Ratings & Reactions: Newcastle v Villa

[sidcow]

I couldn't bring myself to watch MOTD. I assume they were just spaffing themselves over Newcastle and made no comment of question about the offsides/cash foul? 

[HKP90]

47 minutes ago, sidcow said:

I couldn't bring myself to watch MOTD. I assume they were just spaffing themselves over Newcastle and made no comment of question about the offsides/cash foul? 

Pretty much. On first (you know that would not have been the case if we'd won 5-1), and then spent a good while discussing Tonali and Isak. To be fair they didn't lay into us too much, although the high line was lambasted.

[TomC]

Does anyone else wish we had a European fixture mid-week this week? I don't want to wait until next Sunday to wash the bad taste from my mouth.

 

[HKP90]

6 hours ago, Random Precision said:

 

 

Worth a read re UE’s tactical style.

I don't understand how, other than perhaps due to fatigue, why a style suited to a cup run would not be suited to the league.

Other way round maybe, cos playing for a draw in a cup competition is folly, but what is a league but an aggregation of individual games? You win all your games, you win the league, simple. Also if this statement refers to a differing approach depending on opposition strength, well that is equally applicable to both cup and league. 

After reading the thread, it appears to be a criticism of UE's system based solely on the Newcastle game. Err...worked OK for most of last season.

It's just a rubbish attempt to extrapolate the failings of one match into a criticism of a system. It's absolute garbage. It also provides no rigour to their argument that what worked last year won't this year. Behold:

Quote

A team with such blatant tactical flaws will not make a dent in the Premier League this season when the quality is so high. They did last season because Villa have some top players that were badly mismanaged under Gerrard/other coaches + Emery is a good coach, but he ain't elite.

So it worked last year because we have some top players. We haven't sold anyone, added two to three top players, but now, for ReAsOns, it won't work any more.

Utter clown this dude. 

Whatever issues resulted in the loss yesterday, you cannot write off the whole approach of UE on the strength of one game, after we had 3rd place form last year during the Emery era.

Maybe a tactic tweak, and either tempering, or better organisation of the high line, maybe, but not a complete do over. 

 

[The_Steve]

2 hours ago, Zhan_Zhuang said:

Still all rather depressing....

Looking back in hindsight Villa were just so tentative and allowed them to play.

First five minutes I commented this doesn't look good...

Yes losing Mings only hindered us further but it such a worry that Villa crumble without him (one player). Others need to rise to the challenge. Mings out potentially long term is going to hurt us due to him being such a collussus last season and I think we will concede goals every week now.

In preseason our highline was undone by the Barcodes twice and also by Brentford twice. Why didn't they learn from it? So naive which is rather worrying....

Newcastle exploited our high line perfectly. We weren't aggressive enough and couldn't handle the press and the fouling. I thought the officials were very poor. But there's no account for Ollie's and Matty's misses nor Ezri's brain fart. We were punished by a far more driven and better team.

[Marka Ragnos]

Five thoughts about how to think about yesterday, after some reflection. Just my tuppence and FWIW ... #UTV 

1. Remember that the Villa we saw after the Mings horror injury was a squad who had just witnessed a truly traumatising event. They simply were not themselves. We must not read too much into what happened vs. Newcastle after the injury, especially for an away match against a CL-level club. We'll get past this.
2. Support our squad. In considering our squad, we do need to separate the players who were probably off their games yesterday due to the Mings loss from the players who have consistently disappointed. Most have not disappointed. But make no mistake: the squad as a whole needs mighty support now. We have some amazing players on our squad who need to know that the fans will be there for them. Ollie, Bouba, Emi Martinez, McGinn, Youri, Diaby, Digne, Pau, Konsa -- they comprise a strong core we should feel good about.
3. Change can be good. It's absolutely not how any of us would want to see Torres or Carlos integrated into Emeryball, but there are many reasons to think that both Torres and Carlos have the capability of being as effective as Tyrone in a system adapted to their unique defensive skill sets. Some version of this was likely going to happen anyway. It's just been forced upon on, sadly.
4. The injuries do totally clarify our transfer needs and bring urgency to the search. Again, not how any of us would want it to happen. There can be no leisurely stroll through the global transfer-market mall now. But NSWE will now know who we need -- and fast.
5. Hang on to the bright spots: There were some: Diaby's goal, Martinez's incredible save, Ollie's frustrating but very close almost-goal, Digne's dignified journeyman efforts, before the Mings injury, we had been responding pretty cooly to being down. We were very much still in the game. Cash's miss did kind of throw things. (We can't miss those!) But we were holding it together, and that counts for something!

