The Rémi Garde thread

[DCJonah]

26 minutes ago, Chindie said:

People have explained time and again that they see more in Garde than Sherwood, because there have been improvements, however small, in our play. It's more than personalities - nobody is that stupid, everyone would be delighted if we had the best manager on the planet even if they happened to be a complete tosser.

Now you can reject that, as no doubt you will because he isn't Ron **** Saunders, but have some more respect for your fellow fan to spout this bollocks that Garde is only liked because he seems nice or isn't Tim bastard Sherwood.

Garde won't be here much longer whether he's sacked or walks so it won't matter shortly, but for pities same can we cut the bollocks?

What are these improvements? Because don't we score less goals, concede more goals and the win percentage is lower. 

So I'm struggling to see what Garde has done to merit a free pass and good will while Sherwood is classed as a charlatan and abused. It quite clearly is based on personalities and you can see that by the grief Sherwood got before he even became manager and the fact people wanted him sacked last season for not playing Carles Gil.

 

[TRO]

17 minutes ago, MikeMcKenna said:

 

I accept that there isn't directly any evidence but I was told that when he was challenged about his son's racist behaviour in Thailand he could not see the problem. Whether that is true or not, shortly after he was fired. Ultimately is it was 'the straw that broke the camels back' 

Mike, Unless we know the full facts of what transpired how can we realistically and fairly judge the man. Anyone in their right mind does not have any cotter with Racism and I would fully support your stance on not wanting a new manager that does.

but we are getting a little ahead of ourselves until we know the full facts, maybe Pearsons loyalty to his son was misplaced.

There have been plenty of instances over the years of player/ manager indiscretions and true to form some get negated/forgotten very easily and some get castigated vociforously. That is down to every individuals interpretation.

I am not going out on a limb for Nigel Pearson, but I am questioning our ability to select a manager we can create some stability with and create a modicum of success.Personally I am looking for a more abrasive manager, not troublesome or a bully.....just more direct and decisive.....more hard nosed....unfortunately there can be a fine dividing line.

This is a tough business we ( Aston Villa) are in and it is not for the faint hearted....Industrial language gets used and physical altercations happen ( ask Nigel Reo Coker - If he had wanted to take that further it would have made Pearsons incident look like handbags)

Lets get some, perspective here.

We all have our personal likes and dislikes and we are all entitled to our opinions without having our intelligence questioned because we disagree with some folk.

 

 

Edited March 20, 2016 by TRO

[Gary Thomas]

1 hour ago, dounavilla said:

47 minutes ago, onmeedson said:

Why not make them suffer for that time and actually do the job they are supposed to do, train them to sweat take up their day with football and cut all the perks that come with their lifestyle . Tough guy will do for the moment this club is rotten to the core and needs someone to take a stand, weak gets you walked on .

 

Sounds a bit like we need that Steve Hollis fella with his "steel fist in a velvet glove"   

[onmeedson]

Or that wolf in sheeps clothing that won 2 in 20

[TRO]

23 minutes ago, Jareth said:

Perhaps, but if my son went out and paid for sex, then racially abused that prostitute, I would be inclined to disown him. No class. Perfect fit for small heath methinks but not us.

my comment was not directed at you, just a generalisation.

[Dr_Pangloss]

27 minutes ago, Xela said:

I have to disagree, what we are seeing now is no better than what Lambert served up at the end of his reign and Sherwood did at the start of the season. I honestly think we would be no worse off points wise if Sherwood was still here. 

Sherwood needed to go but we made the wrong appointment in Garde. 

Yep, so far there has been absolutely no improvement, delusional to think otherwise. Your last sentence is spot on too, Sherwood was a disaster and had to go, but Garde was a terrible replacement and has proven to be exactly that. 

[Jareth]

Would be helpful if they could just get on with sacking him this afternoon, so that we can lump all the speculation in a single 'new manager' thread.

[Chindie]

8 minutes ago, DCJonah said:

What are these improvements? Because don't we score less goals, concede more goals and the win percentage is lower. 

So I'm struggling to see what Garde has done to merit a free pass and good will while Sherwood is classed as a charlatan and abused. It quite clearly is based on personalities and you can see that by the grief Sherwood got before he even became manager and the fact people wanted him sacked last season for not playing Carles Gil.

 

It isn't personalities.

I know it isn't because I'm sat here telling you quite honestly what my position is on Garde.

To repeat myself for the final time hopefully, and for reference I know you won't agree so save me the same argument back, I've seen with some of the performances under the current manager a far more professional, considered style of play than we ever saw under Sherwood, who didn't know what he was doing so is a bit a surprise. The midfield plays with more of a brain, more like you would expect of a 'big' club target than the smash and grab crap you expect of a lower league side on a cup tie.

Unfortunately it's completely undermined by the standard of players, they seem incapable of taking the next step, and have been for years. The team doesn't score enough goals under Garde, but they haven't scored enough goals for season on season - without Benteke we'd have been down long before now. And the defence is riddled with moronic individual errors that I genuinely don't think you can 'manage' out of them, and then loses their head the moment one goes in.

