge. I hope he stays as a squad player but sentiment aside we do need better for where we want to be. 

I think you need to look beyond his goal tally, a players contribution is more than just his own goals it’s being a consistent part of a teams success - it’s assists or link play that pulls opposition apart and creates for other players, he doesn’t do much of that for me. We need someone who is contributing in games in what he brings out of others. I would rather Lingard there for example.

[Shay]

6 minutes ago, Dave-R said:

Well last night he didn't need 20 shots a game unlike many other games he's had, yet he did still do what Ghazi does best and at close range managed to hit the bar. He has often done that Ghazi has gets near the 6 yard box let's rip and misses or hits a post or bar, last season I thought he were going for some kind of record.

Attacking Players should be judged on everything they have to do in there role. With the current system we have our Wingers should be doing more than just shooting a ball at goal and scoring.

We can't keep operating with the way we are, goals for a winger is a small piece of the pie that a winger can bring to his game. I've said alot of what a winger needs, so has Sidcow and others but one thing Ghazi particularly fails at is intercepting balls down the wing, retaining it and then making something of that ball.

One player I would like to highlight and he's not a winger and he's not Grealish is Target. Target manages to work all down the wing and he covers an awful lot of area. Target is a player who has excelled under Smith despite when he came in many were saying he wouldn't be here next season that he'd fade away. Target has improved so much in what he now offers, now you put Ghazi in that same light and the fact Ghazi has had longer at Villa than Target is the reason why we can now honestly say that Ghazi is not improving as a player. Ghazi is not going to get any better or he would of done already. Villa want to improve and it's these players who won't improve, are not good enough for what's ahead that we must sell for the good of the club and the future or Villa will end up a nothing club again, it won't be quick it will be another slow painful death and something tells me no one wants that so why even collect a load of players who are not good enough for our future.

If we can upgrade... To those against selling Ghazi or any player who is our weakest/one of our weakest, would you want those players to remain when there is an upgrade on them available? 

If the answer is yes to keeping Ghazi, I would severely question what planet are you on and do you really want this club to move on and win trophys. I think many fans are still in the old ways of the past twenty years because your so used to keeping players and getting inconsistent results and have not understood what having new Owners with ambitions mean. Times are changing and it means now we have Owners who can back serious signings and they will. We also have people in charge who will give chances but when there are weak links in the side and upgrades available in Windows then players will be moved on, you only have to look at Sammata to see what will happen eventually. The Owners want things to happen, they want to bring glory and pride back to Villa (it won't happen if we don't upgrade) and that means cutting the fat where and when it's needed. Ghazi, Trezegeut will only work for us for so much longer and as Sidcow said once we have upgraded them we will be saying that about Traore and he's right. Maybe a season or few but that times comes eventually and change will happen.

yes i agree, we need an upgrade. That is why i said keep Anwar as back up. 

[thunderball]

55 minutes ago, fruitvilla said:

He is Dutch in the same way I am Canadian.

I take it you’re Canadian because he is Dutch?

[Dave-R]

8 minutes ago, Shay said:

yes i agree, we need an upgrade. That is why i said keep Anwar as back up. 

Yes I agree maybe for another season having Ghazi as a back up maybe best. Unfortunately with the words of our Owners saying we won't stack players and have massive depth we may need to sell a winger. No way is grealish going to be sold, no way Traore will as he's our most recent, no way Trezegeut will by summer because he's still injured most likely so the only one I can see us shifting is Ghazi.

If the three musketeers decide they want a new Winger, I only see one option and that's to sell Ghazi. And if delboy and Rodders decide they want to pour alot of money in the club then great if we can reall spend on a flashy Winger who can do what Grealish does but in a complete different way, his own way.

Edited May 2, 2021 by Dave-R

[VillanousOne]

as long as he keeps scoring important goals all the other arguments for why he is crap or should be sold sound pretty bitter and petty.

he's a Villa player, not sure why people can't just get behind him and be positive.

[Dave-R]

14 minutes ago, thunderball said:

Played his part in our recent history, scoring a few important goals, for the cost he is certainly good value and I like his attitude, he gives the impression that Villa is his club and he plays for the badge. I hope he stays as a squad player but sentiment aside we do need better for where we want to be. 

I think you need to look beyond his goal tally, a players contribution is more than just his own goals it’s being a consistent part of a teams success - it’s assists or link play that pulls opposition apart and creates for other players, he doesn’t do much of that for me. We need someone who is contributing in games in what he brings out of others. I would rather Lingard there for example.

I would so have Lingard over Ghazi any day.

[VillanousOne]

Just now, Dave-R said:

I would so have Lingard over Ghazi any day.

Really? I thought you were El Ghazi's biggest fan?

[Vive_La_Villa]

I don’t get his inconsistency. How he can be so bad in some games that it’s like playing with 10 men. Same with Traore. How does this happen?

 

Edited May 2, 2021 by Vive_La_Villa

[Dave-R]

1 minute ago, VillanousOne said:

as long as he keeps scoring important goals all the other arguments for why he is crap or should be sold sound pretty bitter and petty.

he's a Villa player, not sure why people can't just get behind him and be positive.

It's not bitter or petty that's just your brain seeing it that way, have you not be taking in what people are saying why he should be sold and why, it sounds like you have not if all your saying is it's pretty bitter and Petty.

There's none of that involved, it's just the need to upgrade on our weaker players, can you not see the business and which way the club want to move, it's up. If you keep your weaker players and collect them then you will only move down.