Steven Gerrard

[Villatillidie95]

4 minutes ago, VillaParkAvenue said:

Identifying the true leaders (not always the loudest) seems crucial for a new manager arriving. Tuchel apparently made the call more or less the first day at Chelsea. When it’s done, things can move forward and there doesn’t have to be much fuss about it.

Gerrard has seemed to almost enjoy creating power struggles, questioning Mings in the spring and then waiting months before demoting him, bringing things up in public. Immature or just stupid? Or maybe anything to avoid focus on tactics, which doesn’t appear to interest him.

 

There is a way to do things and imo it wasn't a good look the way the whole thing played out in public, not approaching Mings and having a respectful conversation without leading up to this point in the media months beforehand or putting a question mark on the issue whilst we were still playing last season was poor imo. I think Gerrard's man management skills seem very poor, you often see this with ex players as they are not as objective or have had to consider a more strategic side of the game than pure managers.

Why didnt he do it during the long break we had? dropping a grenade so close to the start of the season and expecting everything to be the same was just naive tactics in my view. Its also true as a player he was a great midfielder but he was all blood and thunder, lampard was a much more tactical and clever midfielder who scored more goals but less flashy. However he is not exactly a mastermind either so I guess they will both need to adapt sharpish if they want to keep their jobs

Edited August 8, 2022 by Villatillidie95

[Jas10]

5 minutes ago, Zatman said:

Is a guy outside VP this weekend selling cabbages

Banana skins would be more apt

I mean this pretty much sums up his performance here so far

[Pez1974]

11 minutes ago, Villatillidie95 said:

Richard Keys and Simon Jordan are bang on in their comments. I know Keys is an arrogant so and so, however he is right in the sense that Gerrard has mucked up and made a big call which has backfired. Split the dressing room down the middle, you will have pro and anti mings factions, divisions in the squad with players sitting separately in their own groups in the canteen, on the coaches. The most prescient thing he said is that small problems snowball and turn into bigger issues. We cannot regress and let that happen, we all remember the toxicity of the 15/16 season.

Simon Jordan said there is very real jeopardy on Gerrard at this moment in time and its true, its not only us supporters who are seeing the signs, others in the game or those who are connected to it are not hearing good things about the dressing room at this moment in time which is very concerning for our prospects this season.

need to nip it in the bud now before it spirals

This.

Gerrard has seemingly gone out of his way to pick a fight with Mings. He could've just said he wanted to 'freshen it up', and made Mings vice captain, and left it there. It's not like Mings as captain was ever a problem - people differ on him as a player, but as a captain of this club - no fault.

He clearly has favourites too - and one of them is his 'mate'. This is also an easy stick to beat him with, and Coutinho is not worth his place in the side right now.
McGinn is a top man - but he should not be captain in my view. He shouldn't be in the side either in my opinion. 

If he changes now - he's admitting he has screwed pre-season up - which will seriously hurt his reputation (but he can at least salvage it by learning).
If he doesn't, and goes stubborn - his top level managerial career will probably be over by Christmas. 

 

[Jas10]

6 minutes ago, VillaParkAvenue said:

Identifying the true leaders (not always the loudest) seems crucial for a new manager arriving. Tuchel apparently made the call more or less the first day at Chelsea. When it’s done, things can move forward and there doesn’t have to be much fuss about it.

Gerrard has seemed to almost enjoy creating power struggles, questioning Mings in the spring and then waiting months before demoting him, bringing things up in public. Immature or just stupid? Or maybe anything to avoid focus on tactics, which doesn’t appear to interest him.

 

[Zatman]

10 minutes ago, Pez1974 said:

This.

Gerrard has seemingly gone out of his way to pick a fight with Mings. He could've just said he wanted to 'freshen it up', and made Mings vice captain, and left it there. It's not like Mings as captain was ever a problem - people differ on him as a player, but as a captain of this club - no fault.

He clearly has favourites too - and one of them is his 'mate'. This is also an easy stick to beat him with, and Coutinho is not worth his place in the side right now.
McGinn is a top man - but he should not be captain in my view. He shouldn't be in the side either in my opinion. 

If he changes now - he's admitting he has screwed pre-season up - which will seriously hurt his reputation (but he can at least salvage it by learning).
If he doesn't, and goes stubborn - his top level managerial career will probably be over by Christmas. 

 

Managers change captains a lot and never this much furore because the manager has made a big deal. Think Delph took the armband from Vlaar mid season and was no scandal under Sherwood

This is a self inflicted wound, if he sat down with Mings behind closed doors and explained it would be fine but manager alone played this in public

[JAMAICAN-VILLAN]

Bloody hell when Souness of all people doesn't agree with treatment of players you're on shakey ground. ( Can't find the video to link it's from TalkSport "

“Let me tell you how dressing rooms work.”

“You dig out a player, they tell mates, they speak to agents, you’re on sticky ground.”

Graeme Souness reveals why Gerrard must be careful with how he deals with Mings.

Edited August 8, 2022 by JAMAICAN-VILLAN

[Stevo985]

I'm not Gerrard out yet but I remain thoroughly unimpressed.

Apart from attracting a couple of signings we arguably couldn't have made without him, I'm not sure he's done anything good here.

He needs a massive upward turn and he needs it quick

[Rustibrooks]

1 minute ago, JAMAICAN-VILLAN said:

Bloody hell when Souness of all people doesn't agree with treatment of players you're on shakey ground. ( Can't find the video to link it's from TalkSport "

“Let me tell you how dressing rooms work.”

“You dig out a player, they tell mates, they speak to agents, you’re on sticky ground.”

