The Midfield Three

[CVByrne]

3 minutes ago, thabucks said:

Midfield needs ripping up and starting again. Sacrifices will be required so expect Sanson McGinn Luiz to be all be in the firing line and repalced. It just doesn’t work 

I assume Sanson gets his chance now, so we can see how he gets on with a run of games in the team ahead of Luiz.

[Delphinho123]

2 minutes ago, CVByrne said:

Yeah it's the midfields fault. Nobody was showing for the ball and if they did, they would pass it back to one of the CBs. Luiz and McGinn in particular have never had a worse game for us than yesterday.

They were absolutely dreadful. 

[duke313]

9 minutes ago, thabucks said:

Midfield needs ripping up and starting again. Sacrifices will be required so expect Sanson McGinn Luiz to be all be in the firing line and repalced. It just doesn’t work 

I agree the midfield isn't working, but you can hardly blame Sanson, he's barely played.

[Phil Silvers]

Feels like we miss SJM when he's out, feels like when Dougie is out we miss him too but I just do not like them together. I think we might have a better option at CDM in young Tim so that's what I'd try first. He hasn't had any experience  so throwing him straight in might be a push but he couldn't be any worse then Dougie on Saturday. Sanson can play that role too, I'd start Sanson and give TI 30 minutes.

[The Fun Factory]

And yet on paper JJ is getting rave reviews from the national media, McGinn seems to be constantly linked to United, and Luiz is almost a regular for Brazil. The parts are greater than the sum.

[A'Villan]

McGinn and Luiz were great when played as a holding midfield duo last season in a 4-2-3-1.

I know we have a new manager, but you can't overlook that entirely when considering what has to change.

[Zatman]

41 minutes ago, Phil Silvers said:

Feels like we miss SJM when he's out, feels like when Dougie is out we miss him too but I just do not like them together. I think we might have a better option at CDM in young Tim so that's what I'd try first. He hasn't had any experience  so throwing him straight in might be a push but he couldn't be any worse then Dougie on Saturday. Sanson can play that role too, I'd start Sanson and give TI 30 minutes.

We didn't miss SJM vs United though

[Bazmonkey]

midfield three needs to be a midfield five.

2 holding...better balance across the pitch.

 

[bobzy]

Play Ramsey, Sanson and McGinn.  Sack off having a "DM"/"holding midfielder" and have three central players who are energetic and can both hassle opponents and also move forward with the ball.

[sparrow1988]

48 minutes ago, bobzy said:

Play Ramsey, Sanson and McGinn.  Sack off having a "DM"/"holding midfielder" and have three central players who are energetic and can both hassle opponents and also move forward with the ball.

He'll have to do a bit more than shielding the ball with his arse and waiting for somebody to push him over to win a free kick then, because that's the only thing that he has being expending his energy on lately.

[TRO]

On 05/11/2021 at 14:11, Philosopher said:

So I think this is a little too simplistic.

For me Luiz is a dynamic 6. His best position 6 as a regista. So he won't simply sit, he will get further into midfield when we have the ball, and be our main distributor from deep, look for shooting opportunities, but get into position to screen the defense when without the ball, rather than press. His pressing isn't great.

Sanson is an 8 not simply a  box to box 8 he is more of a mezzala. Which is taking up positions to support the wide player (who is usually a playing as an auxiliary striker looking for goals like muller).

Ramsey is an 8 but rather than straightforward box 2 box he also exhibits playmaker qualities. Which is  a roaming playmaker. He could also probably play as a regista like luiz. Luiz could probably play roaming playmaker too.

Now McGinn is a curious one. When played as a 6 he plays as one of 2 6's as the most offensive of the 2. Sort of like a box 2 box coming from even deeper. Problem is he has to make longer runs as a result. He also has to come deeper, making it harder to support the attack. It also puts more emphasis on his decision making as a result. Problem is he is more of an instinctual than a clever player so he often leaves us exposed or without support going forward. This also affects how Cash and the right winger do their jobs, but that's a next discussion.

if you look at McGinn's positional history he started out as a DM. So he certainly knows what it takes to play there.  However his energy and all action style certainly suits the more dynamic always in the thick of things box 2 box role. For me you either tell him to be a proper DM or a proper box 2 box, don't halfway house him cos you're just f'ing with his head. 

