Steve Bruce

[DaveAV1]

6 hours ago, villan_007 said:

Great reply dave.

Although my opinion isn't soley based on what I've read.  I too form my own view on what i see. I share your concerns. We have been awful. Ive watched the same former managers teams you mentioned, i know where you're coming from.

My own view is that the club had/has deep issues. Which I've seen get cast aside recently as rubbish. The lerner decay should have been fixed in 35 games is essentially what most are alluding to. I find it ludicrous that people expected this season to be fixed and the team clicking and knocking it about like arsenal. 

We've had change again twice. Previous to that a hatful of managers from all kinds of backgrounds that each time couldn't get us to string a pass together. That to me suggest in runs deeper. Needs to be ripped up, stripped back and started again.

That doesn't happen in a season. But it is being taken care of, and the small shoots of recovery has started. 

Am i happy with the football. No. But at this stage winning is more important than winning pretty. And I'll take that next season.

We've put a winning streak together and become hard to beat. But yes lots of work to do.

In terms of facts that i mentioned, its more pointing to last seasons bottom 6, now containing some of this seasons promotion contenders. Had they pulled the trigger as you want to, where would they be.

And yes i do look to his 4 promotions, the last being last season. I find it baffling that this is cast aside. 

Finally i ment no offense with my stroppy child analogy.  But it's all that comes across when I read it. As well as you put it dave, i still see i want bruce gone, i want a foreign manager and i want tikki takka footy. We've been down that road. It didn't work because it ignored the greater problems.

Bruce in. Stability. Tough winning promotion side.

 

I find myself nodding in agreement with much you've written above and indeed I've been on the fence up until recently. However I just don't see any improvement in playing style and whilst I absolutely agree that it's a results business, I feel that if the set up on the pitch doesn't change, then we will continue to have erratic results. It's not the aesthetics that bothers me it's that I feel we are not in control of games and therefore we don't have control of our own destiny. 

Im pretty certain that we will start next season with Steve Bruce and in that case I hope we end the season with him too, as that would surely mean we've had a successful season. I like him as a bloke, he passes my, "would I have a pint with him", test. I just hope that you're right and I'm wrong. 

[striker]

15 hours ago, theboyangel said:

What has happened to his face?

Some say he isn't a miracle worker but somehow he's managed to make himself even more uglier  

Fell over another gate??

[VillaChris]

We've won I think 7 of our last 12 games.

Start next season like that and we'll be nowhere near the depths that RDM took us.

Probably be good enough for 5th or 6th.

What I can see happening is get to November-December and us still playing uninspiring football and I can see Xia making a change as plenty of teams have done that in the past to give them a push for the second half of the season.

I reckon the target will be top 2 so if say we're 10 points off that there could well be grounds for dismissal.

Let's just hope we don't appoint Zola though....

[Dr_Pangloss]

8 minutes ago, VillaChris said:

We've won I think 7 of our last 12 games.

Start next season like that and we'll be nowhere near the depths that RDM took us.

Probably be good enough for 5th or 6th.

What I can see happening is get to November-December and us still playing uninspiring football and I can see Xia making a change as plenty of teams have done that in the past to give them a push for the second half of the season.

I reckon the target will be top 2 so if say we're 10 points off that there could well be grounds for dismissal.

Let's just hope we don't appoint Zola though....

I think so too, playoffs are basically cup football, very risky. Bruce needs to maintain us in the top 3 to keep his job,

Edited May 6, 2017 by Dr_Pangloss

[CosmicVillan]

Like a hospital patient who's had major surgery...you can't expect our vitals to bounce right back after such a long decline..first comes a period in intensive care.....then the patient is stabilized...before a gradual period of recuperation and return to full health. These things take time and cycles of decline and are well documented is the business world, we are through the crisis stage.

Faulty actions are often more damaging than inaction ( sack the manager..change the squad..start again cycle ) and can lead to yet more instability. From where we were last season mid table is progress...progress next season will be improving the away form and not going on 2 losing streaks, if Bruce can do that ( and he is capable ) then we will be in the play offs this time next year. Top two is fantasy from where we've been.

Recovery is a process that has to run it's course, what we see on the pitch is just the tip of a massive iceberg that is Aston Villa. I am confident that everything behind the scenes is now being done the right way, but it's a huge task and a long road. Sacking the Manager at this stage will only put us back several steps and in all probability only yield similar results.

Unless we start next season like we did under RDM I expect Bruce to be given until December to have us in the Top 6 

[sne]

...And sometimes the body rejects the newly transplanted organs a while after the surgery because they were not the right fit although they seemed like a good fit at first.

[JAMAICAN-VILLAN]

4 minutes ago, sne said:

...And sometimes the body rejects the newly transplanted organs a while after the surgery because they were not the right fit although they seemed like a good fit at first.

Leading to an infection, which can slow poison the body until death.

 

Where is Dr. House when you need him?

Edited May 6, 2017 by JAMAICAN-VILLAN

[bobzy]

6 hours ago, Stevo985 said:

I think we have a "squad" of good enough players.
However I do think that squad is thin and we could do with a few more players of quality in the summer to pad it out and give us options.

Outside of that squad, I think there are a considerable amount of deadwood that needs to be shifted.

I think our squad is right up there with the best in this division. We really don't need to add much in the summer (departures depending, of course).

