Eames Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 nah. he f**ked my football club. guessing it doesnt bother you. At what point did Randy sinking c.£200m into Aston Villa "**** it?" Jeez, he told one manager with flaws he couldn't spunk shit loads of cash on players anymore so manager with flaws flounced out. He then appointed another manager with a dodgy ticker and different flaws who was starting to sort the club out and then got it. He then appointed a total muppet who most were prepared to give a chance to but proved to be a total muppet. He then appointed another manager with flaws. A few bad decisions does not the devil incarnate make. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big_John_10 Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 That's the thing. Lerner gets things terribly wrong with finances and managerial appointments and its shrugged off as a few bad decisions. Yet it's precisely the reason we have been worried about relegation the past 2 years and now sit in 18th place. You insult Mcleish in your post but have no problem with what Lerner has done. It's very strange. Who has contributed more to our current situation Mcleish or Lerner? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kingfisher Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 I think he's appointed a young on-the-up manager with a great record and backed him responsibly. The ball is in the managers court to keep us up, and I think he will do that. We are where we are due to a manager with health issues being replaced by a poorly judged appointment. But I think we've got through that period of instability, and furthermore I think we'll see a steady climb up the table over the next couple of seasons. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eames Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 That's the thing. Lerner gets things terribly wrong with finances and managerial appointments and its shrugged off as a few bad decisions. Yet it's precisely the reason we have been worried about relegation the past 2 years and now sit in 18th place. You insult Mcleish in your post but have no problem with what Lerner has done. It's very strange. Who has contributed more to our current situation Mcleish or Lerner? As I tried to argue earlier, Lerner is not solely at fault for the finances. After 2 top 6 seasons with MON he opted to back him for a third. He plainly should not have done that, but I can forgive his going with the flow until we failed to break the top 4 for the third season running. Lerner has backed all of his managers - I respect him for that. He has invested it the "little extras" (free coaches, mosaics, The Holte Suite etc etc,) - I repect him for that. He has pumped £200m of his own money into a business - I respect him for that. I don't think Lerner is blameless - of course he isn't - that would be a ridiculous position for anyone to take. Just as ridiculous in fact, as attempting to argue that he is solely repsonsible for all the ills of Aston Villa Football Club, because he isn't either. I believe the bloke deserves a great deal more respect that he gets because he has put his money where his mouth is and got burned. So now he's more cautious. That's fair enough. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villan_007 Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 I don't think he doesn't care, I'm sure he cares about his investment but since when is that enough? Mcleish would have cared. Heskey would have cared. Do you want them near the team because they care? Why you have brought Mcleish and Heskey into this I dont know - they are manager / player. They have nothnig to do with the running of the club. Lerner cares enough to stay and fix the mess. He could easily see us as a loss and **** off, selling to anyone who gave him half of what he put in. He is financially secure, he doesn't need us. What exactly do you want from him - What isn't enough?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
houllierout Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 At what point did Randy sinking c.£200m into Aston Villa "**** it?" Well if you read the above you'd see that when he was unable to get any money back for players. Unable to set a wage budget that wouldnt result in losses. Oh and your missing the fact he hasnt invested any money. He's lent it from his family fund. Jeez, he told one manager with flaws he couldn't spunk shit loads of cash on players anymore so manager with flaws flounced out. MON got compensation for constructive dismissal. I think we can now speak with confidence that what happening was Randy was telling him he couldnt buy anyone. We were selling Milner (which i might add Randy did anyway bringing in useless Ireland) and that people with high wages would have to go. This made MONs job impossible. He then appointed another manager with a dodgy ticker and different flaws who was starting to sort the club out and then got it. Over the hill manager who was only saved by our form when he was ill. He then paid him off for his troubles in nearly relegating us (2 games to go before we were safe!) and being unable to carry on at the club. He then appointed a total muppet who most were prepared to give a chance to but proved to be a total muppet. whilst ignoring the fans who protested against it and showed him they knew more about the club than him! Nice. He then appointed another manager with flaws. A few bad decisions does not the devil incarnate make. Nope dont believe in the devil. Randy's actually real and actually butt f******* us whilst he gets more money owed to his fund he'll get back anyway when/if he sells Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kingfisher Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 Well if you read the above you'd see that when he was unable to get any money back for players. Unable to set a wage budget that wouldnt result in losses. Oh and your missing the fact he hasnt invested any money. He's lent it from his family fund. MON got compensation for constructive dismissal. I think we can now speak with confidence that what happening was Randy was telling him he couldnt buy anyone. We were selling Milner (which i might add Randy did anyway bringing in useless Ireland) and that people with high wages would have to go. This made MONs job impossible. Over the hill manager who was only saved by our form when he was ill. He then paid him off for his troubles in nearly relegating us (2 games to go before we were safe!) and being unable to carry on at the club. whilst ignoring the fans who protested against it and showed him they knew more about the club than him! Nice. Nope dont believe in the devil. Randy's actually real and actually butt f******* us whilst he gets more money owed to his fund he'll get back anyway when/if he sells Yes, but we seem to entering a period of stability now and that's a good thing. Your concerns, or many of them are/have been addressed. Books are now seemingly being balanced, young hungry manager etc. What are your views on the current situation and the future? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big_John_10 Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 Why you have brought Mcleish and Heskey into this I dont know - they are manager / player. They have nothnig to do with the running of the club. Lerner cares enough to stay and fix the mess. He could easily see us as a loss and **** off, selling to anyone who gave him half of what he put in. He is financially secure, he doesn't need us. What exactly do you want from him - What isn't enough?? Because like I said since when is caring just enough? And I don't care how rich he is, he's not gonna take a big loss just to get out. Him not selling the club isn't proof that he cares deeply about us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villan_007 Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 Because like I said since when is caring just enough? And I don't care how rich he is, he's not gonna take a big loss just to get out. Him not selling the club isn't proof that he cares deeply about us. Can you just answer then what you'd like him to do? is it just leave? or could he do something to get you back on side? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VillaForever1970 Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 Sooo Lerner should **** off because he is not perfect and made mistakes in the past? For someone who will have loads of cash and never make any mistakes? Good luck with that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big_John_10 Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 As I tried to argue earlier, Lerner is not solely at fault for the finances. After 2 top 6 seasons with MON he opted to back him for a third. He plainly should not have done that, but I can forgive his going with the flow until we failed to break the top 4 for the third season running. Lerner has backed all of his managers - I respect him for that. He has invested it the "little extras" (free coaches, mosaics, The Holte Suite etc etc,) - I repect him for that. He has pumped £200m of his own money into a business - I respect him for that. I don't think Lerner is blameless - of course he isn't - that would be a ridiculous position for anyone to take. Just as ridiculous in fact, as attempting to argue that he is solely repsonsible for all the ills of Aston Villa Football Club, because he isn't either. I believe the bloke deserves a great deal more respect that he gets because he has put his money where his mouth is and got burned. So now he's more cautious. That's fair enough. Our main problems have been to do with his decision making. Our issue with finances was our ratio of wages to revenue was far too high. There is no one at the club who should know more about the money coming in and the money going out than Randy Lerner. There is no one at the club who should have more knowledge on the way the club makes money and future projections for this than Randy Lerner. There is no one at the club who should have been responsible for a long term plan more than Randy Lerner. There is no one at the club with more power to control finances than Randy Lerner. He is to blame for the wages getting to such a ridiculous level. He lost control of that and MoN left and he had the chance to correct his mistakes and start again. His appointment of houllier is the reason i soley blame him for our drop down the league and our current issues at the club. Now i'm sure people will think thats crazy but i truly believe had we replaced mon with the right man we would be a top 8 club right now building again to challenge the top clubs. Do you not think that getting a lambert type appointment then and giving them 2 and a half years and the money houllier, mcleish and lambert had spent, plus any compensation we've had to pay out that we'd be in a good position right now? I truly believe if he'd got that appointment right no one would be still be arguing about MoN, no one would view Lerner in a bad light and we'd all be watching a good team in a strong position. But he didn't get it right. I don't see how anyone but lerner can be blamed for the appointment of houllier. So after those two massive mistakes he had the chance to redeem himself again and instead he ended up making probably the worst managerial appointment any premiership owner has ever made. Again i don't see who else you can blame but Lerner. He's made a good decision now but i didn't think our summer business was good enough. I'll admit that Lerner may well turn out to be a good owner. Its not impossible for him to run the club better and get us back up there but i blame him completely for the mess we've become now. Sooo Lerner should **** off because he is not perfect and made mistakes in the past? For someone who will have loads of cash and never make any mistakes? Good luck with that. Did you want mcleish to stay as manager? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kingfisher Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 He's made a good decision now but i didn't think our summer business was good enough. Which is the managers remit. I'll admit that Lerner may well turn out to be a good owner. Its not impossible for him to run the club better and get us back up there but i blame him completely for the mess we've become now. That's balanced and fair. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
romavillan Posted November 21, 2012 VT Supporter Share Posted November 21, 2012 Sooo Lerner should **** off because he is not perfect and made mistakes in the past? For someone who will have loads of cash and never make any mistakes? Good luck with that. Did you want mcleish to stay as manager? um wtf has wanting mcleish to stay as manager got to do with anything VillaForever1970 said? your constant obsession with lerner is bordering on mental. why not answer what exactly it is that you want RL to do? are you holding out for a rich arab to invest a billion and turn us in to the next man city or something? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big_John_10 Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 Which is the managers remit. Which is dictated by the funds made available. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big_John_10 Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 um wtf has wanting mcleish to stay as manager got to do with anything VillaForever1970 said? your constant obsession with lerner is bordering on mental. why not answer what exactly it is that you want RL to do? are you holding out for a rich arab to invest a billion and turn us in to the next man city or something? Could you not describe mcleish as not perfect and making mistakes in the past? Yet no one wanted him to stick around. And why was it perfectly acceptable to abuse, complain and moan about mcleish because you wanted better or felt he was doing the club no good but its not when it comes to Lerner? Who has done more damage to aston villa? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villan_007 Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 Could you not describe mcleish as not perfect and making mistakes in the past? Yet no one wanted him to stick around. And why was it perfectly acceptable to abuse, complain and moan about mcleish because you wanted better or felt he was doing the club no good but its not when it comes to Lerner? Who has done more damage to aston villa? John - Multiple posters have asked you on many occassions now what it is you want RL to do - what it is that will get you back onside. You keep ignoring it. Put up or shut up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big_John_10 Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 John - Multiple posters have asked you on many occassions now what it is you want RL to do - what it is that will get you back onside. You keep ignoring it. Put up or shut up. I've said it many times at many points. Read or shut up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villan_007 Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 I've said it many times at many points. Read or shut up. As expected - no answer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kingfisher Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 Which is dictated by the funds made available. Which is dictated by what we can afford. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VillaForever1970 Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 Did you want mcleish to stay as manager? Are you only talking with yourself as you seem to be ignoring lots of people's points? Perhaps I can help again, Lerner cannot afford it for that reason you want him so sell up to a new magical owner. When they run out of cash they can sell up too thank you very much. We only want owners who will spend spend spend, if you cannot run along. Oh and football doesn't exist outside the premier league. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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