Graeme Souness reveals why Gerrard must be careful with how he deals with Mings.

I was coming here to comment on the same thing. I haven't watched the full clip on YouTube though, but I've thought if the media are catching on to this then its not good.

 

 

[sparrow1988]

24 minutes ago, Stevo985 said:

I'm not Gerrard out yet but I remain thoroughly unimpressed.

Apart from attracting a couple of signings we arguably couldn't have made without him, I'm not sure he's done anything good here.

He needs a massive upward turn and he needs it quick

My sentiments also. 

[JAMAICAN-VILLAN]

28 minutes ago, Rustibrooks said:

I was coming here to comment on the same thing. I haven't watched the full clip on YouTube though, but I've thought if the media are catching on to this then its not good.

 

 

Having just watched the full video in the Mings thread, it's actually alot more balanced.

Some good points made in there.

Truth is, we really don't know what goes on behind the scenes.

What's happened with him and Tyrone, what Tyrone personality might ACTUALLY be like etc.

Was he one of the ones described to be " Not buying into what we are trying to do " ?

Now I know it's quite easy for people who dislike him to instantly say " And rightfully so "  but if he's actually been undermining the team in the process that's a different thing altogether.

I've got a feeling that Tyrone ( As much as i love him ) might have billy big bollox tendencies, and SG might be the same.

That's probably not a good combination if true.

Dick swinging competitions are the last thing we need ( Unless they are the friendly boozed up kind obviously )

Edited August 8, 2022 by JAMAICAN-VILLAN

[TRO]

19 hours ago, Adam2003 said:

That argument means you’d never change manager ever though… it could always be worse.

but looking at Arteta at Arsenal....they was all calling for his head, but applied patience.

SG is now making some mistakes imo.....He has to be given time, to revisit them.

The biggest problem for me is......signing players too puny, with no fight.....we already have an abundance of them.

[Tom13]

Just now, TRO said:

but looking at Arteta at Arsenal....they was all calling for his head, but applied patience.

SG is now making some mistakes imo.....He has to be given time, to revisit them.

The biggest problem for me is......signing players too puny, with no fight.....we already have an abundance of them.

Problem is Gerrard's views on what makes a good side are very concerning. Leaving out Buendia but playing McGinn full 90 every game, very worrying. It's not just performances and results, it's the decisions contributing to them that everyone bar him seems able to see.

[Keyblade]

3 minutes ago, JAMAICAN-VILLAN said:

Having just watched the full video in the Mings thread, it's actually alot more balanced.

Some good points made in there.

Truth is, we really don't know what goes on behind the scenes.

What's happened with him and Tyrone, what Tyrone personality might ACTUALLY be like etc.

Was he one of the ones described to be " Not buying into what we are trying to do " ?

Now I know it's quite easy for people who dislike him to instantly say " And rightfully so "  but if he's actually been undermining the team in the process that's a different thing altogether.

I've got a feeling that Tyrone ( As much as i love him ) might have billy big bollox tendencies, and SG might be the same.

That's probably not a good combination if true.

Dick swinging competitions are the last thing we need ( Unless they are the friendly boozed up kind obviously )

Everything we know about Tyrone, do you really think he has billy big bollox tendencies? He seems like the most humble guy in the team, especially given his football journey. Him being vocal and strong-willed doesn't mean he's arrogant. Either Gerrard is misconstruing that as arrogance, or he just doesn't like that period. 

[maqroll]

Did he really not clap the away support? 

[IrishVilla10]

2 minutes ago, Tom13 said:

Problem is Gerrard's views on what makes a good side are very concerning. Leaving out Buendia but playing McGinn full 90 every game, very worrying. It's not just performances and results, it's the decisions contributing to them that everyone bar him seems able to see.

It’s become very draining

[JAMAICAN-VILLAN]

1 minute ago, Keyblade said:

Him being vocal and strong-willed doesn't mean he's arrogant. Either Gerrard is misconstruing that as arrogance, or he just doesn't like that period. 

Maybe I chose the wrong terms, and you're closer to it.

 

[Davkaus]

2 minutes ago, Keyblade said:

Everything we know about Tyrone, do you really think he has billy big bollox tendencies? He seems like the most humble guy in the team, especially given his football journey. Him being vocal and strong-willed doesn't mean he's arrogant. Either Gerrard is misconstruing that as arrogance, or he just doesn't like that period. 

Agreed. Especially with the message that Mings put out publicly, I find it very hard to believe that he's been sulking or acting unprofessionally.

[JAMAICAN-VILLAN]

2 minutes ago, maqroll said:

Did he really not clap the away support? 

Not sure, but I don't think he even shook opposition team/managers hands afterwards either ( Or maybe I didn't see it ).

Obviously he was fuming, and rightly so, but there is a worry he can't control his temper or composure ?

Then again, Football is a passionate and emotional game, we get wound up to the point of vein bursting at times, so imagine a Manager or someone who desperately wants to win, feel as if they've done all they can to prepare the team for a game and then you get that dross.

I have said though that, he is also largely to blame for that too though.

[Talldarkandransome]

I was happy enough with his appointment (not that I wanted Deano sacked though). 

After an initial improvement in results we seem to have gone backwards. His assistant has left and he changed the captaincy to someone who you wouldn't normally call a captain. 

Something must have happened with Mings and Mings doesn't come across as a Billy big balls. A captain is allowed to question the manager, the players would want him to do that. If the manager doesn't like being questioned then maybe he's in the wrong profession. 

I don't know what the club should do about it and all choices could make it worse.

[Wurzel]