chrisp65 Posted April 17, 2020 Share Posted April 17, 2020 3 minutes ago, markavfc40 said: They are already showing deaths in all settings on the graph they put up but is is running 2 weeks behind. Deaths in hospitals are on day 32, deaths in all settings are on day 18. Looking at the current trajectory it is lower than only a Spain and US. But even those time lagged figures aren’t there yet. Article on the news now that care home deaths figure is a bit of a guess as most care homes aren’t getting tests and there’s an element of care staff presuming why people have died. They’re hoping to test more in car homes ‘soon’. But I wouldn’t mind betting not too soon to prolong the high figures. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markavfc40 Posted April 17, 2020 Share Posted April 17, 2020 25 minutes ago, chrisp65 said: But even those time lagged figures aren’t there yet. Article on the news now that care home deaths figure is a bit of a guess as most care homes aren’t getting tests and there’s an element of care staff presuming why people have died. They’re hoping to test more in car homes ‘soon’. But I wouldn’t mind betting not too soon to prolong the high figures. I am under no illusions they will do all they can to ensure we don't get the correct figures in a timely manner. In a couple more weeks though the UK figures for all settings are still likely to be 2 or 3k above what they are now though. I am not really sure what the relevance of comparing with others countries is other than to show we are currently not doing quite as bad as 3 or 4 countries. I wonder if they will regret having used it when we are behind only the US as appears will sadly be the case. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post blandy Posted April 17, 2020 Moderator Popular Post Share Posted April 17, 2020 1 hour ago, Stevo985 said: I don’t know the guy’s name who headed today’s presser, but he is the absolute worst at not answering questions. He literally answers nothing. It's deliberate. I mean the choice of numpties as ministers was deliberate. They (Johnson, Cummins and allies) had an obvious plan to "take control" (sorry) of Government as a small handful of individuals, to avoid almost all media interviews and requests, particularly ones where they'd get a detailed questioning, and having essentially pliant and / or useless ministers in the cabinet was part of that plan - no dissent, especially informed dissent from within. They also planned to tear up large parts of the civil service organisation. 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo985 Posted April 17, 2020 VT Supporter Share Posted April 17, 2020 13 minutes ago, blandy said: It's deliberate. I mean the choice of numpties as ministers was deliberate. They (Johnson, Cummins and allies) had an obvious plan to "take control" (sorry) of Government as a small handful of individuals, to avoid almost all media interviews and requests, particularly ones where they'd get a detailed questioning, and having essentially pliant and / or useless ministers in the cabinet was part of that plan - no dissent, especially informed dissent from within. They also planned to tear up large parts of the civil service organisation. It’s especially obvious when someone like Chris Whitty gets a question and he answers it directly, succinctly and states why he’s answered as he has. You sit up and think “Oh! That’s what it sounds like when someone actually answers!” 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markavfc40 Posted April 17, 2020 Share Posted April 17, 2020 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo985 Posted April 17, 2020 VT Supporter Share Posted April 17, 2020 1 minute ago, markavfc40 said: Yeah but it’s a worldwide shortage of tests 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markavfc40 Posted April 17, 2020 Share Posted April 17, 2020 Protesting against the governors stay at home order in Minnesota. Trump sent out a tweet earlier saying 'Liberate Minnesota' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HanoiVillan Posted April 17, 2020 Share Posted April 17, 2020 6 minutes ago, markavfc40 said: Protesting against the governors stay at home order in Minnesota. Trump sent out a tweet earlier saying 'Liberate Minnesota' I mean, they're idiots, but it's not clear that public opinion is anything like with them on this: Those numbers are from Michigan rather than Minnesota, but my priors would be that the same dynamics are on show in Minnesota as well. If anything, average Republicans seem to be taking it substantially more seriously than a couple of weeks ago. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markavfc40 Posted April 17, 2020 Share Posted April 17, 2020 1 minute ago, HanoiVillan said: I mean, they're idiots, but it's not clear that public opinion is anything like with them on this: Those numbers are from Michigan rather than Minnesota, but my priors would be that the same dynamics are on show in Minnesota as well. If anything, average Republicans seem to be taking it substantially more seriously than a couple of weeks ago. I was more highlighting that Trump is encouraging this kind of behaviour. Apparently there were a number of Trump 2020 flags being waved. Thankfully as you say it seems that the vast majority seem to be the ignoring the dangerous prat and are in support of the lock down restrictions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Awol Posted April 17, 2020 Popular Post Share Posted April 17, 2020 12 minutes ago, markavfc40 said: Protesting against the governors stay at home order in Minnesota. Trump sent out a tweet earlier saying 'Liberate Minnesota' I don’t feel sorry for them, I feel sorry for the nurses and doctors who might get sick treating them. 