blandy Posted October 2, 2019 Author Moderator Share Posted October 2, 2019 8 minutes ago, peterms said: I'm afraid there is one word in that sentence which renders your argument inapplicable to the current situation. I do try and ration my use of the wo....damn. More seriously, maybe I am foolish to think that there's a rational element to all this and certainly much of their words (less so behaviour) suggests I am foolish, but still... My thinking goes along the basis of what is in their own narrow self interest. Sure you can say "hedge funds", but notwithstanding that, "no deal" isn't "no deal". No deal doesn't mean no deal, as someone didn't say. It just makes it much harder to do the next bit, which will be more difficult anyway. And on top of that, if he does get a deal through, he's home and hosed. He'll do an election and win it (or do as well as it is possible for such a fustercluck of a leader and party to do. it'll kill off the NF business (for a while at least) and he'll get their votes back. Labour's a complete mess, with a leader who is even less trusted than Johnson and the Lib Dem remain people will have had their goose cooked. If he doesn't get an election/Brexit is stopped (for a while), he's toast, as are the hardline tories and as May was under the same situation. And on top of all that, no deal will bring multiple national calamities as all the yellowhammer stuff makes clear, and again, the law currently prohibits it, in effect. He has to get a deal, for his own ego, for his own prospects. But yeah, the things they are saying are just irrational and utterly ridiculous. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bickster Posted October 2, 2019 Moderator Share Posted October 2, 2019 8 minutes ago, StefanAVFC said: Spitters The only thing prominent about those two is the promenent stench of career first It's OK though, Jezza won't mind Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amsterdam_Neil_D Posted October 2, 2019 Share Posted October 2, 2019 (edited) Edited October 2, 2019 by Amsterdam_Neil_D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ml1dch Posted October 2, 2019 Share Posted October 2, 2019 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vive_La_Villa Posted October 2, 2019 Share Posted October 2, 2019 3 hours ago, peterms said: Chatting to a French friend today, she's been allowed to remain but may leave anyway. She says that although she has always felt welcomed by the people she meets and works with, and loves the country, the actions and attitude of the government have made her feel so unwelcome and alienated that she is thinking hard about uprooting her life and going back. She says many EU citizens she knows have similar feelings. Well hopefully this influences her decision more than the governments f**k ups. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vive_La_Villa Posted October 2, 2019 Share Posted October 2, 2019 (edited) 4 hours ago, StefanAVFC said: I have the opposite feeling here, and I will register for citizenship as soon as I'm eligible. You feel welcomed by the government but not by the people? edit: sorry just clicked you meant you felt the opposite in that you’re not yet eligible to stay but hope to be. Edited October 2, 2019 by Vive_La_Villa Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyh29 Posted October 2, 2019 Share Posted October 2, 2019 21 minutes ago, ml1dch said: I tried Guinea pig when I was in Peru , not enough meat on it and tasted a bit crap so think I’ll stick to chlorinated chicken Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vive_La_Villa Posted October 2, 2019 Share Posted October 2, 2019 42 minutes ago, tonyh29 said: I tried Guinea pig when I was in Peru , not enough meat on it and tasted a bit crap so think I’ll stick to chlorinated chicken Does this mean I will no longer get my horse meat from Europe?! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowychap Posted October 3, 2019 Share Posted October 3, 2019 Johnson's Brexit proposal is riddled with problems Quote At last, a chink of clarity. Yesterday's proposal for the treatment of the Irish economy admits, more or less for the first time officially, that there are trade-offs to Brexit. Suddenly the laws of political physics are restored. You cannot both have your cake and eat it. The trade-off that has at last dawned on Boris Johnson is that if you want the whole of the UK to choose its own tariffs on goods, a customs border in Ireland is inevitable. And if you want Britain to be able to set its own regulations, then you need a border in the Irish Sea. ... rest of article on link 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StefanAVFC Posted October 3, 2019 Share Posted October 3, 2019 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chindie Posted October 3, 2019 VT Supporter Share Posted October 3, 2019 The turning of the blame towards the EU has been predicted for literally years. It's a shame it'll work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blandy Posted October 3, 2019 Author Moderator Share Posted October 3, 2019 20 minutes ago, Chindie said: It's a shame it'll work. WIth a minority, I'd think Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowychap Posted October 3, 2019 Share Posted October 3, 2019 Brief thread: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LondonLax Posted October 3, 2019 Share Posted October 3, 2019 2 hours ago, StefanAVFC said: There is some logic to what they are saying there. In the event of ‘No deal’ the EU will need a border at NI to protect its single market from the unregulated UK next door. Hence the UK Government is saying it would be crazy for the EU to go down the road of rejecting the UK ‘compromise’ on the basis that it doesn’t do enough to prevent customs checks in NI when the alternative requires the EU to construct a full border. I think what may happen under a ‘No deal’ scenario is that the EU holds off building a border and instead makes life for the UK as difficult as possible until the UK government agrees to come back to the negotiating table with a better proposal i.e. it could get very ugly. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cyrusr Posted October 3, 2019 VT Supporter Share Posted October 3, 2019 1 hour ago, snowychap said: Johnson's Brexit proposal is riddled with problems Thanks for this. There are a couple of things I still don't understand, maybe someone can help me. Johnson focus is on goods, but what about people? As I understand it, you can walk from NI to ROI but will that still be the case? If so, couldn't EU nationals just simply walk into NI? I think May's deal kept the status quo but wasn't this linked into the backstop as well? How does Johnson deal with this? What I also don't understand, is that given that this plan in essence creates a border in the Irish sea, surely the DUP wouldn't support this as it would separate NI to the rest of UK? Given they are exceptionally pro-UK, why are they supporting this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genie Posted October 3, 2019 Share Posted October 3, 2019 (edited) Embarrassingly, I'd not really thought of that before in that context. No deal and there's a huge great open door to the EU on the Irish border, and the same into the UK from the EU... The people pushing for a hard Brexit, no deal all the way to protect our laws and borders... have they really thought about this? Edited October 3, 2019 by Genie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowychap Posted October 3, 2019 Share Posted October 3, 2019 10 minutes ago, cyrusr said: Thanks for this. There are a couple of things I still don't understand, maybe someone can help me. Johnson focus is on goods, but what about people? As I understand it, you can walk from NI to ROI but will that still be the case? If so, couldn't EU nationals just simply walk into NI? I think May's deal kept the status quo but wasn't this linked into the backstop as well? How does Johnson deal with this? Both the Irish and UK governments reaffirmed that they will continue to maintain the CTA under which UK and Irish citizens have various rights regardless of the outcome of Brexit (i.e. it wasn't linked to the backstop or the WA). Obviously, you've highlighted some practical difficulties with this in relation to EU nationals. Quote What I also don't understand, is that given that this plan in essence creates a border in the Irish sea, surely the DUP wouldn't support this as it would separate NI to the rest of UK? Given they are exceptionally pro-UK, why are they supporting this? They've given their support, I think. That may be because it's supposedlly just about goods and they've acknowledged that there are already some checks that take place 'in the Irish sea' but I did also see some suggestion that there's the potential of another wedge of cash (for NI as a whole...) in exchange for this support. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowychap Posted October 3, 2019 Share Posted October 3, 2019 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cyrusr Posted October 3, 2019 VT Supporter Share Posted October 3, 2019 3 minutes ago, snowychap said: I did also see some suggestion that there's the potential of another wedge of cash (for NI as a whole...) in exchange for this support. That'll do it! Knew the DUP had already given their support, just confused me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bickster Posted October 3, 2019 Moderator Share Posted October 3, 2019 What happens if there is no NI Assembly? Because right now... 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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