So, whilst the results haven't improved over all, there's enough hints from Garde that, given time and importantly given resource to overhaul this side, we'd benefit. Whereas Tim clearly was flailing around without a clue and seemed to just throw a team out and say 'play'. He didn't have any game plan, and by the end was looking like he was about to have a breakdown (his final few post match interviews he looked like he'd slept in a ditch and didn't seem to have the faintest idea what to do - he wasn't coping). His style of coaching was clearly all about adrenaline and emotion, which doesn't last. But he was liked by the team and when a different style arrived in Garde they've not bothered because he isn't their best buddy Tim and the wheels fell off even harder.

You disagree and that's fine. But accept it isn't about personalities, please. I see more in Garde than I do in Tim Sherwood. And that will be reflected in their careers, I believe, away from Villa Park.

[Dr_Pangloss]

I'm sorry but I'm struggling to think of these 'hints from Garde'. We are worse going forward under him and every bit as bad at the back as under Sherwood (if not even more calamitous). Ball retention in the centre of the park is possibly marginally better but that gets us no where so really nothing to shout about. I personally see nothing in Garde at this level. 

[Chindie]

1 minute ago, Dr_Pangloss said:

I'm sorry but I'm struggling to think of these 'hints from Garde'. We are worse going forward under him and every bit as bad at the back as under Sherwood (if not even more calamitous). Ball retention in the centre of the park is possibly marginally better but that gets us no where so really nothing to shout about. I personally see nothing in Garde at this level. 

You're welcome to that position and I understand it. The results have been bollocks.

And I'm not trying to persuade anyone otherwise. I'm just fed up of 'oh is because he's not Sherwood' or 'it's just personalities'. It isn't. People are seeing more in Garde than results suggest, and I'm tired of that being dismissed and people's views being misrepresented.

 

[trekka]

5 minutes ago, Chindie said:

It isn't personalities.

I know it isn't because I'm sat here telling you quite honestly what my position is on Garde.

To repeat myself for the final time hopefully, and for reference I know you won't agree so save me the same argument back, I've seen with some of the performances under the current manager a far more professional, considered style of play than we ever saw under Sherwood, who didn't know what he was doing so is a bit a surprise. The midfield plays with more of a brain, more like you would expect of a 'big' club target than the smash and grab crap you expect of a lower league side on a cup tie.

Unfortunately it's completely undermined by the standard of players, they seem incapable of taking the next step, and have been for years. The team doesn't score enough goals under Garde, but they haven't scored enough goals for season on season - without Benteke we'd have been down long before now. And the defence is riddled with moronic individual errors that I genuinely don't think you can 'manage' out of them, and then loses their head the moment one goes in.

So, whilst the results haven't improved over all, there's enough hints from Garde that, given time and importantly given resource to overhaul this side, we'd benefit. Whereas Tim clearly was flailing around without a clue and seemed to just throw a team out and say 'play'. He didn't have any game plan, and by the end was looking like he was about to have a breakdown (his final few post match interviews he looked like he'd slept in a ditch and didn't seem to have the faintest idea what to do - he wasn't coping). His style of coaching was clearly all about adrenaline and emotion, which doesn't last. But he was liked by the team and when a different style arrived in Garde they've not bothered because he isn't their best buddy Tim and the wheels fell off even harder.

You disagree and that's fine. But accept it isn't about personalities, please. I see more in Garde than I do in Tim Sherwood. And that will be reflected in their careers, I believe, away from Villa Park.

Great post, Chindie.

Edited March 20, 2016 by trekka

[Gary Thomas]

It is like asking someone to take over a stable full of donkeys and then firing the trainer  because none of them can win, or show any signs of, winning a race.  Our squad is technically not good enough, we have no goal scorers, and they are all devoid of confidence and know deep down they are done. How was Garde expected to do anything with that bunch.  He will go, I am sure, but the truth is we will never find out if he is a good manager or not because his players are literally out of their league.

[TRO]

3 minutes ago, Chindie said:

It isn't personalities.

I know it isn't because I'm sat here telling you quite honestly what my position is on Garde.

To repeat myself for the final time hopefully, and for reference I know you won't agree so save me the same argument back, I've seen with some of the performances under the current manager a far more professional, considered style of play than we ever saw under Sherwood, who didn't know what he was doing so is a bit a surprise. The midfield plays with more of a brain, more like you would expect of a 'big' club target than the smash and grab crap you expect of a lower league side on a cup tie.

Unfortunately it's completely undermined by the standard of players, they seem incapable of taking the next step, and have been for years. The team doesn't score enough goals under Garde, but they haven't scored enough goals for season on season - without Benteke we'd have been down long before now. And the defence is riddled with moronic individual errors that I genuinely don't think you can 'manage' out of them, and then loses their head the moment one goes in.