Which teams have better squads? Genuinely, I cannot think of anyone other than Newcastle. 

[Dr_Pangloss]

1 minute ago, bobzy said:

I think our squad is right up there with the best in this division. We really don't need to add much in the summer (departures depending, of course).

Which teams have better squads? Genuinely, I cannot think of anyone other than Newcastle. 

So, if in your view, we have pretty much the second best squad in the league, then it must follow that we have one of the worst managers in the league for this team to be so far off 2nd place?

[Stevo985]

5 minutes ago, bobzy said:

I think our squad is right up there with the best in this division. We really don't need to add much in the summer (departures depending, of course).

Which teams have better squads? Genuinely, I cannot think of anyone other than Newcastle. 

On paper you might be right, which is why I don't think we need to add much in the summer.

Other teams have the advantaged of squads that have been together for longer which elevates them above ours. As much as people will say it doesn't matter, it does.

But yes, I agree with what i think if your overall point, that Bruce should be concentrating more on getting the best out of what he has instead of bringing in loads more "quality"

[USA_Villa]

28 minutes ago, Dr_Pangloss said:

So, if in your view, we have pretty much the second best squad in the league, then it must follow that we have one of the worst managers in the league for this team to be so far off 2nd place?

Correct

[Dr_Pangloss]

22 minutes ago, Stevo985 said:

On paper you might be right, which is why I don't think we need to add much in the summer.

Other teams have the advantaged of squads that have been together for longer which elevates them above ours. As much as people will say it doesn't matter, it does.

But yes, I agree with what i think if your overall point, that Bruce should be concentrating more on getting the best out of what he has instead of bringing in loads more "quality"

I think 3-4 straight into the first team is needed to give automatic promotion a a serious shot. Does this qualify as a lot of players? Not IMO. I do think you've touch on something important and that's the 'on paper' point. On paper we may have one of the best squads in the league, but the eye ball test tells you this bunch aren't anywhere near the best in the league. Bad management and tactics takes a lot of the blame for this but I also believe a lot of our players are just plain overrated and cannot deal with being at a club like this. I also think giving average players (which pretty much all of this lot are in the footballing scheme of things) massive wages for this level is a terrible idea and doesn't motivate them but rather leads to a mercenary mentality. 

[Stevo985]

37 minutes ago, Dr_Pangloss said:

I think 3-4 straight into the first team is needed to give automatic promotion a a serious shot. Does this qualify as a lot of players? Not IMO. 

No it doesn't. I'd agree on the figure although I don't think they necessarily need to go straight into the first team

[TRO]

15 hours ago, bobzy said:

I find it rather staggering that people think the players aren't good enough.

Whats the solution? But another squad of 30 players? If not, then are we simply completely screwed because there's nothing the manager can do to change the players mindset/ability?

Well i don't think all of them are no good.....but equally i don't see anyone else on the pitch ,kicking a football.

I just don't happen to think a portion of the players are blameless.

I believe we have an incomplete job and the balance is still not right.

you can have a situation where the players are ok, but the balance is not right, because too many are the same.....thats no ones fault......means the job has not been finished.

There are things the manager can do and things he can't do until the window reopens....you can't always get the players you want, but have to wait until the next window to try again.

There are far too many factors, to just keep blaming the manager.

[Jareth]

Bruce has only had a january window. No manager, whatever the club, can be denied at least one summer window before judgement is passed on their team. It is absolutely bonkers that anyone is calling Bruce OUT until he has built HIS squad. I put it down to expectation, which in Villa's case is way over the top - not that that is a bad thing, we bloody deserve a decent team one year soon. 

[Reivax_Villa]

I've just been reading an article on BM.

Interesting that he mentions that an improvement is not only needed with his players but with himself and his backroom staff.

Let's see what he does this summer.

[TRO]

You could have a team full of George Bests.....what can the manager do with them......hypothetically of course.

great players individually or on paper, but no blend.

how can a manager set that up right or adopt the right tactics.....the components are wrong.

That is not to say the players are no good......the balance is no good.

We need to get the balance right first and it isn't right.

then you can fill your boots and slag him off, when it is.

Edited May 6, 2017 by TRO

[theboyangel]

12 minutes ago, Reivax_Villa said:

I've just been reading an article on BM.

Interesting that he mentions that an improvement is not only needed with his players but with himself and his backroom staff.

Let's see what he does this summer.

I've posted before - I think our coaching set up is too defensive in personnel and needs a more creative influence.

Wonder if we'll approach Phelan to work with Bruce again?

[TRO]

2 minutes ago, theboyangel said:

I've posted before - I think our coaching set up is too defensive in personnel and needs a more creative influence.

Wonder if we'll approach Phelan to work with Bruce again?

I have a hunch its by necessity, not design.

[TRO]

One of the reasons i do not want to keep changing managers so early.....is because we are slowly developing in to a breeding ground for players with iffy attitude.

I don't need to mention names, you all know who they are and In my view we have had our unfair share of them in recent times.

when you keep changing managers these types are in a safe haven, knowing the incumbent will be gone in a short time.....its encouraging them.

Its a dangerous game to play, if we have any ambition to rid ourselves of the past....we need stability.....and they need to know, they are tossing their careers away and it won't be tolerated.