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HanoiVillan Posted April 17, 2020 Share Posted April 17, 2020 (edited) 25 minutes ago, markavfc40 said: I was more highlighting that Trump is encouraging this kind of behaviour. Apparently there were a number of Trump 2020 flags being waved. Thankfully as you say it seems that the vast majority seem to be the ignoring the dangerous prat and are in support of the lock down restrictions. Yeah, I agree with you that it's certainly concerning that he might undo all the progress that has been made with these tweets this afternoon. Edited April 17, 2020 by HanoiVillan 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjmooney Posted April 17, 2020 VT Supporter Share Posted April 17, 2020 17 minutes ago, HanoiVillan said: Those numbers are from Michigan rather than Minnesota, but my priors would be that the same dynamics are on show in Minnesota as well. If anything, average Republicans seem to be taking it substantially more seriously than a couple of weeks ago. Old people. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Awol Posted April 17, 2020 Share Posted April 17, 2020 23 minutes ago, HanoiVillan said: Yeah, I certainly agree with you that it's certainly concerning that he might undo all the progress that has been made with these tweets this afternoon. I’d say there’s an even more sinister undertone. He’s stoking his base into conflict with their state governors if they disagree with him. The more chaos he sows, the more ‘need’ there is for a strong leader. Trump is a wannabe autocrat all day and if he thought there was a chance to achieve it, no amount of dead Americans would put him off. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HanoiVillan Posted April 17, 2020 Share Posted April 17, 2020 16 minutes ago, Awol said: I’d say there’s an even more sinister undertone. He’s stoking his base into conflict with their state governors if they disagree with him. The more chaos he sows, the more ‘need’ there is for a strong leader. Trump is a wannabe autocrat all day and if he thought there was a chance to achieve it, no amount of dead Americans would put him off. I don't think it's 'sinister', necessarily, for a president to play off against governors he doesn't like or that have different politics. However, the specific situation is very much not 'business as usual' and you would hope for a bit more sense that ultimately everyone wants fewer bodies. Sadly, as you suggest, it isn't clear that Trump does want fewer bodies. What I don't understand is why he keeps picking fights with more popular governors from states he needs to win in November. Famously, Obama and Chris Christie hugged in the aftermath of Hurricane Sandy, and that ended up helping both out in their respective situations. People in Michigan seem to me to be unlikely to thank Trump for threatening not to provide their state with the ventilators they need. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowychap Posted April 17, 2020 Share Posted April 17, 2020 Beeb: Quote The World Health Organization has cast doubt on the usefulness of antibody tests for Covid-19. Many countries have indicated an intention to purchase millions of antibody tests, suggesting that people who are proven to have had the virus could be given "immunity passports" and would be able to return to work. The UK government has bought 3.5 million antibody tests, but has not yet found one that is reliable enough to use. But the WHO cautioned against investing too much in these tests. Speaking in Geneva, the WHO's Dr Maria van Kerkhove said there was "no evidence" that having had the virus would guarantee immunity. She said initial evidence did not suggest large numbers of people were developing antibodies after having the virus, meaning the chances of creating "herd immunity" were not high. We'll hear more over the weekend as the WHO issues guidance about the use of antibody tests. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCJonah Posted April 17, 2020 Share Posted April 17, 2020 2 hours ago, markavfc40 said: And it will be ignored. We are becoming so like America. Social media is full of Tory supporters, ready to shut down any criticism. I could never imagine being such a die hard supporter of a political party that I couldn't accept any criticism when there are so many blatant facts. Its crazy that people can push aside thousands of deaths each day in order to lash out at any criticism towards their party. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Demitri_C Posted April 17, 2020 Share Posted April 17, 2020 7 hours ago, snowychap said: Its unbelievable that the police are there and allowing this. Absolute morons 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HanoiVillan Posted April 17, 2020 Share Posted April 17, 2020 40 minutes ago, snowychap said: Beeb: Well, that's pretty frightening. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sharkyvilla Posted April 17, 2020 Share Posted April 17, 2020 2 minutes ago, Demitri_C said: Its unbelievable that the police are there and allowing this. Absolute morons Where's ISIS when you need them? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
terrytini Posted April 17, 2020 Share Posted April 17, 2020 The support for the Government over this issue isnt much less depressing than the actual virus. At least the virus will be gone one day. That people who think this has been handled well will apparently be in the majority doesnt bear thinking about. Im not after miracles, or fortune tellers, but a brief read of just this thread alone shows how much was known, and possible, at a far earlier stage. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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