lexicon Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 lexicon, can you summarise a couple of the other threads too please, i can't be arsed to read all the PL and relegation threads for example I'll get on it bro. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big_John_10 Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 Are you only talking with yourself as you seem to be ignoring lots of people's points? Perhaps I can help again, Lerner cannot afford it for that reason you want him so sell up to a new magical owner. When they run out of cash they can sell up too thank you very much. We only want owners who will spend spend spend, if you cannot run along. Oh and football doesn't exist outside the premier league. Lerner can't afford what? You really think just surviving is the best we can afford? Why would you be happy with that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big_John_10 Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 He lost control of that and MoN left and he had the chance to correct his mistakes and start again. His appointment of houllier is the reason i soley blame him for our drop down the league and our current issues at the club. Now i'm sure people will think thats crazy but i truly believe had we replaced mon with the right man we would be a top 8 club right now building again to challenge the top clubs. Do you not think that getting a lambert type appointment then and giving them 2 and a half years and the money houllier, mcleish and lambert had spent, plus any compensation we've had to pay out that we'd be in a good position right now? I truly believe if he'd got that appointment right no one would be still be arguing about MoN, no one would view Lerner in a bad light and we'd all be watching a good team in a strong position. But he didn't get it right. I don't see how anyone but lerner can be blamed for the appointment of houllier. Anyone disagree? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brumerican Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 If Lerner was to blame then what ? How long do you continuing blaming him and to what end ? Do you wake up and think to yourself "you know what I think Lerner is to blame and I felt the same yesterday and the day before. I think I may continue to blame him repeatedly today and tomorrow too . I have to make sure everyone knows that Lerner is to blame . I realise that having established where the blame lies there is not a lot I can accomplish on the matter other than to continue the attribution of blame upon Mr Lerner. I don't care how tediously dull I may appear as long as everyone is aware of where the blame should be placed. " Blaming people only gets you so far and it only needs to be done the once. The important thing is resolution. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kingfisher Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 He lost control of that and MoN left and he had the chance to correct his mistakes and start again. His appointment of houllier is the reason i soley blame him for our drop down the league and our current issues at the club. Now i'm sure people will think thats crazy but i truly believe had we replaced mon with the right man we would be a top 8 club right now building again to challenge the top clubs. Do you not think that getting a lambert type appointment then and giving them 2 and a half years and the money houllier, mcleish and lambert had spent, plus any compensation we've had to pay out that we'd be in a good position right now? I truly believe if he'd got that appointment right no one would be still be arguing about MoN, no one would view Lerner in a bad light and we'd all be watching a good team in a strong position. But he didn't get it right. I don't see how anyone but lerner can be blamed for the appointment of houllier. Anyone disagree? No disagreement here. But what are your views on what is happening now? We seem to entering a period of stability and that's a good thing, surely. Your concerns, or many of them are/have been addressed. Books are now seemingly being balanced, we have a sustainable transfer and wage structure, that's a good thing right? Or do you think we should have unsustainable budgets like the ones you criticised us for having in the past? We've appointed a young hungry manager who's stock is on the up, one with a great record. Would you have preferred someone else, older/with European experience? What are your views on the current situation and the future? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big_John_10 Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 I think lambert is the right manager. With the state of our squad i don't think the wages and fees given to lambert was good enough in the summer as I still think after signing 7 players we still have a poor squad. I think we will spend in January but then i don't know how much of that will be just to keep his investment in the league instead of actually part of a plan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big_John_10 Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 If Lerner was to blame then what ? How long do you continuing blaming him and to what end ? Do you wake up and think to yourself "you know what I think Lerner is to blame and I felt the same yesterday and the day before. I think I may continue to blame him repeatedly today and tomorrow too . I have to make sure everyone knows that Lerner is to blame . I realise that having established where the blame lies there is not a lot I can accomplish on the matter other than to continue the attribution of blame upon Mr Lerner. I don't care how tediously dull I may appear as long as everyone is aware of where the blame should be placed. " Blaming people only gets you so far and it only needs to be done the once. The important thing is resolution. Thanks. What's the difference between me constantly blaming him and others constantly defending him or shifting the blame? You seem to only have a problem with the one side being repeated. Did you have a problem with the constant repeated blame attached to Doug or Mcleish when fans weren't happy? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big_John_10 Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 Can I just ask. Why did people want Doug gone? Was it not so we could do better? Was it not so we could push on? The people who don't like Randy Lerner and the way he has run the club only want the same. What's the difference? I asked previously, what was the point of £ signs, protests, hatred and abuse towards Doug if the last few years are fine for us? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kingfisher Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 I think lambert is the right manager. With the state of our squad i don't think the wages and fees given to lambert was good enough in the summer as I still think after signing 7 players we still have a poor squad. I think we will spend in January but then i don't know how much of that will be just to keep his investment in the league instead of actually part of a plan. So you think he has got the manager appointment right. Good. That's cleared up. You think the players signed are not of high enough calibre? That's the managers remit, I think his £20M outlay was competitive and hopefully sustainable. The wage structure we can assume will be similar, and based on revenue. These are good things right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brumerican Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 Thanks. What's the difference between me constantly blaming him and others constantly defending him or shifting the blame? You seem to only have a problem with the one side being repeated. Did you have a problem with the constant repeated blame attached to Doug or Mcleish when fans weren't happy? I have no problem with one side or the other as people are entitled to their opinions and there is definitely a degree of subjectivity to take into account as well . There are numerous variables to be considered whilst trying to decide just how Villa came to be in their current situation , so to attribute all of it to one factor (in this instance Mr Lerner) seems rather shortsighted and narrow minded . I never had a problem with people who were not happy with Doug or McLeish either, but yes I do get annoyed with the constant part . If somebody said they wanted Doug or Mcleish in or out I would be fine either way, but if they were to say it 20 times a day , everyday, then yes that would be annoying . You have attributed the blame to where you feel it lies . Everybody is extremely clear about that I'd imagine . So what is the next step ? Stuck record or evolution ? I know you aren't the only one and my apologies if you feel like you are being singled out . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big_John_10 Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 What kind of quality could we really expect for the fees and especially the wages paid to Lowton, Bennett, Westwood and Bowery? I think some of the signings were good but like I said above i don't think lamber could have really done much more when he needed so much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kingfisher Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 What kind of quality could we really expect for the fees and especially the wages paid to Lowton, Bennett, Westwood and Bowery? I think some of the signings were good but like I said above i don't think lamber could have really done much more when he needed so much. Like I said, who we sign is the managers remit. If our budget is x, and based on revenue, we have to cut our cloth accordingly. Or do you want us to return to unsustainable budgets again, like you criticised us for doing before? You can't have it both ways. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big_John_10 Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 If this is the most we can afford then what can we realistically expect for the future? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morpheus Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 We seem to entering a period of stability and that's a good thing, surely. Do you call being in the bottom three 'entering a period of stability?' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VillaForever1970 Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 Lerner can't afford what? You really think just surviving is the best we can afford? Why would you be happy with that? Happy or not I don't care, nothing I can do about it. I enjoy supporting villa regardless, take the rough with the smooth; premier league or league 2. You seem only bothered by spending lots of money which seems to mean success, forget it at villa not going to happen anytime soon. Lerner cannot afford the bucket loads of cash you crave he is also human so is not perfect like you expect him to be. Get over it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kingfisher Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 Do you call being in the bottom three 'entering a period of stability?' I'm looking at the bigger picture. I think we have a good manager. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big_John_10 Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 Happy or not I don't care, nothing I can do about it. I enjoy supporting villa regardless, take the rough with the smooth; premier league or league 2. You seem only bothered by spending lots of money which seems to mean success, forget it at villa not going to happen anytime soon. Lerner cannot afford the bucket loads of cash you crave he is also human so is not perfect like you expect him to be. Get over it. Aren't we 7th in the league earners table? Haven't sponsorship and merchandise deals increased? Tv money is going up. And on top of that Lerner has just sold the browns for a ridiculous amount of money. I just don't agree that premiership survival is all we can afford to aim for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kingfisher Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 Aren't we 7th in the league earners table? Haven't sponsorship and merchandise deals increased? Tv money is going up. And on top of that Lerner has just sold the browns for a ridiculous amount of money. I just don't agree that premiership survival is all we can afford to aim for. Without looking I'm guessing, but I think our summer spending probably reflects that fairly. I think our wages must be low at the moment, but lets see what happens in January. I think we have the right manager and enough resources as a club to expect a top ten finish, I think Lambert will bring us that next season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morpheus Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 If this is the most we can afford then what can we realistically expect for the future? I think this is probably one of the best questions since my time on VT. Another poster in a different thread stated fairly that our objective should be to get away from our previous four year cycle with average players on extortionate unsustainable wages. He was right, but i pointed out that if Lambert's philosophy of buying younger players from lower leagues and on the continent is successful and we do indeed pull away from the trap door, how long do you think it will be before players such as Benteke and Westwood will be cherry picked? We are not Man U, Chelsea, Arsenal or Man City who can keep their younger players happy with the possibility of silverware or big wages so if they are successful they will leave and Lambert will replace those young players with more young players and the cycle starts again. While this continues, what chance do we have of any success? Are we to become another Crewe? Its all very well and good to say that we are going to build a new vibrant young team but they simply aren't going to stay with us long enough to build a successful dynasty here. We won't pay enough and we won't be successful enough to keep them. The only way i can see us ever gaining any success again is by implementing a juxtaposition of the two. Spending the right amount of money on experienced quality in the 26-30 range while introducing the younger players in and around that. Lambert's philosophy might get us mid table mediocrity but we should and expect more from our future than that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VillaForever1970 Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 Aren't we 7th in the league earners table? Haven't sponsorship and merchandise deals increased? Tv money is going up. And on top of that Lerner has just sold the browns for a ridiculous amount of money. I just don't agree that premiership survival is all we can afford to aim for. Thank god it's so black and white. We get all this money overnight I sure and have no debts to sort out. **** it lets just spend spend spend, that never goes wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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