PIW Posted September 23, 2011 Share Posted September 23, 2011 5 yrs after Ellis came in we were relegated. 3 season after we were trying to get in the CL we were worried about relegation up to the last few weeks. Relegation is a word that most, I'd guess, that has crossed our minds for this season. Not that we'll necessarily go down, but I think the majority think we'll be worried by it throughout the season. More money sopen by Lerner yes. More money brought in through sales also. A club bereft of ambition. Christ, its just the same as Ellis. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CI Posted September 23, 2011 Author Share Posted September 23, 2011 HDE having saved the club from financial meltdown, had a longer term, measured and responsible view of AVFC about longevity and staying in business. Randy has put more RISK onto the club than at any stage in our history We are quite frankly at present in a perilous position and wholly reliant on the whims of one foreign man who now does not even attend the games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted September 23, 2011 Share Posted September 23, 2011 I would simply say this: I was one of the fans walking with Jonathan fear in the Ellis out brigade and have no reason to ever change my opinion..... but i will say this. Probably a better value of player was acquired under the old so and so than we are acheiving now. Randy, has spent a fortune on dross, sorry poor standard of player. Randy has done far more in terms of infra structure and adding to the feel good factor in terms of buildings. The money spent on the team needs a seperate appraisal. Randy, should call and extra ordinary meeting on the money spent on the team. If it was the government it would be a public enquiry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CI Posted September 23, 2011 Author Share Posted September 23, 2011 I think Randy, in a rather sly and cunning way, has found a safe haven for 250m pounds yileding a 10% return He has not put a single cent of money into the club without expecting a return Its just a business move Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morley_crosses_to_Withe Posted September 23, 2011 Share Posted September 23, 2011 I think Randy, in a rather sly and cunning way, has found a safe haven for 250m pounds yileding a 10% return He has not put a single cent of money into the club without expecting a return Its just a business move Where are you getting your figures from!? A larger portion of the money was pumped in as equity investment so not all of it is currently yielding a return. Also, where's the 10% figure from!? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
makouns_grin Posted September 24, 2011 Share Posted September 24, 2011 I think Randy, in a rather sly and cunning way, has found a safe haven for 250m pounds yileding a 10% return He has not put a single cent of money into the club without expecting a return Its just a business move Hilarious. You don't have a clue and just made all that up! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CI Posted September 24, 2011 Author Share Posted September 24, 2011 Read the accounts and look at the management charges Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jacketspuds Posted September 24, 2011 Share Posted September 24, 2011 From top to bottom we lack anyone with either the football knowledge or passion for this club that I think is needed. Faulkner is pretty useless and everything coming out of the club is just laughable. Randy is even more of a non-entity at the club now, which people only care about now that we are selling our best players, not spending like we used too, and playing bland "do not lose" football. I really hope this is rock bottom under Randy and I would much prefer he sells up, gets the credit he deserves for the last 5 years, and we move on as a club. Yes other clubs have more money than us but that doesn't mean that we should just stick our heads in the sand, make shit loads of excuses and accept it. Randy has done wonders for this club, but we are now going backwards at an incredible rate. Time for a change me thinks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CI Posted September 24, 2011 Author Share Posted September 24, 2011 I think RAL is entering the endgame, it's finding a suitable buyer that is difficult, wonder if the Qatari's would be interested ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Risso Posted September 24, 2011 Share Posted September 24, 2011 I think RAL is entering the endgame, it's finding a suitable buyer that is difficult, wonder if the Qatari's would be interested ? Could I just point out that Lerner's middle initial is actually 'D' (for David), and that RAL stands for "Reform Acquisitions Limited". Carry on...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted September 24, 2011 Share Posted September 24, 2011 For all those folk that think money is the answer to everything ( transfer wise)I say this. I have never been in agreement and never will. Money gives you freedom to make a move it gives you the opportunity to capture a player that other have missed. It gives you the opportunity to compete when a desire for a player is needed to secure. What money doesn't do in football is to negate the ability to spot a player or to bring success when there is a clear indication that the purchaser has no idea what he is buying. Money in short is a commodity of convenience .. paramount to those who know what they are doing. Money to those that don't is like a hand grenade. There have been instances of Managers that have literally spunked money up the wall......No chairman however rich can sustain that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