Young is a fullback or wing back on either flank. Could play him as a left midfielder or right midfielder in a 442 as his auxiliary positions.

Buendia is a right midfielder. Not right forward! Not a number 10. Could be a central midfield playmaker if given the right midfield partners (athletic, energetic, and combative players that will do the dirty work and support him going forward).

Positions aren't as simple as such and such play this position. These days the roles players play in particular position is as contrasting as night and day. It's up to The manager to find the best way to use players that fits into the system, how they want to play, and that's complimentary to the players around them. Smith is making a hash of this at the minute.

 

 

What!!!!........whats Dynamic about Dougie, in that role.

[TRO]

On 14/02/2022 at 12:30, bobzy said:

Play Ramsey, Sanson and McGinn.  Sack off having a "DM"/"holding midfielder" and have three central players who are energetic and can both hassle opponents and also move forward with the ball.

well that would be a first.

[TRO]

On 14/02/2022 at 12:28, Bazmonkey said:

midfield three needs to be a midfield five.

2 holding...better balance across the pitch.

 

why because they are not good enough, to be a 3.

[TRO]

On 14/02/2022 at 11:58, The Fun Factory said:

And yet on paper JJ is getting rave reviews from the national media, McGinn seems to be constantly linked to United, and Luiz is almost a regular for Brazil. The parts are greater than the sum.

That what happens when .....appraisals are wrong or reports are wrong or quotes are wrong....He has played 9 times in 28 months for Brazil, is that regular?

Its more to do with the balance between them, than their individual quality.....The parts are arguably greater than the sum.....you can say that about most of the team.

[PaulC]

36 minutes ago, TRO said:

He has played 9 times in 28 months for Brazil, is that regular?

Fred has played more 

[VillaParkAvenue]

42 minutes ago, TRO said:

That what happens when .....appraisals are wrong or reports are wrong or quotes are wrong....He has played 9 times in 28 months for Brazil, is that regular?

Its more to do with the balance between them, than their individual quality.....The parts are arguably greater than the sum.....you can say that about most of the team.

Fans are often critical of players in the team they support. Spurs fans hate Spurs players, Juventus fans hate Juventus players and so on.

[OutByEaster?]

I'd be looking to try Luiz, Sanson and Ramsey - McGinn is behind those three in two key areas; mobility and passing ability.

It will be interesting to see what happens on Saturday - I think most people will be expecting one of McGinn or Luiz to be replaced by Sanson.

I think the change from McGinn to Sanson does more for us at the moment than the change from Luiz to Sanson. 

 

[sparrow1988]

8 minutes ago, OutByEaster? said:

I'd be looking to try Luiz, Sanson and Ramsey - McGinn is behind those three in two key areas; mobility and passing ability.

It will be interesting to see what happens on Saturday - I think most people will be expecting one of McGinn or Luiz to be replaced by Sanson.

I think the change from McGinn to Sanson does more for us at the moment than the change from Luiz to Sanson. 

 

Agree, replacing Luiz with Sanson leaves us in the same position in midfield if the plan is to try and keep the ball. Posession retention will greatly improve if Sanson and Luiz play together. Luiz and McGinn will be the same as Sanson and McGinn.

[VillaParkAvenue]

11 minutes ago, OutByEaster? said:

I think the change from McGinn to Sanson does more for us at the moment than the change from Luiz to Sanson. 

 

I would probably think the same, but Gerrard might have to consider the fans too. The general opinion seems to be Luiz should never wear a Villa shirt again so starting him would be a risk.

Also, Gerrard has been clear he sees McGinn as basically undroppable due to his ”steel”.

[The Fun Factory]

27 minutes ago, VillaParkAvenue said:

Fans are often critical of players in the team they support. Spurs fans hate Spurs players, Juventus fans hate Juventus players and so on.

That is quite a tiresome way to spend your leisure time imo