So, whilst the results haven't improved over all, there's enough hints from Garde that, given time and importantly given resource to overhaul this side, we'd benefit. Whereas Tim clearly was flailing around without a clue and seemed to just throw a team out and say 'play'. He didn't have any game plan, and by the end was looking like he was about to have a breakdown (his final few post match interviews he looked like he'd slept in a ditch and didn't seem to have the faintest idea what to do - he wasn't coping). His style of coaching was clearly all about adrenaline and emotion, which doesn't last. But he was liked by the team and when a different style arrived in Garde they've not bothered because he isn't their best buddy Tim and the wheels fell off even harder.

You disagree and that's fine. But accept it isn't about personalities, please. I see more in Garde than I do in Tim Sherwood. And that will be reflected in their careers, I believe, away from Villa Park.

I accept the reply was not back to me, but

The hints you refer to are not shared by everyone, me included.

Whilst I accept it is not Remi's team, (in the same manner, that it is not Ranieri's team)  The midfield are totally lightweight and ineffective, The work off the ball is questionable, the ability to stay close to your man is amiss, the defence rarely pick up their opposite number.....and if the quintessential ball to the center forward is snuffed out ,we are clueless.

Equally those flaws were in evidence under Tim Sherwood, but I did see the odd win which had credibility like the Liverpool semi final and a few games in the run in and losses that rendered the odd goal as opposed to getting pummelled every week ...to question the "flailing around" format that you allude to.....so I guess what we are saying is how a distinct improvement is in evidence, baffles me.

I guess the beauty is in then eye of the beholder.

[TRO]

9 minutes ago, Gary Thomas said:

It is like asking someone to take over a stable full of donkeys and then firing the trainer  because none of them can win, or show any signs of, winning a race.  Our squad is technically not good enough, we have no goal scorers, and they are all devoid of confidence and know deep down they are done. How was Garde expected to do anything with that bunch.  He will go, I am sure, but the truth is we will never find out if he is a good manager or not because his players are literally out of their league.

I accept all of that, but the same mitigation was not apportioned to the previous manager, that is the point.

[Chindie]

And you're welcome to that position and as I said before I understand it.

But accept people are seeing better elements of play under Garde. And accept that people that would like to see him stay, are not saying that 'because he isn't Sherwood', or 'its personality'. That's misrepresenting what people's opinions are based on, and it's frustrating.

[a m ole]

9 minutes ago, Chindie said:

And you're welcome to that position and as I said before I understand it.

But accept people are seeing better elements of play under Garde. And accept that people that would like to see him stay, are not saying that 'because he isn't Sherwood', or 'its personality'. That's misrepresenting what people's opinions are based on, and it's frustrating.

and you can add the 'if he was called Remington Guard' fancy-name bullshit to that.

[sharkyvilla]

17 minutes ago, Gary Thomas said:

It is like asking someone to take over a stable full of donkeys and then firing the trainer  because none of them can win, or show any signs of, winning a race.  Our squad is technically not good enough, we have no goal scorers, and they are all devoid of confidence and know deep down they are done. How was Garde expected to do anything with that bunch.  He will go, I am sure, but the truth is we will never find out if he is a good manager or not because his players are literally out of their league.

Yeah I hope Garde gets a decent pay off from Lerner.  Randy's screwed him over and Remi's reputation has taken a massive hit.  I hope he gets a decent gig in France next season and can quietly rebuild his career.  If it's Pearson, then I'll get behind him like any other manager, we will need some real sorting out.

[TRO]

42 minutes ago, Chindie said:

And you're welcome to that position and as I said before I understand it.

But accept people are seeing better elements of play under Garde. And accept that people that would like to see him stay, are not saying that 'because he isn't Sherwood', or 'its personality'. That's misrepresenting what people's opinions are based on, and it's frustrating.

Thats fair comment and I am not trying to misrepresent your opinions, but equally frustration is not a one way street.

I don't dislike Remi Garde and if he was to stay, I would be happy for him but dubious of our ability to get out of the championship quickly.

I think Remi is more of a technical manager and this mess he has walked in to requires a different approach.

You could be right, He may well go on to be more successful than Timmy, but that in itself is not a closed cased argument.....Remi is likely to end up at somewhere like Lyon where a fair infrastructure is already in place.

Tim never was a manager to go overboard on, but some of the stuff on here has been "open season" .....He too had players denied him like Cambiasso,Townsend, not saying he would have been the answer, but my point is his opportunity to prove his point,was curtailed too.

Remi always has had a more studious approach, one in complete contrast to Tim or even our own beloved MON.....It appeals to some and not others, maybe because we too are all different personalities.

Edited March 20, 2016 by TRO

[jacketspuds]

Moyes or Rodgers for me.

I actually think Rodgers would be excellent at Villa.

[Woodytom]

32 minutes ago, Chindie said:

Unfortunately it's completely undermined by the standard of players, they seem incapable of taking the next step, and have been for years.

So that was the same with sherwood then? We know at least one of his systems worked to some extent because it did last season.

It may be bollocks that it's about personalities, but what is certainly bollocks Is that improvements have been made.