makouns_grin Posted September 24, 2011 Share Posted September 24, 2011 Read the accounts and look at the management charges I have thank you. But i couldn't see where it says that he puts nothing in.. without expecting a return As i said load of bollocks you've just made up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted September 24, 2011 Share Posted September 24, 2011 If I was running the club and was holding us back from achieving success I would look to see if I could sell to someone with the spondulux to take us forward to win things I dont exactly see many billionaires lining up to buy Villa or other Premier LEague clubs especially when teams like Everton are desperately available Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CI Posted September 25, 2011 Author Share Posted September 25, 2011 I think RAL is entering the endgame, it's finding a suitable buyer that is difficult, wonder if the Qatari's would be interested ? Could I just point out that Lerner's middle initial is actually 'D' (for David), and that RAL stands for "Reform Acquisitions Limited". Carry on...... Thanks, thats exactly what I meant. See it as RAL the company rather than Lerner the individual. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Posted September 25, 2011 Share Posted September 25, 2011 For all we harassed HDE, he actually had/has genuine passion for the club. Still goes to the games as he loves the club Let us not forget why we "harrassed" him. He came to us from the Small Heath board and called us merely "the men of the terraces". He turned EC winners into a relegated team in 5 years and ignored the best team we have had during the last century during his time at the club because he was not at the helm when they were at their peak. He took a huge amount of money out of the club in salary and when he sold to RL and he was also happy to name a stand after himself. Does he buy a ticket like we do to go to the games? HDE had a passion for money and the status that being our chairman gave him. His most recent claim was that he hand picked our new owner and MON. But enough of our former ruler. What makes it so sad for me now is that our bright future appears to have been allowed to become a bleak one so soon. Excellent post Brilliant Post. ... by all means.....lets discuss Randy and his strategy on the club ... however ..... Lets not start start thinking Ellis would be better. Absolutely right. I find the fact that some fans are getting all dewy eyed about the Ellis era little short of astounding. I actually feel quite sorry for RL. I think he came to the club with the best of intentions but events have overtaken him. He was lauded in the media as the model of a foreign owner and MON was seen as the perfect managerial appointment. How times have changed. Undoubtedly he has made mistakes. Certainly in my eyes the key ones are: - Two botched managerial appointments. - Failure to set proper parameters around MON's role at the club. - Allowing the wage bill to spiral out of control. - Failure to communicate with the fans or the media in any sensible manner. - Failure to publicly explain the strategy of the club. All that does not make him a bad owner but I do think now that maybe he is out of his depth. I don't know Paul Faulkner beyond having heard him him speak at a function I attended a year or so ago so I can't judge whether he is doing a good job or not. What is clear is he is Randy's man and retains his confidence. That of course does not make him a good CEO necessarily. Personally I would rather see us have a much more overtly strong CEO who perhaps more clearly stamped his authority on the club. RL is never going to talk to the media on a regular basis but you need someone who will. The most galling part of the last few months for me has been the club's attitude towards the fans. The objectives and strategy of the club has clearly changed but there appears to be an expectation that the fans will carry on whatever. Worse still they almost seem surprised when the fans don't attend as many games, renew ST's, buy merchandise, etc. The one thing I would say though is football attendances seem to be down generally so the only slack I would cut them is that I don't think the reduced gates are completely a function of their recent running of the club. We are in tough economic times and attending a Villa game, or any football match, is discretionary spending. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smetrov Posted September 25, 2011 Share Posted September 25, 2011 If Randy has no money to pump in fair enough that doesn't make him a bad owner - most PL clubs don't have a bottomless pit of cash....but what worries me is:- His last to managerial appointments:- Houllier Mcleish worse still others in the frame were:- Martinez Mclaren That has to be one the poorest fields of potential managers I can rember in 40 years of following the club. Even with no money surley we can do better than that ? Randy rarley attends games He has a poor record with the browns That said I - beleive things could improve dramtically if we had a stronger guy at CEO level. Still think we are in the end game for Randy - and would be surprised if he is still here in 12 months Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted September 25, 2011 Share Posted September 25, 2011 His last to managerial appointments:- Houllier Mcleish worse still others in the frame were:- Martinez Mclaren in fairness cant see many better candidates put their name forward and would come. Am sure i heard Moyes turned us down P.S. and no Didier Deschamps didnt put his name forward Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jat_r Posted September 25, 2011 Share Posted September 25, 2011 I think people are getting too excited over money. Money isn't everything. I don't like it but I'd rather have these few seasons of mediocrity and have a sound financial platform then run up more on wages! The club need to continue to expand their revenue to give us more freedom with wages. I think we will be a different team in 2-3 years when Heskey, Beye, Warnock and etc have gone and it will give us a bit more movement with wages! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R.I.C.O. Posted September 25, 2011 Share Posted September 25, 2011 Absolutely right. I find the fact that some fans are getting all dewy eyed about the Ellis era little short of astounding. I actually feel quite sorry for RL. I think he came to the club with the best of intentions but events have overtaken him. He was lauded in the media as the model of a foreign owner and MON was seen as the perfect managerial appointment. How times have changed. Undoubtedly he has made mistakes. Certainly in my eyes the key ones are: - Two botched managerial appointments. - Failure to set proper parameters around MON's role at the club. - Allowing the wage bill to spiral out of control. - Failure to communicate with the fans or the media in any sensible manner. - Failure to publicly explain the strategy of the club. All that does not make him a bad owner but I do think now that maybe he is out of his depth. I don't know Paul Faulkner beyond having heard him him speak at a function I attended a year or so ago so I can't judge whether he is doing a good job or not. What is clear is he is Randy's man and retains his confidence. That of course does not make him a good CEO necessarily. Personally I would rather see us have a much more overtly strong CEO who perhaps more clearly stamped his authority on the club. RL is never going to talk to the media on a regular basis but you need someone who will. The most galling part of the last few months for me has been the club's attitude towards the fans. The objectives and strategy of the club has clearly changed but there appears to be an expectation that the fans will carry on whatever. Worse still they almost seem surprised when the fans don't attend as many games, renew ST's, buy merchandise, etc. The one thing I would say though is football attendances seem to be down generally so the only slack I would cut them is that I don't think the reduced gates are completely a function of their recent running of the club. We are in tough economic times and attending a Villa game, or any football match, is discretionary spending. Superb post. It would be nice to hear from the board every now and again but I think some fans have to face up to the harsh economic climate we are currently facing. We are in the worst recession since the 1930s and the West Midlands is still one of the most economically deprived and fastly shrinking economies in the UK. The unemployment rates have gone up faster in this region than any other including the northeast. To ignore these facts and then bemoan Lerner for not putting money in whilst attendances across the board are falling is setting Villa up for ruin. MON nearly ran us into the ground, Villa have been making huge losses for years, how are we supposed to comply with the UEFA rulings in the future? This season is all about consolidation. I am sure once the books are balanced Lerner will either A) sell the club or open us up for another investor, or finance further spending as the wages of players like Heskey, Beye, Cuellar and a few others crippling the club will be off the books. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PauloBarnesi Posted September 25, 2011 Share Posted September 25, 2011 Am sure i heard Moyes turned us down I ve also heard that Villa wouldn’t pay the compensation that Everton wanted so it was never fully explored. Lets rewind a bit. At the end of the 2009-2010 Randy decides its not going to go any further with MON. He says to MON its over and they agree a package. He then decides that he will bring in Moyes and pay the compensation, probably equivalent if not less than the money he has spunked on getting rid of Houllier and bringing in McLeish and gives him some funding? But oh no we decided not to ‘poach’ another manager and in the end its all gone rubbish. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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