Edited August 13, 2023 by Marka Ragnos

[sidcow]

On 12/08/2023 at 19:37, Don_Simon said:

Who said this? Quote it.

Do you seriously want the OP to go back and highlight all the posts from several posters who said they didn't want Harvey Barnes?

[est1874]

It's Monday morning and I still don't feel OK.

[TheFish]

Not on the wind up or anything, but from a Newcastle fan's perspective;

Before the game I was not looking forward to starting the 23/24 season with a game against Emery's Aston Villa. I was sure you'd be well drilled, have high energy in the press and capitalise on your very good players. I was sure Diaby would score because players you're linked with who end up at a league rival always score against you. I genuinely thought it would end up 2-1 for you or for us. 

Then Buendia got injured and my prediction weighed a little more in our favour.

For about 30 minutes it was pretty even, but when Mings went off injured some of the assurance seemed to leak out of your side. It was a strange game where I think we could have scored a few more, you also had good opportunities (Watkins and Cash particularly). 

Was livid when Martinez only got a yellow, but on seeing replays I see there was a covering defender so I guess yellow is what the law demands. Although, if Almiron was taken out by a defender with only the keeper to beat that defender would see red, but that an issue with the law, not the application of it. Don't think anything else was particularly controversial, but I don't think the refereeing was up to much.

All in all, I get that it's a disappointing way to begin the campaign, but one game won't define your season, especially not the first one. You'll go into the game against Everton angry and looking to put things right as soon as possible. Which you will. You're still going to be competing for the European spots at the end of the season, there's time left in the window to try and strengthen and Unai Emery is too good of a coach to not come up with a way to play to a high standard even if you can't.

Hope those who travelled up enjoyed the trip aside from the game.

[est1874]

6 minutes ago, TheFish said:

Not on the wind up or anything, but from a Newcastle fan's perspective;

Before the game I was not looking forward to starting the 23/24 season with a game against Emery's Aston Villa. I was sure you'd be well drilled, have high energy in the press and capitalise on your very good players. I was sure Diaby would score because players you're linked with who end up at a league rival always score against you. I genuinely thought it would end up 2-1 for you or for us. 

Then Buendia got injured and my prediction weighed a little more in our favour.

For about 30 minutes it was pretty even, but when Mings went off injured some of the assurance seemed to leak out of your side. It was a strange game where I think we could have scored a few more, you also had good opportunities (Watkins and Cash particularly). 

Was livid when Martinez only got a yellow, but on seeing replays I see there was a covering defender so I guess yellow is what the law demands. Although, if Almiron was taken out by a defender with only the keeper to beat that defender would see red, but that an issue with the law, not the application of it. Don't think anything else was particularly controversial, but I don't think the refereeing was up to much.

All in all, I get that it's a disappointing way to begin the campaign, but one game won't define your season, especially not the first one. You'll go into the game against Everton angry and looking to put things right as soon as possible. Which you will. You're still going to be competing for the European spots at the end of the season, there's time left in the window to try and strengthen and Unai Emery is too good of a coach to not come up with a way to play to a high standard even if you can't.

Hope those who travelled up enjoyed the trip aside from the game.

Thanks for your measured perspective, was interesting to read.

