houllierout Posted November 22, 2012 Share Posted November 22, 2012 Firstly. The Myth he is investing money. Its coming in as loans from his family fund. Its all just going against a giant credit to him if/when he sells. (that myth is right up there with Doug leaving us with no debts) Secondly. the £20MILL! this summer lot. After 2 years of negative investment he finally put some of the money back. Over three years he's only spent circa. £8mil. and thats why the squad is in the condition it is in! http://www.tinyurl.com/avfcspend Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kingfisher Posted November 22, 2012 Share Posted November 22, 2012 Firstly. The Myth he is investing money. Its coming in as loans from his family fund. Its all just going against a giant credit to him if/when he sells. (that myth is right up there with Doug leaving us with no debts) Secondly. the £20MILL! this summer lot. After 2 years of negative investment he finally put some of the money back. Over three years he's only spent circa. £8mil. and thats why the squad is in the condition it is in! http://www.tinyurl.com/avfcspend And the two or three seasons preceding those years we spent? Quite a flot. . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CI Posted November 22, 2012 Author Share Posted November 22, 2012 Like he said, it's all debt that the club owes him. His management and interest charges far outweigh any return he'd get off a bank for his £200m investment. His money is safe for now BUT if we go down Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
houllierout Posted November 22, 2012 Share Posted November 22, 2012 And the two or three seasons preceding those years we spent? Quite a flot. . and that is why we made such losses the last financial year as Lerner didnt know what a wage structure was. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morley_crosses_to_Withe Posted November 22, 2012 Share Posted November 22, 2012 I always see the phrase "long term" plan being used. What is this plan? What should it have been/be. Nobody has ever explained! I guess the question should be: starting from today, what should Randy's "long term" plan be for the club? How else should he get us into the Champion's league whilst simultaneously keeping revenue/expenditure at balanced levels? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lexicon Posted November 22, 2012 Share Posted November 22, 2012 That reminds me, I think I need some more tinfoil. For my hat. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kingfisher Posted November 22, 2012 Share Posted November 22, 2012 and that is why we made such losses the last financial year as Lerner didnt know what a wage structure was. It seems to me that it's the implementation of a sustainable expenditure plan that seems to be the gripe now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big_John_10 Posted November 22, 2012 Share Posted November 22, 2012 Is it possible to be anything more than just surviving with this approach? I don't know but are there any clubs who regularly finish top 8 with this approach? Again if the plan is to only spend an amount of what the club makes why did people hold £ signs up years who? Is that not what we've been doing long before Lerner bought the club? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
houllierout Posted November 22, 2012 Share Posted November 22, 2012 It seems to me that it's the implementation of a sustainable expenditure plan that seems to be the gripe now. Maybe a slow steady growth instead of boom and bust would have been the outcome then. We'll never know. Just surviving year and year from now on will be the key. Its a bit like turning 18 and spending every night drinking hideous amounts of alcohol and partying in the top 6 clubs for 4 years. Then overnight for the doctor/solicitor tells you you have no liver or money left and you will have to survive never having a drink again and on the dole. Me? Im saying lets get a liver transplant and move on..... others are saying we had a good run and hey sometimes vimto is a really good treat. It aint Leffe is it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eames Posted November 22, 2012 Share Posted November 22, 2012 Maybe a slow steady growth instead of boom and bust would have been the outcome then. We'll never know. Just surviving year and year from now on will be the key. Its a bit like turning 18 and spending every night drinking hideous amounts of alcohol and partying in the top 6 clubs for 4 years. Then overnight for the doctor/solicitor tells you you have no liver or money left and you will have to survive never having a drink again and on the dole. Me? Im saying lets get a liver transplant and move on..... others are saying we had a good run and hey sometimes vimto is a really good treat. It aint not Leffe is it? Words absolutely fail me. They really really do. /blocked. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swerbs Posted November 22, 2012 Share Posted November 22, 2012 Is it possible to be anything more than just surviving with this approach? I don't know but are there any clubs who regularly finish top 8 with this approach? Again if the plan is to only spend an amount of what the club makes why did people hold £ signs up years who? Is that not what we've been doing long before Lerner bought the club? Yeah I think with this approach we can only survive and consolidate. If we can manage that for this season then maybe starting from next season Randy should (learning from his past mistakes) increase our budgets year on year but sensibly. I understand people are angry about what happened with how he let the finances go out of control to begin with but I believe he should be given a chance. Although this approach is risky regarding our Premier League status, I think should it work it would provide a stable platform for when he begins to invest serious money again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GarethRDR Posted November 22, 2012 Share Posted November 22, 2012 Me? Im saying lets get a liver transplant and move on..... others are saying we had a good run and hey sometimes vimto is a really good treat. It aint Leffe is it? Yeah, but has anyone really been far even as decided to use even go want to do look more like? 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PieFacE Posted November 22, 2012 VT Supporter Share Posted November 22, 2012 Maybe a slow steady growth That's what we're doing now ffs. Okay it's not working, but that's not entirely Randy's fault. As far as i'm concerned our squad is better then where we are at the minute. Lambert has to take some of the blame for that. I do think he's going to turn it around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AvfcRigo82 Posted November 22, 2012 Share Posted November 22, 2012 I think Randy Lerner has ran this club superbly and been very sensible. Yes he got his hands burnt with MON's erratic spending and a global crash to deal with too but I feel he has steadied the ship again superbly, Essentially ill advised along the way in some situations but all in all I think he is ready to go again and has now taken the approach of a young fresh proven manager to build a bigger better Villa than the quick blow job we got by O'Neill. I mean let's face it. If Lambert was named as manager and told at the same time here, theres a hundred million pound to build a new team with I would say Lerner needed his head seeing to - and also those that expected this to happen that they need there heads looking at too! The approach of an injection of 20m so far has shown that Lambert can find quality of the now and for the future which is encouraging signs for RL knowing his money is not being spunked down the river on overrated premiership average joes commanding 80k+ anymore but infact being spent on players that will add something to this club over the long haul and also proberly more than double in value too. With careful spending a steady injections of cash this will happen no problem IMO. and he will not hesitate to give Lambert another 20m any time he needed it! I would prefer to build success - not buy it! Exciting times indeed! . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big_John_10 Posted November 22, 2012 Share Posted November 22, 2012 In no other business could you buy a company, spend millions and years later be in a similar if not worse position and have it called running the company superbly. If Lerner is running the club superbly then what did you think of how Doug was running it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kingfisher Posted November 22, 2012 Share Posted November 22, 2012 Maybe a slow steady growth instead of boom and bust would have been the outcome then. We'll never know. Just surviving year and year from now on will be the key. Its a bit like turning 18 and spending every night drinking hideous amounts of alcohol and partying in the top 6 clubs for 4 years. Then overnight for the doctor/solicitor tells you you have no liver or money left and you will have to survive never having a drink again and on the dole. Me? Im saying lets get a liver transplant and move on..... others are saying we had a good run and hey sometimes vimto is a really good treat. It aint Leffe is it? I don't think just surviving year on year is the key, or the plan. We had a party but stopped a long time before the liver became too damaged, to use your ropey analogy. We can carry on and drink moderately within our means, and fans can moan about not spending enough, and will (sometimes the same fans who moan about how we once spent too much, which I find puzzling). But anyway this is the course we are now on and I think we have enough resources to push for a top 7 spot maybe higher (that's the managers job), the club will be financially sound. If top 7 doesn't get your motor running, unfortunately the reality of the league we are currently playing in is that the gap between the top 5 or so and the rest is bigger than ever, as it's more about money than ever. Which incidentally, is why I think comparisons with most of the Doug era are a bit moot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morpheus Posted November 22, 2012 Share Posted November 22, 2012 In a sense of the partial correctness in areas of your post you have the right thinking but the ending didn't quite match. Let's say Arsenal. I will use this team as my example here. Anelka, Reyes, Fabregas, Nasri, Van Persie, I could keep going - All 'cherry picked' if you like! But!. Look at how much money these players arrived for at Arsenal and who where they? Then look at the time & service they contributed there and the amounts each of them all went to 'bigger clubs' for and the profit made! ..Yet Arsenal remain in the top 4 year upon year so it is not impossible at all and this is what Lerner is now planning on Lambert doing here and will back him to do this along with making a return along the way too. The difference is though which i tried to point out in my post is that all of the above players were happy to stay with Arsenal due to challenging for honours and being in the Champions League! We won't be able to offer that to our possible young successes and they will take flight a lot sooner than those at Arsenal and i'm afraid therein lies the fallibility of your debate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimzk5 Posted November 22, 2012 Share Posted November 22, 2012 what some posters dont seem to see was how different the premier league was just 5 seasons ago when we were throwing money around like confetti, at the time man utd and chelsea were the only clubs who were uncatachable really, liverpool and arsenal were begining to show that the sky4 dominance of getting into the champions league was actually a realistic aim for the likes of villa and spurs so we gambled heavily with a manager that, in hindsight should not have been given the sort of funds he had. for every shrewed signing like ashley young there was a marlon harwood, for john carew you had a steve sidwell, shit players on massive wages that he left on the bench because MON himself realised they were **** all good. and then it all changed when sheik mansoor rocked up at man city, at that moment the game changed overnight because instead of having 2 places to try and get into the CL, we now had only 1 with man utd, chelsea and man city now practically guaranteed to take the other 3 and whilst we had a very good first 11, those players with real worth and value suddenly wanted out and were coveted by clubs either already in the CL or with a better chance at getting there than us, at this point we had a mental manager hell bent on signing a shit aiden mgeady for £12million as the player to help us into that elusive 4th place, he was told to shift the players he brought but didnt play, but he walked out leaving us with a wage bill that accounted for 103% of our revenue and a stash of players that no one wanted to buy because a)they werent very good and because they were all on 4 year £45k a week deals. so at that point we had 2 options, hire another manager and throw more money at a decreasing gap of CL football or cut the wage bill down to sustainable level where growth is promoted by signing younger players who hopefully see us as a club they can achieve something with, rather than the others who wanted out as soon as the going got tough and or we hire a manager with a track record of signing good youth and improve the scouting network so we can sign talanted players for pennies when they're unknown rather than the previous method of spending millions on them and then realising there not that good. this was the job GH started but had to stop because of ill health, then the AMC debacle which i believe was a typical american "this is a crazy idea, but it just might work" project, which brings us on to PL who is a young manager himself who believes that youth and wanting to play for aston villa is more important than reputation. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kiwivillan Posted November 22, 2012 Share Posted November 22, 2012 What has he done different to Mike Ashley who was being hounded out of Newcastle and now their fortunes have changed. I can't see much difference. Some people are unrealistic on how much an owner can really do to influence results on the pitch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big_John_10 Posted November 22, 2012 Share Posted November 22, 2012 I think some underestimate how much they can. Hiring houllier and Mcleish had a massive influence on what happens on the pitch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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