AshVilla Posted August 18, 2014 Share Posted August 18, 2014 So relieved i didn't see any of this the weekend on Bojan I noticed the latch ditch block at the end by Senderos had that been baker he would have gone in feet first and probably snapped the poor guy in half giving a penalty away in the process Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post lexicon Posted August 18, 2014 Popular Post Share Posted August 18, 2014 So now he's getting slagged off for hypothetical events in the past. Wonders never cease. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smetrov Posted August 18, 2014 Share Posted August 18, 2014 I still think Baker maybe ok - early on in the first team looked quite good - he just wasn't ready to play week in week out and his confidence went. to play the odd game I reckon he will be ok for us. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GREAT_BEARD_OF_ZEUS Posted August 18, 2014 Share Posted August 18, 2014 I think Baker plays because he has more of a physical presence than Clark. Take Fulham away last year - he played and he took the role of attacking long balls being launched into our half. He then typically came off injured, and we lost the physical nature of our defence. Vlaar is strong but he's not particularly tall, hence why I think Baker gets the nod. Clark is a good player, but he's not quite strong enough to be a top level CB and he's not quite good enough to be a top level midfielder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bradarmstrong_ Posted August 18, 2014 Share Posted August 18, 2014 Either him or Clark should be sold. They are 4th and 5th choice centre backs now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smetrov Posted August 18, 2014 Share Posted August 18, 2014 I think Baker plays because he has more of a physical presence than Clark. Take Fulham away last year - he played and he took the role of attacking long balls being launched into our half. He then typically came off injured, and we lost the physical nature of our defence. Vlaar is strong but he's not particularly tall, hence why I think Baker gets the nod. Clark is a good player, but he's not quite strong enough to be a top level CB and he's not quite good enough to be a top level midfielder. I remember against Everton at home last season - Baker had Lukaku in his pocket - unfortunatley and injury elsewhere meant that Baker was moved to FB - and Clark went CB - Lukaku subsequently scored. Agree about the physical presence of Baker over Clark. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lexicon Posted August 18, 2014 Share Posted August 18, 2014 Baker and Clark both have various strengths and weaknesses but they're both still young for the position they play - they need time and experience because there is a massive, massive difference between 24 year old CBs and 29 year old CBs and it's all to do with experience IMO. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo985 Posted August 18, 2014 VT Supporter Share Posted August 18, 2014 I think Baker is the epitome of the English centre half, and I don't really mean that in a good way. Body on the line, heads everything. Gets plaudits for that and for throwing himself fearlessly into tackles. But the more cultured skills of a very good centreback are lacking. he's not great on the ball, he doesn't read the game all that well and his decisions don't seem to be too sound. I think he's ok. But that's it. I don't hold much hope in him developing into a very good defender. Not bad to have in the squad but he'd be rightly fourth choice at the moment. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattyvilla Posted August 18, 2014 Share Posted August 18, 2014 Either him or Clark should be sold. They are 4th and 5th choice centre backs now. Would be foolish in my opinion with Okore being out so long and struggling again 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted August 18, 2014 Share Posted August 18, 2014 should send him on a loan spell come September 1st if Vlaar stays 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrentVilla Posted August 18, 2014 Moderator Share Posted August 18, 2014 Baker and Clark both have various strengths and weaknesses but they're both still young for the position they play - they need time and experience because there is a massive, massive difference between 24 year old CBs and 29 year old CBs and it's all to do with experience IMO. I agree with your general point but not in regards to these two players specifically, I just don't think they are good enough. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lexicon Posted August 18, 2014 Share Posted August 18, 2014 I think Baker is the epitome of the English centre half, and I don't really mean that in a good way. Body on the line, heads everything. Gets plaudits for that and for throwing himself fearlessly into tackles. But the more cultured skills of a very good centreback are lacking. he's not great on the ball, he doesn't read the game all that well and his decisions don't seem to be too sound. I think he's ok. But that's it. I don't hold much hope in him developing into a very good defender. Not bad to have in the squad but he'd be rightly fourth choice at the moment. You rarely get a player that's both physically dominant and good on the ball though - most CB pairings work with one of each complementing the other. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lexicon Posted August 18, 2014 Share Posted August 18, 2014 Baker and Clark both have various strengths and weaknesses but they're both still young for the position they play - they need time and experience because there is a massive, massive difference between 24 year old CBs and 29 year old CBs and it's all to do with experience IMO. I agree with your general point but not in regards to these two players specifically, I just don't think they are good enough. Fair enough - only time will tell at the end of the day. I really hope they make it though, it'd be great to have products of the academy making up more of the first team. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirtysanchez Posted August 18, 2014 Share Posted August 18, 2014 This lad has been given more than enough chances, he isn't good enough for us and I wouldn't be unhappy to see him leave. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCJonah Posted August 18, 2014 Share Posted August 18, 2014 I really thought baker would be the next cahill when he first started but he just hasn't progressed. Maybe that's down to the situation of the club or he's just not good enough. It's probably a bit of both. I would send him out on loan, he really shouldn't be near the first team this year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mickjacobjr Posted August 18, 2014 Share Posted August 18, 2014 Baker is dirt and a total liability time to get rid anytime he plays he makes so many mistakes 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bottle Maker Posted August 18, 2014 Share Posted August 18, 2014 I think a lot of the problem in defence last year was lack of experience, if Baker or Clark were to play with 3 experienced defenders I do not think they would be making those big mistakes as knowing you have capable support around you removes a lot of pressure and let's you get on with your job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skarroki Posted August 18, 2014 Share Posted August 18, 2014 I like Baker and Clark and hope they both have good careers but unfortunately I would move them both on now, maybe on loan at first to make sure they don't improve dramatically in a season once theyre off our books Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kurtsimonw Posted August 18, 2014 Share Posted August 18, 2014 Part of the problem is we haven't had a left back for the past 2 years and it's left him exposed. He's still only 23 and not greatly experienced in the PL. Maybe with competent players either side of him, he'll improve. I certainly have no problem with a player like him being a 4th choice centre half, you can do worse. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ginko Posted August 18, 2014 Share Posted August 18, 2014 I think a lot of the problem in defence last year was lack of experience, if Baker or Clark were to play with 3 experienced defenders I do not think they would be making those big mistakes as knowing you have capable support around you removes a lot of pressure and let's you get on with your job. It's not rocket science though, is it? At 23-years-old and being a member of a Premier League football club, training with Premier League players and playing football at a high level for a number of years, you would think that he would know not to make most of the mistakes he has made. You don't even need to be a professional footballer to know that diving in two-footed and snapping players in two in and around your penalty box is generally going to give away a free kick or penalty. Kids learn that stuff early on. This lack of experience argument only works when the mistakes he makes truly are down to inexperience. Baker consistently makes ridiculous judgements that show he just does not think when he plays, he just acts on impulse and that's not good enough for the Premier League. The day we get rid, I will be much happier and we will be much better off. Utter liability. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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