I think it's a shame that your club could only become relevant again in football via a takeover from a dangerously oppressive, homophobic, deeply sexist and anti-democratic regime, so it's hard to wish you well.

Good team though.

[sheepyvillian]

24 minutes ago, est1874 said:

 

Good team though.

That bit just killed it  for me. Funny as hell.

[tinker]

Emery 1 Howe 1

[sheepyvillian]

21 hours ago, AvfcRigo82 said:

or be at the races beyond that point.

I hope you don't mean the bloody "Blaydon races?" What a dreadful song. Hearing that was just as bad as the scoreline. 

[TheFish]

31 minutes ago, est1874 said:

Thanks for your measured perspective, was interesting to read.

I think it's a shame that your club could only become relevant again in football via a takeover from a dangerously oppressive, homophobic, deeply sexist and anti-democratic regime, so it's hard to wish you well.

Good team though.

The thing for me is that, pretty much everything we've done so far, could have been achieved without being owned by tyrants and despots. Some Ted Boehly figure could have bought us for c£300m, brought in Howe, brought in Ashworth et al. Sold the hope and hype. We've not really gone as wild with the blood money as people confidently predicted, everything has been pretty measured. Every signing, every statement win, any success will have that disquieting asterisk beside it. 

[BOF]

It's amazing how, in the space of 2 days, my appetite for the season has gone from 100 to 0. The Buendia injury followed by the Mings injury and then the result to compound both of them has completely sucked the joy out of this season for me already. I'm sure it'll come back. It always does. But right now to hell with it.

[Zhan_Zhuang]

Football is agony and ecstasy...

Losing Buendia and now Mings plus the injuries to Ramsey, Moreno have really hurt Villa. We lacked a bit of composure, fight and desire on Saturday.

I was initially positive when we had a full complement of players, without Mings our glorious leader I think we will concede way more than hoped this season.

Another transitional season it feels but aren't they all?

Must admit it's difficult to give the Barcodes any credit with their Saudi dictatorship and blood money. Now it seems VAR is in the pocket too as there were dubious decisions, their first two goals would have been chalked off if Villa had scored them. Something isn't right with that, it doesn't seem a level playing field.

Pretty certain with Buendia and Mings Villa would have taken something from the game.

[Follyfoot]

1 minute ago, Mantis said:

If anything the Newcastle game was a bit of a fluke. 2 offside goals, a total defensive clanger leading to another goal, a freak Mings injury early on unsettling everybody etc. Not saying Emery didn't make tactical mistakes but was not a normal game in the slightest.

I don’t understand how those offside decisions were not given taking into account VAR

[Pinebro]

3 minutes ago, Mantis said:

If anything the Newcastle game was a bit of a fluke. 2 offside goals, a total defensive clanger leading to another goal, a freak Mings injury early on unsettling everybody etc. Not saying Emery didn't make tactical mistakes but was not a normal game in the slightest.

Newcastle will do the same to a lot of sides.

As much as it pains me to say it they have developed into a top side.

[birdman]

1 minute ago, Mantis said:

If anything the Newcastle game was a bit of a fluke. 2 offside goals, a total defensive clanger leading to another goal, a freak Mings injury early on unsettling everybody etc. Not saying Emery didn't make tactical mistakes but was not a normal game in the slightest.

I agree. Newcastle were very good and deserved the win however luck was on their side in terms of officiating. More importantly we did not take our chances. We can't afford the Ollie/Cash wastefullness (for example) if we want to do well this season. The Mings injury is somewhat mitigating as I think players were affected.

[TheFish]

Anyone who still thinks there is some kind of conspiracy against their team needs to grow up, in my opinion. The rules of the Premier League have been changed 3 times already to slow Newcastle's ascent, which is fine and fair enough, why would they then also do all they can to help us in the opening game of the season against Aston Villa?

Rather than conspiracy, look instead for incompetence.